Writers Notebook

Archived Messages from December 6, 2002 to Februrary 13, 2003

+Christi+

Cheri, do I ever know what you're talking about. Four years ago when I finally decided to get serious about writing (something I'd wanted to do since I learned to read), I wrestled with the same feelings of inadequacy regarding grammar (and vocabulary to be honest, but all writers wish for more, more, more!). I started to read voraciouly like I used to when time was freer, studying the classics as well as modern writers, and I couldn't get enough books on writing. And I tried to keep writing.
I don't think there's anything like reading to enlarge a vocabulary even if you already have an expansive vocabulary. And on grammer, try to notice when you're unsure grammatically, and pay attention to the next book you read (or even the posts of people you trust) and I'll bet you'll spot the answer there! That said, I don't think a class could be anything but a good thing. Heck, I'd like to go back to school for a few classes once my son starts going to school! Good luck, I know you'll figure it out.

Randall, Judging from your passionate description I'd say you HAVE created a real person. I can see her mighty well from that description. BTW, I adore Winston Churchill. Now that's a man.

Welcome back, Ramon! Have you aged so much in such a short period of time? Drop the house chores and pick up a pen; it'll take years off! The chores will always be there when you're done.
P.S. Still into wrestling?

Debra, I think your presentation is great. I don't know about guaranteeing success for every person who reads Sweetie, but I know nothing about presentations of this nature; maybe exaggeration is crucial to getting what you want. Anyway there is no doubt about the passion you have for this subject. I don't see why this should not happen for you. Good luck!

Mel, I'm so glad! Your excitement has rubbed off once again. Made my writing all the easier today--I did 650 words! I think you'd be an excellent shortie mistress if you ever had the time for it. You COULD give us one for Friday ... ? ! If no one wants to take that position maybe each one of us could take a turn and give an assignment for a given Friday (or Mondays, whatever people like best). I'm sure someone would volunteer each week--would have a spur of the moment inspiration for an assignment/shortie. Anyone? Anyone? Beuller?

Teekay, You know Mel's right on the money on that don't you? I feel lucky that I get to read your stuff for free, because one day it's going to cost pullllllenty! Bird by Bird will inspire you fiercely, go girl! I think the way Anne Lamott puts it is you only have to write enough to fill a one-inch picture frame.

Pamela, For that matter there are a ton of closet writers who never are discovered, who lock their manuscripts away in a trunk until the day they die. I wonder if those writers just don't care to be published and do it for the love, or if they are terrified of the thought of someone else reading their writing. Showing people my writing used to rank right up there with public speaking, but thanks to the folks here I'm pretty much over it.
P.S. Interview with Darkness. Cool!

Jerry, Pamela reminded me of how you had to arrest your friend for being a serial rapist. I think there's a novel in that story. You could change things enough to avoid a lawsuit, you could! But listen, you had me riveted. Couldn't have ripped me away from my screen for love or money during that tale.

Howard, You must be a hobbit. Second breakfast, I love it! And holy crap, that's thirty six years since you've seen the guy! How did you recognize him?

Randall, I gotta find out what happens in this installment later; hubby just walked in and has that 'will she ever get off that damn thing' look on his face. I don't blame him either; I wrote (and internetted) from 7:00 till 10:30 last night. Better go make up. :D

Bye guys,

Christi 2-12-2003 21:44

Synchronicity from Pamela:
(Not for assignment, this just happened)

My book is calling me and I was just reading through the rough draft, written too many years ago with some changes between then and now, and I found a single page I didn't remember writing. We have just been talking about the villian's point of view and that is what was on this page. I have mentioned the dialogues and now I remember that I wrote this with the idea that the Darkness would speak directly to the reader from time to time. This was written years ago but I won't do any editing, tell me what you think (It's kind of creepy but remember that it's not really me and that the views of the Darkness are not my own):

"Darkness Speaks"

Well, we don't see anything so wrong with being dark, I mean, everyone has a right to their own existence, don't they, bad as well as good? What would all the good people do without us, tell me that, or the whole world, for that matter? If things were good all the time, then it wouldn't be good, it would just be mediocre, it would be the norm, you would have nothing to compare anything to. So we're doing the world a favor, really, silly humans always seem to need something to struggle against anyway, don't know why they can't just be ignorant and happy like the animals are. Besides, hee, hee, hee, it's just so damn fun to be bad. There's lots of us around, you know, making people do all kinds of crazy things, you've heard us spoken of many times. People say stuff like "I don't know what got into me" or "I wasn't myself" or, one of our favorites, "the devil made me do it." Not that there's really a devil, of course, not with the pitchfork and tail and all that, we're more of an intangible force. It's human nature that personifies us, like they do with their God image, this nice old man sitting on a throne in the sky watching every sparrow that falls, please! Animals know about the forces, both good and bad, but humans, in their incredible vanity, must create fantasies in images of themselves. Oh, we like the myth of the devil and the fires of hell and all, it's so quaint. Silly people don't even realize that we create hells for them right here on earth. Hitler was a great favorite of ours, oh, the wonderful cruelty perpetrated back then, it was glorious to behold! We're around on a smaller scale too, of course, like when people commit suicide, when they screw their best friend's wife, when they abuse their children, when society glorifies guns and violence, when people drink or drug themselves to death, stuff like that. You disapprove, I suppose, but that just shows how stupid you are. You don't even know how much fun you are missing, you just don't see at all how grand it can be to be Darkness.

Pamela 2-12-2003 21:02

Randall

Well, what the hell. The site is kinda slow tonight.

LaMorte de Tiki

WHERE THE ROCKS COVER THE FLOWERS by Randall Henderson

"Matt and Tiki eventually left Burrowing Coyote and returned to Tiki and Joseph's old homesite. They built a small rock hogan on the ruins of Tiki's home. It was now fronted by an immense, fresh water lake. Robert had topsoil hauled to the site and transplanted aspen, pine and spruce trees along the shoreline. They enjoyed a happy existence there for many years, fishing and gardening.

Eighteen years after emergence, an aging Tiki stepped outside one summer morning with her fishing nets to discover Matt dead. He had died from a heart attack and was in his favorite chair facing the lake. She knelt painfully by his side, kissed his hand and wept for she knew her life was to be one of loneliness.

However, a gentle hand touched her shoulder. The sun blinded her weak eyes as she looked up. Her vision cleared and she observed a tall robed figure standing before her.

"Tiki my child, have you forgotten my teachings so quickly?" Hassam asked gently.

Tiki stood painfully, torn between joy at seeing her old master and knowing Matt was dead.

"Hassam, it has been a long time my friend."

Hassam chided her. "Only yesterday sweet child of man. But you have forgotten my instructions."

Tiki wiped her eyes on her shawl and nodded sadly. "Yes, I suppose so. I have forgotten many things with age wise one."

Hassam laughed. "That's okay daughter, because *Weay Linn awaits. New lessons and adventures will be mastered." Hassam said happily. "We will have companionship this time Star Tiki."

"Companions, Hassam?"

"Oh yes Tiki, you're time is now. Come with me through the doorway of transmigration. In a month or so we will meet our companions high in the snow capped Andes Mountains above the wide, green Pacific Ocean."

Tiki managed a brief smile. "Who will journey with us Hassam and where will we go?"

Hassam indicated Matt's lifeless body. "Matt is now fulfilling certain responsibilities to Jehovah, but he will be there when we arrive. Joseph and a dog with the impossible name Run Run will be at our rendezvous as well. I thought perhaps a stroll under the Pacific to the Isle of Stone Men might be in order. After that who knows, perhaps Cathay?"

Tiki walked away with Hassam. When she turned for one more look at Matt she gasped. Her own lifeless body lay next to him. She sank to her knees sobbing and covered her face with her hands.

Hassam shook his head, then cleared his throat. "Really my child. This is no time for tears. Your youth is restored, you are with me. Why are you sad Star Tiki Wou?"

"For Matt, for Robert, for me. I don't know," Tiki wailed.

He kneeled in the sand beside her resting a lean arm across her shoulder. "You're sad because of uncertainty. The future isn't clear, for the first time in your life the next moment will be a surprise."

She wiped her tears and angrily looked at him. "What should I be happy about old windbag guide of mine?"

Hassam looked offended. "Why, you should rejoice. We are not leaving Matt. We are going to him and Joseph and that dog with the funny name. Robert and Andrea will join us one day. You have shed that old husk of flesh and are now glorified for His purpose. We will educate you and send you back one day as a bright shining new baby." He grinned at her. "Boy or girl, your choice."

He helped Tiki stand. As they walked along the shore he gestured grandly with his right hand. "I too have known turmoil and the shock of death. Did I ever tell you about the time I was thrown from the wall of Jerusalem during the First Crusade?"

Through her tears Tiki smiled up at him. "No, I don't believe so."

Hassam shifted his walking staff, resting it on a robed shoulder. "Took three armored French knights with me as I fell. There was a resounding crash as we bounced off the rocks below and into eternity. I remember how blue the sky and managed to turn my head before entering death. A young blonde headed knight was lying alongside. He glared at me and gasped 'Infidel' as he died. Can you imagine anyone, calling Hassam, infidel?"

A youthful Tiki laughed at the image.

Two months later they were deep in Weay Linn and headed west with Run Run and Hassam happily leading the way. Tiki walked contentedly with Matt and Joseph on either side.

Tiki smiled. All was."

Since Tiki has BOTH her husbands with her after death and the DOG Run Run as well...I guess you can take it with you.

(Grin)

Randall

*Weay Linn are immense tunnels that stretch from South America to Asia. They are a part of numerous South American Indian legends.

Randall 2-12-2003 20:45

RANDALL

Evening...

We have discussed words per day. For some reason when I was writing "Flowers." I kept track of the day and word count. I kicked the novel off in the September of 1997

5,862 words--------------------11-30-98
9,449--------------------------12-05-98
13,684-------------------------12-08-98
16,711-------------------------12-12-98
18,489-------------------------01-01-99
26,682-------------------------01-03-99
28,559-------------------------01-06-99
37,134-------------------------01-09-99
40,833-------------------------01-10-99
43,921-------------------------01-17-99
48,985-------------------------01-21-99
61,364-------------------------01-24-99
70,611-------------------------01-29-99
77,017-------------------------02-06-99
82,254-------------------------02-14-99
85,665-------------------------02-20-99
85,956-------------------------02-28-99
91,227-------------------------04-07-99
93,283-------------------------04-22-99
95,651-------------------------06-03-99
98,150-------------------------10-03-99
100,601------------------------02-13-00
109,587------------------------06-01-00
116,796------------------------07-10-00
120,929------------------------11-23-00
133325-------------------------11-24-00
133494-------------------------02-12-03

So you can see I haven't done a lot lately. However, I have rewritten, deleted and added...so the word count may not reflect recent labors. As you note...some of the three day totals are awesome. That is when I would plant my buns in a chair early in the morning...arise only for food and bathroom and pound the keys till bedtime. (Sure Debbie and I had a lot of problems about then, but it couldn't have been the writing. Right?) You see my friends, and I'm sure you are the same way, I never had to plan the story. It just came out.

Stress test okay, meet with the Sawbones Monday.

Randall

Randall 2-12-2003 20:22

Howard, I'm a big believer in synchronicities (meaningful coincidences). If your gut tells you to do something, do it! There are so many places we're meant to be at a certain time, it's a shame not to honor those urges and miss out on something special.

I've got an interesting writing assignment for you. Write a short piece about the time(s) that a synchronicity marked a turning point for you. It's fun and revealing and may remind you of something siginificant you should pay more attention to!

Sunny 2-12-2003 17:21

CHERIE -- Your local bookstore, (especially Borders) should definitely be aware of writer groups in your area. They're for the most part helpful, though you do occasionally run into one started by a wannabe who's just looking to gain attention. They can be unpleasant.

I had a pleasant surprise this morning! I stopped at a local restaurant for second breakfast, sat for a minute in the parking lot, debating on whether I really had time for this, then went on in.
Once inside, I spotted a guy I'd been in the service with over in Germany, whom I hadn't seen since September 1966! It was great talking with him and his wife. Gotta do that again!
Especially the second breakfast part...

howard 2-12-2003 16:26

Wow, so much inspiration, Carol, 1550 words in one day, that's FABULOUS, Christi, your assignment has inspired me to finish the promised houseplan so I can get back to my writing. Today I got two elevations done in pencil on graph paper (which is how the whole plan is done), yesterday I did a somewhat rough but recognizeable perspective drawing, now I just have to make ink copies OF everything and send them off, then it's back to my characters who are, thankfully, starting to make a lot of noise in my head.

I'd like to say something about published vs. unpublished, which is mentioned from time to time. In my opinion, whether a writer is published or not has absolutely NOTHING to do with how good he or she is. Besides talent, there is always an element of luck involved too and goodness knows, there are tons of talented, creative people out there who never get the recognition they deserve. Look at past artists and writers who labored in obscurity and died in poverty who are now recognized as masters. A man won a Pulitzer several years ago for a book that had been rejected 13 times (how could he stand to keep sending it out?). So if you are unpublished, you are in very good company and it IN NO WAY reflects on your talents, I have read some really good stuff in here from those who haven't been lucky enough to trip over the publishing pot like I did (a matter of being in the right place, meeting the right person, etc.).

Hi to Ramon and also to Cheri, sorry I haven't greeted you yet. I agree your vocabulary sounds good but if you want to improve it, you might start jotting down words you encounter in your own reading and looking them up later. Sometimes you can infer what they mean, but with writing them down and defining them, you can add them to your own repertoire. I think there are few people of any age who really know what they want to be when they grow up. Debra, your presentation sounds good, you might want to throw a few statistics in there for good measure. Jerry, how awful for a friend of yours to end up being the rapist, how could your other friends look askance at you for arresting his ass, would they expect you to look the other way just because you knew him? Richard, checked out your site, I love your photo of yourself, it looks so film noir. Congratulations on your new baby girl, what a wonderful distraction, watching a new person growing and discovering the world.

It is just galling to think about what Jack and now Randall are going through (sorry!), hope recoveries are swift, sure and relatively pain-free. I got stapled once too and it looks so wierd, like a zipper across your tummy.

Pamela 2-12-2003 16:09

Hi All :-)

CHRISTI: YAAAAAARGHHHHHHHHH, oh no! What a horrible feeling. (This is in regard to the terse letter - in case you're wondering)

HOWARD: You sent off a manuscript? I must have missed a post somewhere along the line. Good on you!

Well well well, if it isn't RRRRRRRRRRRRRROGER, er, I mean RAMON. Welcome back :-)

And BEN, I forgot to mention BEN, and GARIESS. There are big dark holes in the places they used to occupy here.

MEL:Oh....*sniff* Thankyou. :-S (weak and tremorous smile)

JERRY: It's ghosts he's looking at.
I challenge you to write a flash fiction about that one. 1000 words or less. (if you're in the mood)

DEBRA: Same advice to you - don't imagine the Governor naked.
I wish you all the very best with it.

CHRISTI: I think it's almost time to immerse myself in Bird by Bird. I'm pretty sure that'll do it. I keep remembering the part about writing only as far as you can see, or something along those lines.
Maybe remembering isn't the most appropriate words.

Pencil sharpeners to the ready..........................

GO!

Teekay 2-12-2003 16:02

Mel:

Thank you. I found a few more typos and took out some (its).

Carol:

It's okay. Thank you!

Debra 2-12-2003 15:08

**Mel**

Hi, you-all! What a great bunch of inspiring and inspired writers! :-}

DEBRA: Excellent content! A few typos or missing words, I expect you'll catch. (Is this an oral prsentation?) Be careful of your usage of the word "it." In adjacent sentences, "it" refers to different things and can get confusing - better to put in the word "it" stands for, in most cases. Sounds like a final sentence might be missing to wrap it all together... Good luck with this! Your Sweetie is such an important book!!! :-]

TINA: Any chance of inventing a Chocolate-flavored wine? :-P

CAROL: 1555! 1555!!!!! My muse just fainted. She's been partying way too much and can't remember what REAL work is like. You go, girl! :-)

CHERI: Chicken soup for you, too. And tea. And OJ. At least, if you're not up to writing, you can listen to soothing or inspirational music and maybe write mentally until the music puts you to sleep. Sleep's the best medicine - feel better soon! re: writing/school. Consider a double major. You can do accounting while you're polishing your writing techniques. There are also some great grammar/punctuation sites on the 'net. Start with JACK's links off the webwitch.com page. For vocabulary, read, read, read, and use my trick: consult your thesaurus regularly or whenever the words you write seem dull to you - find replacement words!

RICHARD: I would love to submit the first 3-4 chapters soon... The problem is, I keep changing the nature of the first 3-4 chapters! New beginning scenes, new characters, new POVs. For I am attempting to write one of those highly discouraged forms for a new writer (not that I'm new, just unpublished) - a layered story, like a person looking at a picture of a person looking at a picture of a person looking at a picture... And my polishing techniques are rather slow (I hear TINA, HALLEE and BEN murmering "THAT's an understatement!" as my editing for myself is even slower than for others - oh boy, am I in trouble!). I've only been working on this--my first--novel for...um, ah, MANY years! It's had plenty of timeouts in the closet to convince me it all needs major re-working! Thanks for your helpful thoughts on the matter! :-)

SUNNY: Punctuation is fun. It's also so easy to over-use. I do it myself all the time! :-{ Take a period to lunch. Leave the rest home for occasional treats. BTW, I need every one of your organizing books!!!

TEEKAY: Dinner with the Mad Hatter?!!! Oh ho - stop it! I'm at work and laughing--no, bellowing--out loud is NOT polite to my adjacent cubicle dwellers! You are too funny! Keep at it. :-] BTW, there SHOULD be a bidding war over your novel - get it out there, for real, you crazy/crazed, talented writer! (I'm going to laugh all day at your clever wit - what a way with words! heee haaaaaaaaa hooooooo!!! You, like RANDALL, should be writing humor pieces for magazines, at least, and giving everyone such great lifts in their day! :-)

JACK: Keep healing!!!

RHODA: A (((HUG))) to you too, just because. Are you still working on that Highland historical novel? :-) I love those settings.

CHRISTI: Um, I think we're identical. I write skimpy first drafts, just to get the basic plot down, then every time I re-read, I add in needed character details, setting descriptors, etc., etc. And if I don't escape this "try a new beginning-again" trend, I'm going to have enough characters and story concepts to write a Library of Congress-full of books! Although your 500-word assignment took me through, I hope, the last new beginning I need to begin re-telling my story! :-) And I spent last eve., while not official writing, sorting outline plotnotes and realized I need a comprehensive timeline for my 6-book series where events intertwine so I can keep the first book on track! I'm getting closer to continuing the next draft! :-) re: a steady something for writing inspiration here... hmm, your "give me 500" challenge spurred many of us into action. If we get shorty night up and running again and maybe some other inspirations sprinkled through the weeks (variety is best!), we may all turn into regular writers yet! :-]

How about it, folks? What shall we do for shorty night tomorrow??? A poem/paragraph using words that start with the letters in your first name? Maybe too intense... A character sketch using only actions, no other descriptors? I don't know...any other ideas??? MARY, where are you???!!!

RANDALL: Forgive my memory skipping a groove. I STILL adore your story elements. :-] And that Churchill quote is priceless! I think I'm somewhere between the writing being a mistress and a master... If it ever becomes the tyrant, my family will not appreciate Mom turning into the HULK so she can get her daily writing DONE!

RAMON: Welcome back! Stay! Pull up a pen and write about the longest writer's winter you ever had (that is, the longest dry spell without writing). :-] I commiserate but I'm looking for my writer's Spring now!

Okay! Okay! I'm going...! Y'all, write well today, and report back here tomorrow! I need your inspirations!

Mel 2-12-2003 14:04

Hi All :)

I knew I’d get burned naming names based off my memory! My apologies TINA – you are the author of the Arizona piece. So it is to TINA, I say, good job!

CHERI – your question is one I’d say we’ve all had to struggle with at one point or another. As someone else said, only you can make the right decision for you. I’ll just tell you my decision with the matter. When I decided to pursue my writing seriously, I took a variety of online classes. Some free, some for a small charge. I did avoid the ones I couldn’t afford. I ran into good teachers and some not so good. The same ratio you’d find in any school. I’ve also attend a couple of writing conferences hosted by our state university that were very helpful. All of these gave me a basis of the basic rules of writing and the inspiration to keep going. While I can understand and fully appreciate a desire to have a back-up profession, that just isn’t practical in my life. So I’ve got no choice but to make the writing work – somehow! Follow your heart and your instincts, that’s the best advice I can give. {{hug}} Just ran across your post on vocabulary – I’m not sure what you mean by it being a problem. Your posts here don’t show any weakness that I can discern. Perhaps your vocabulary is simply your unique "voice".

SUNNY – I can’t agree with you that your contribution to this world is "small". Your spirit comes through your postings and you do indeed bring "Sunshine" to the site. (btw- my favorite "Sunny/Sunshine" was my very first german shepherd. She lived up to her name very well too!)

JACK – you take care and be well too!

CHRISTI – I’m not worried about all the changes I keep making. I just keep reminding myself that I’m still an apprentice in this great journey and I’m learning with every change I make. I think I did spot a cherub dancing out of the corner of my eye. I’m like you too in first drafts, and second, and well, I’m up to 6 at the moment. I’ve tried working with an actual outline, but that just isn’t the route for me. I do know each version gets just that much stronger, so I’m not going to worry about it – yet. Yesterday’s word count all got put into a letter to the Senators. Two pages, single spaced on the VA problems. I’m getting good at getting their attention though!

RANDALL – awww! Well, let’s see, what can I suggest to help you get that story finished?? Umm, ever think of the series angle? Flowers is fantasy if I remember right and serial fantasy books sell nicely. Or should I just accuse you of being a perfectionist and leave it at that? Hehehe {hug} Good luck with the future surgery. Strange, Jack and you with gall bladders, then my Mom mentioned hers this past weekend – is it gall bladder season??

RAMON – hello, its nice to meet you! Good luck with getting back into the groove of writing. Write whatever you can, whenever. Each word brings you that much closer to your goal, and your dreams.

DEBRA – I honestly don’t feel qualified to comment on your speech to the Governor. But I wish you the greatest of luck in getting this pushed through and into the school rooms.

Time to see how many words I can add to the story today ------ have a good one everybody!

Carol 2-12-2003 13:53

This is what I'm going to say to our Govenor when I meet him this month. Let me know what it might need.

One of our now infamous ex-presidents stated that domestic violence is the largest killer of adult women in the United States and should be fought as aggressively as any other life-threatening disease. Although, I don’t know off hand the narrow definition of a disease, I do know the broad one, getting it will it will adversely change your life or end it and everyone is susceptible. That describes domestic violence perfectly. Domestic violence then can be described as a chronic and often fatal disease. If there were a safe vaccine we would all be getting it. There is one and it is education. There is a problem only a few people are receiving the education or vaccine only after they get the disease? Even more numbers are getting the disease and still getting no education at all.

The best time to get this vaccine is when you are in high school. There are three huge reasons for that. One, high school is where this disease first starts. The second one is high school students are like ripened tomatoes. They are at their peak to receive information. After high school it goes down. The third is with this disease whether you get it personally or a loved one gets it you’re affected. Plus it occurs in same sex relationships and though it is seldom reported women are capable of abusing their husbands too. That’s everybody.

Simply put Vaccines are only useful when they are received. They are only useful when they penetrate the patient and become part of them. What good is a vaccine if the needle is the size of a table leg and it can’t penetrate the patient? Sweetie is directed at the patient. Once any person reads sweetie they understand everything they read. It’s an absolute impossibility not to. After reading sweetie the person will understand the most important facts about this disease like a professional would. They will be protected for life. Most educational books on domestic violence aren’t given to people until after they become victims. It has been proven it is far too late at that point. Most books on domestic violence are clinical, technical or testimonial. That information while being accurate most times doesn’t penetrate the reader at all. Most books can be compared to that vaccine with the needle the size of chair leg. It can’t penetrate the patient or make it far too painful to receive at all.

Sweetie has taken all the most important facts about domestic violence and turned them into digestible and pleasant vaccine. The only thing left to do it make this vaccine mandatory. By doing that we can make Rhode Island not only the first state but the leader in eradicating the leading cause of death in adult women in the United States. If we leave it voluntary, people only get it after they get the disease or not get it all. In short nothing will change even though the cure has come. The reason why it’s the leading cause of death in so many reflects this little known fact. Even if this year a person is strong, vibrant and resistant to this atrocity it is no guarantee that they will stay that way. There are so many highs and lows in one person’s lifetime. It’s just one of those facts we can’t escape. Making it mandatory will protect everyone for every year they are alive.

There’s more. When we see a person who has been hurt in an accident of some kind we see a victim. Many people will be called upon to help a family member or loved one who is trapped in domestic violence. More often then not, they do nothing to help. That’s because they don’t see a victim. For every person who becomes protected they will also become a person who will finally see a victim. When people see a victim, they will help. Domestic violence is so prevalent because not enough people realize these people are trapped by their own humanity and really need help. So if we can call sweetie the vaccine, we can also call it the vaccine that cures in two ways. It prevents the person from becoming infected at the same time creates a person who can help those who become infected.

Debra 2-12-2003 12:53

HOWARD: I’ve looked at the library and unless it just isn’t advertised very well, they don’t have a local writer’s group. Believe me, I looked when I was AT the library and I looked on their web site as well. I do need to check at the local bookstore and perhaps at the nearby Borders. The community college offers courses however I’m a little strapped for cash and time at the moment. I could probably get unemployment to pay for the Accounting courses, but I’m a little doubtful about the writing courses.

CHRISTI: Yes, I know what they say about opinions! I guess the reason I feel I need to take a course is that I feel I lack the knowledge for grammar, vocabulary, and possibly punctuation as well. Of course, in this day and age, with the use of MS Word and spell check, the grammar and punctuation aren’t much of a problem. The vocabulary however could be a major weakness. Let me know what you think about that would you?

JERRY: It’s been at least ten years since I took those courses. I probably know more about operating computers now than I did then but you are right about the accounting software. I work for a bank and they don’t use any of the latest software (which most employers ask that you be familiar with). Also, I’m not sure that the credits I earned would still be accepted!

I guess I'm just not sure of what I want to be "when I grow up"!

Cheri 2-12-2003 10:42

Gariess:

Could you email me. I don't seem to have your address any more. I need to speak to you today.

Debra 2-12-2003 10:12

RAMON: I know where you're coming from. I did the same thing. It is hard to get going again. I started small, first writing a little in a journal. I promised to write everyday. That hasn't happened yet but I have been writing at least every other day. I also picked up to books that have helped me to become more inspired. Also, visiting here is the BIGGEST incentive to keep going!

The people here are great! I've tried a number of times to find something similar elsewhere on the net and have failed miserably.

The books I mentioned are "If You Can Talk, You Can Write" by Joel Saltzman and "A Writer's Workbook" by Caroline Sharp. Some of their ideas are very similar and both are inspiring. If I need a boost to start writing, all I need to do is read a chapter or two of either book and I can feel the juices being to flow!

One thing I do daily is stop in here and read all the posts. I may not post myself, but I lurk every single day!

Good luck and keep going!

Cheri 2-12-2003 9:13

Hello one and all. Back when I was a little bit younger and considerably less stressed I used to visit here quite often. It even got me back into writing again and I made some friends along the way. Of course so much time has passed since I last posted a message so no doubt most of you still here would have forgotten me which is good since we can reaquaint from scratch. On the off the chance that I am lodged somewhere in the cerbellum I have this quote from the sensational rock bank "Creed":-

"Hello my friends we meet again,
Its been a while, where should we begin?
Feels like forever."

I have to admit I have done the worse thing a writer can do - stop. Now I am finding it hard to get back on track and the stress at work and the non stop attention my house needs, I find I just do not have the energy. But I'll give it ago.

I've been flicking through some of the chats people have been having and I see nothing has changed; interesting people engaged in stimulating and controversial conversation topics, whilst finding the time to encourage and inspire fellow writers.

God I have missed this place. Will make more of an effort to visit more.

Take care whatever you do, wherever you go, and whoever you're with.

RAMON

Ramon 2-12-2003 8:21

Jon - Cat Question for you. As you may or may not be aware, a cat now owns me. His name is Smoky and since acquiring me and the wife, he has grown for a little speck that fit in the palm of my hand to a large grey house cat and shows some distant relations to a Siamese cat.

What I want to know is this. Watching my new owner, I find that, from time to time, he looks around the room and focuses on something in the room, but when I look, there is nothing there. What the hell is he seeing? What can cats see that we poor people cannot?

Just wondering, maybe you can take it up with Pussy, who's been noticeably absent on this recent return, and let me know.

Thanks

Jerry (filling the notebook) 2-12-2003 0:06

Just noticed that the television that I leave running when I'm doing things like posting on the Notebook has some real Godfother like men testifying before Congress. I stopped for a bit to see who these thugs were and was amazed to find that it was the director's of the FBI and the CIA.

That's frightening, and the way they are testifying, they sound much like Marlon Brando did in the Godfather too.

Both are tough looking. That's good I guess I'd much rather have a couple of tough looking charcters in those offices then some pansy assed civil servant wh has never worked a day in intelligence or law enforcement.

Jerry (Yet AGAIN) 2-11-2003 23:58

Someone I forget who now, was struggling with their villain. I thought of this and knew I had read somewhere about an author doing this very same thing. This author invented one of the worst buggy men who ever haunted millions of dreams in recent years, Hannibal Lector.

If you have access to his latest book, The Red Dragon, the forward delves into this very problem, and I think he did a nice job of explaining how he wrestled his villains into line.

Jerry 2-11-2003 23:53

RANDALL

Evening friends...

Thank you Jon for the award. And yes I know Portugal is the most powerful nation on the earth. 1. because they are not waging war with anyone, this indicates how smart you guys are ... 2. I understand their women are gorgeous, (AND INTELLIGENT!) high on my list ...3. Americo resides there and 4. it is well known in academic circles that the citizens of Portugal are descendants of the Atlantis survivors! Way to go Jon!!! BTW...got any hidden power crystals left over? You know, from the old days, before the earthquake and flood?

Christi :-) ... let me tell you about Ms. Star Tiki Ney! :-) She is a bitch in the purest form! She entered my dream many years ago and has sent me down the path of incessant literary pursuit. :-) A hard-hearted, browbeater! She haunts me ... daily. I see women I imagine as Tiki...have spent hours thinking of her and what she might do... and wondered if I created a real person? Tiki is a people user, willful to a fault, bull-headed, obstinate, arrorgant, way too powerful and of course ... beautiful. Naturally!

Thank you Pamela for the kudos. I slave over the book and wonder for what purpose? Reference the above paragraph about Tiki and her slave driver ways!!!

Mel we have discussed this before. It is possible that we were and/or influenced on levels of thought unknown to us. I tried to make Tiki as human as possible yet the center of a great deal of supernatural power. Stunning power that is available when she needs it. Otherwise Tiki is as human as the rest of us ... except ... DNA tests indicat she is a descendant down through her grandfather and father versus the usual female genetic links. (As is Robert, her only son.)

(Pause)

I'm debating whether to get into this DNA thingee now and where I got the idea. There are a lot of things in "Flowers" that might offend some folks. Heather pointed this out to me last year and I deleted the possible inflammatory material. This could fall into that area...

Carol...I am incapable of finishing "Flowers." Every time I sit down and dial it up, I think of something else to add and add and add. Heather has or had problems with my ss submission to P. Simply, I cram everything I can into the story.

Great advise Richard! Really. I agree. There comes a time to let it go, I just wish someone would tell me when!!! :-) I like this quote... "Writing is an adventure. To begin with, it is a toy and an amusement. Then it becomes a mistress, then it becomes a master, then it becomes a tyrant. The last phase is that just as you are about to be reconciled to your servitude, you kill the monster and fling him to the public."

Winston Churchill

Jack...any advice? My gall bladder will soon be only a memory! Maybe Friday or early next week.

A last word... GOL DURN IT!!! Well, three words. My Tiki post last night was all screwed up. I messed up the format and it looked like a glob of words. For those of you who read it, many thanks for working your way through the mess. I'll add an additional segment later on ... (a thought) ... might I serialize it here? Hmmmmmmmmmmm...

Good night

Randall

Randall 2-11-2003 23:11

Cheri - If you go back to college and take accounting back up, things may have changed so much that you wouldn't recognize the accounting you took in the past. I guess I don't know when you took accounting but the computer age has changed so rapidly and along with it I'm sure that accounting software has gone the same way.

I went back to college, and while not on my own decision but that of Workers Comp, when I was in my mid 40's and had a wonderful time, I absolutely loved every second of it, and managed a 4.0 GPA on during the entire two year period, including my two month internship with a District Court Judge acting as his paralegal. Education is so very rewarding and something you should surely consider.

In addition to full time, there is, of course part time college, as well as online courses, some free some that cost, others that are actually through an accredited college. A bit of online research will show you what's available out there.

Jerry 2-11-2003 22:32

Hey ya'll! Just going to jump right in.

But ... Heather!!! Some of us are tinkerers with a purpose! My first drafts are skimpy on detail and other crucial things. I'm one of those weirdos who goes back over and edits again and again and again until I have a story worth sending out. Sometimes I have the barest outline of a story--it's not even close to jumping off the page yet. Each time I go over it I'm breathing a little more life into that outline. And then there are those times I restart a story fresh with a brand new concept, maybe even a different protagonist, and I'll do this three or four times before I hit gold. Hard way to write. It just seems to be what works for me. And there's not one of us here who's methods are identical--it's as individual as your fingerprints.

YAY MEL!!!!!!! You are inspiring me more with every word! I'd like to come up with a steady something, something that everyone could feel good about. Any ideas?

Howard, Forgot to say ATTA BOY for sending off that manuscript! I'm crossing every ligament possible for you.
Speaking of submitting, does anyone here have any stories they'd like to share? Man it's tough. I quit keeping track after number 30. I've been waiting for three manuscripts that have been "out there" for coming on four months. One of the markets was an anthology collecting stories about fathers and daughters, and when I checked their website I saw that they had chosen the book cover and had a publishing date (next month). It pissed me off so badly that they had never even sent me a rejection so that I would know I hadn't made the cut, so I whipped off a terse note saying I was wondering when they were planning to get back to me on my story (knowing full well it was all over), and guess what? I got an equally terse note in my email box stating that they were still considering my manuscript for the collection. AGH! Foot in mouth, when will I ever get rid of the taste of musty tennis shoe?

Carol, Don't worry about changing your openings! As I said above I do the exact same thing. Nice to see I'm not the only one. One of these will stick and you'll be happy with it and cherubs will dance and angels will sing. It ain't over till it's over. :) I haven't had a 1500 word day in some time; nice one! Oh, and that was Tina's Arizona piece. See what namin' names does for ya? Heh heh.

Get well soon, Cheri! NO one can answer the question you're asking but you. And I don't believe you need college classes to become a great writer, or I'd be signing up for them yesterday. I think classes can be very helpful but there's nothing like writing to make you a better writer. This is only my opinion and you know what they say about those.

Awesome, Richard! I've never felt so inspired to write as I do now after reading all these wonderful posts.

Sunny's back! It's so nice to have you here again. I just knew it would be that way, once published. We can't ever as human beings give ourselves credit for what we've done, only for what we're going to do, eh? Maybe that's the way our brains work to cause us to continue to strive for more.
I loved what you said about the pleasure of the journey. I've heard it said from just about every author I admire that that is where the true joy is found. It's hard to remember when you're a stuggling writer with goals and dreams, but publishing really is the tedious part. But the creation ... Wow.

Rachel and Sunny, I guess I'm not alone in my fear of public speaking. I've heard that it's the number one fear period. But the thought makes me want to pass out or barf or something. You've got guts of steel, Rachel! I could learn much from you two about accepting speaking as a necessary part of writing.

Teekay, Me too! That's exactly what it's like! You're thinking to yourself, Wow these people have no idea I've gone stark raving mad right in front of their eyes. But the jig'll be up when they notice the unfocused eyes and the facial spasms and the drooooooool.

Welcome back, Jack!

Rhoda, I'm afraid I left you out in the naming of names. Now I'm kneeling before you and blubbering for forgiveness. You were on my mind but apparently I hit fast forward. Glad the gang's all here.

Orf to write! May all of you have a writerly and/or wonderful day. Thanks for posting. Inspiration is flashing into (and hopefully out of, later) my fingertips!

Christi 2-11-2003 22:28

Richard - Finally made it to your web site. I downloaded your book, it looks interesting.

Strange as it may seem, the last major case I had was a serial rapists, when I finally caught the bugger, it turned out to be one of my best friends, a friend who I shared many a cup of coffee with, a friend who's guns I had maintained for him for several years, a friend who gave my son his first job pumping gas at his gas station.

The whole town was so amazed that I busted his ass and sent him off to the pen without batting an eye. Sort of made my friends think again of our relationship, but then they all knew me well enough to know our friendship would never be a problem between us if they did something so stupid.

What amazed me though is the number of times we sat there across from each other drinking our coffee and talked of what we'd do if we caught that SOB that was rapping women in our little town, I'm sure he must have swallowed a time or two when I expressed my desire that one of our good ladies in our town would pull a 12 gauge from under her bed and blow the bastards head off.

Jerry 2-11-2003 22:20

CHERI -- Our community college offers several "community ed" courses each spring and fall, and there are always a few writing courses included. They've offered a wide range of mini-courses in different genres -- from childrens' fiction to short story, to nature and travel, to op-ed pieces -- even poetry, and a couple of related things like "copyright" and "how to get published." It's a very good way to learn, and to connect with local writers and writer groups.
Check with your local library or bookstore also, for lists of online courses offered by these small colleges. Many of them (ours included) offer both credit and non-credit writing courses occasionally. They can be very helpful.

howard 2-11-2003 20:05

EDDIE,

I do entirely agree with RACHEL'S last post. I think RACHEL and DEBRA are the best of people. But I do agree with you also. There are better places to discuss politics, but I never go them, because I never get on the Internet and say to myself, "I am going to the Notebook or where ever else and express my political opinions today." It is never like that. Sometimes I just read something on the Notebook and I feel compelled to respond. Oftentimes, not to long after I post it, I ask myself, "Now why did I do that? I really should have kept that to myself."

I suppose I just feel comfortable here, but I never want to abuse that feeling and take it too much for granted.

I also add (((Hugs))) to you, EDDIE.

And (((Hugs))) to JACK. JACK, thank you for being so kind and generous, and wise. I wish I could be restrained as you are. I know that however you believe or what ever you think of things that you have good, well-thought out reasons. I also know that you are just as passionate about your beliefs as any of the rest of us. I hope you feel better soon and that you heal up well.

Rhoda 2-11-2003 18:45

Rhoda: Do not worry. It is my intention now that I am able to sit up and have gone through most of the day without narcotic pain pills to try and archive things. Once I do I will edit out the inappropriate HTML and otherwise make sure everything gets posted correctly. If there are political comments coming out, I am not surprised. I will stay mumb and not fire it up any further. I am assuming given previous comments I have made on a broad range of issues you will have my take on things already without asking :-) . Take care everyone and be well.

Jack 2-11-2003 16:53

Hi All,
EDDIE: 72 Font((((((((((((((((((((((((HUGS))))))))))))))))))))) from the antipodes.

DEBRA: Yes, it's true. Ironic huh? Wish I could remember their names, but my brain doesn't have the capacity for remembering German names - lucky for me my ancestors migrated.

RACHEL: That sounds absolutely fascinating! I would love to study that type of thing, maybe I will one day - here's hoping.
I'm glad your oration went well. Whenever I've had to deal with high stress situations my body goes into a type of shock. I look normal, and automatic pilot goes on, but inside I'm having dinner with the mad hatter.

Now you've got me well and truly curious about the 'issue'. But I shan't push.

MEL: I don't fancy wine much either. My in-laws have this homemade rich red wine and a dollop in the ste...er, casserole gives it a lovely depth.Ymmmmmmm.

CHRISTI: Pfft, dread your emails, as if!
Well, your challenge worked wonders, I finished my novel, edited it, sent it to a couple of publisher who LOVED it and now there's a bidding war over it.

What?

Oh, you've heard this one before?
:->

So......how's the weather?

Taz (ugh, sorry Nana) aka Teekay 2-11-2003 16:47

Ok -- deep breath. I guess it's my turn to show some vulnerability. I've just spent the last 45 minutes reading everything that's been posted in the Notebook since this past Sunday morning. I was away, and left just as the political fire here was raging.

Now that I've caught up with all that's happened, once again I'm speechless. There's just no other place like the Notebook.

I met my current husband (we were married last May) in a Beach Boys chatroom, so I know how deeply and quickly bonds can develop on-line. I credit him with giving me the support and encouragement I needed at the time to attempt my first book on my own. I went through 3 agents and God knows how many proposal re-writes before I found the agent, and then the editor, who truly understand what the heck it is that I'm trying to do.

I know that I've achieved alot in my career, with a well-received book and good PR, but everytime I begin something I've never done before, in a sense it's like starting all over again. And when people say, "Wow, you've published a successful book!", it makes me laugh because I'm impressed by everyone else's book but my own!

The problem is that I'm always looking ahead to my upcoming projects, and in that respect I don't give myself credit for what I've accomplished thus far. But as I read about everyone else's efforts in here, I recognized that there's as much victory in every 500 words as there is completing, and then maybe publishing an entire work, and that I should get more pleasure out of the journey.

So I'm doing Christi's assignment (thank you, Christi!) and picking up whatever bits of wisdom and knowledge I can about the writing process. (I know that I have an editor who will edit my sentence structure for me if I need it, but can anyone tell me why I automatically use so many commas, dashes and semi-colons?? ;-)

I used to have several pen pals when I was a kid, because I love to learn about different ways of thinking. I, too, don't like to watch conflict in here, but that's more of my perosnality than anything else. I actually admire those of you who have the guts to say exactly what you think, which applies to just about everyone in here. And that's why I feel a little of my own risk-taking is in order. Please don't think that because someone is comfortable standing up and speaking in front of hundreds of people that it is easy to be open in a forum such as this. I'm Exhibit A on that one.

The reason I'm writing my book, Organizing for the Spirit, is because I love to encourage people to become who they really are, and all they are capable of being. I believe that that's my small contribution to the world and I feel very strongly about it. If one person I positively influence turns around and influences someone else, and so forth and so on, that eventually leads to alot of people being helped. And if I have to go on TV and do interviews and other things that are not comfortable for me, so be it. This is, in part, why I believe I'm here on earth this time around, and what I can do to help heal.

So, that's part of my story. I also want to say that I feel so badly for those of you in emotional and physical pain, and I wish you nachas (good luck) and peace. I'd name names but I have an atrocious memory for them, and I don't want to go through the anguish of those who've tried to do complete lists!

I love hearing the tales of others, fictional and real, because they remind me of what makes us unique, and what binds us together.

Love you all,

Sunny 2-11-2003 16:33

Hi MEL,

How do you know when to stop editing and when your book is ready for submission.

Great question. I think you can go on editing for ever. There has never been a "perfect" book, ie error free.

I would suggest you submit the 1st 3 to 4 chapters with a synopsis whislt you are still polishing the whole manuscript.

At some point you have to have the confidence to sit back and be happy. Only you can decide when that is. Be honest with yourself, if you still think it can be tweaked or improved, then do so.

I find that leaving it for a couple of weeks helps. Your mind get get very fuddled and muddled and time out gives all your thoughts time to settle.

Hope this helps.

Richard.

Richard My site 2-11-2003 16:10

Hi Christi,

Thanks for the motivation.

567 words rattled off (slowly) yesterday. Your idea worked wonders. :-)

Richard

Richard My site 2-11-2003 16:04

I've got a question that really needs an answer!

I feel I'm not qualified to continue writing the story I've started. I think I really need to take a course either an English or Writing class. What do all of you suggest?

Since my job will be ending later this year, I need to decide if I should simply go back into the work force or go back to school and get a degree. AND if I do go to school, should I continue on with the Accounting degree I started years ago or go more towards some kind of writing field. Understand this, I already have about a years worth of credits toward an Accounting Assoc. degree and I do enjoy the field. But do all of you think I should do BOTH or one or the other(as far as college courses go).

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks.

Cheri 2-11-2003 15:56

MEL: Nope, I didn't make it to the funny farm, I made it to the sick bed. Dang sinus blockages. I didn't even make it to Tae Kwon Do! AND only got two sentences written in my journal yesterday. UGH!
Oh well, guess I'll have to try for 500 today.

I don't dream as much as I used to and it's quite depressing really. Many a time I've dreamed of flying. Not flying in an airplane, but flying by my own powers. I did a short essay on it but I can't locate it right now.
If I find it I'll post it.

Good writing to all!

Cheri 2-11-2003 15:34

Hi All :D

I’m having so much trouble staying connected to the internet today. So, I’m trying to write up my post offline and hope for the best doing a quick copy and paste. Ha! More than one way to skin a cat.

First off – another thanks to CHRISTI – I’m afraid I exceeded your 500 though and made it up to 1555! Only trouble was, I wanted to simply add to my novel, but I had this line running through my head. So, giving in to the muse, I ran with it and found myself finally having an opening that I like. Poor Viv has seen, I think, about 6 different beginnings so far. So ---

Thank you VIV for beginning so understanding and patient with my wacky way of writing. We write such different genres, yet we’re able to bounce off each other, give each other ideas, and open new doorways and windows to our work. Thanks for being my buddy, buddy.

Randall – This is the first time I’ve read this portion of FLOWERS and I must say – I like it a lot! You managed to raise a lot of questions in this piece that the reader will want to keep reading and discover the answers for. Now finish it dear man! {{HUG}}

I’m so tempted to say hi to everybody by name, but I’ve seen how others with better memories than my own try only to find a name missing so --- Hello everybody!

To everyone suffering in body and spirit, I send my love and prayers for a return to health.

Rachel (I hope I’m remembering the right name here, but if I’m right --) – I’m so jealous of the house you describe! I love my own, but some of the features you mention, would make this place absolutely perfect. And I agree about the tire swing, there’s nothing like it. I’m still after my hubby to put up my swing. We’ve got the poles, the rope and the board. Just not the labor (and the thawed ground at the moment) to get the job done.

I’m not posting my writing of yesterday since the board is currently quite full. Anyone wanting to take a peek and give me some rough thoughts is welcome to give it a read. Just let me know.

(Just did a quick read through of this post – so, so, so – well, sew buttons on your pants, zippers are out of style! Hehehehe )

Oh, yeah – and DEBRA -- nice job on the Arizona piece! You did a great job of bringing it to life for all of us with your use of all the senses!

(ok, Carol Floy, shut up and let someone else talk for bit ---)

Carol 2-11-2003 15:19

Rachel, I know exactly what you mean about things always being with you, long after you've identified them. I'm like that with very close friendships. After being burned by my very best friends when I was a teenager, I have a tendency to let new friendships develop only to a certain level, and then not let them go further. It's pain avoidance, I know it, and I have to work very hard to overcome that tendancy. But I don't want to miss out on the joys of having close friends, so I force myself to get past my old habits. It will always haunt me.

Mel, Mel, Mel... some dishes simply must have wine in them. Not just any wine, it must be matched to the dish, but so tastey! ;-)

Someone asked about nicknames... my dad called my 'Kid', my mom calls me 'TJ' my hubby calls my 'Luv'. Many friends have simply called my 'Tee'. The only one I've hated was 'Tina the ballerina'.

Tina 2-11-2003 14:54

Well said, HEATHER! :-) Now if tinkering was just not in my bloodstream... I'd still not be published! BWAAHAA HAAA HAA! 8-]

Mel again 2-11-2003 14:33

***Mel***

CHRISTI: WARNING: Potentially wet substance being posted in your direction... It's a BIG, sLoPpY Kiss 8-P and a GREAT BIG (((((((HUG))))))) to go with it for your wonderfully inspiring 500-word writing assignment yesterday. It was just what I needed to break a long stint of no-writing AND to finish a new opening scene I'd been considering but hadn't written in its entirety until your challenge. :-] Now I feel like a writer again! Well, at least on the road to where I should be headed, anyway! I dedicated 556 words to you last evening. Without your challenge, I would've never started or even kept at it so long, as it was late (for me) and I wasn't sure where to look for the words. The ones I wrote are nothing special but the fact that I wrote them - got started again! - is most significant for me. So, my writing friend, THANK YOU for the inspiration. :-] (Uh, do it again today, did you say? Uh, um, er, whew! *pulls collar to relieve constriction in throat* - er, ah, okay, I'll try!) (My muse wants to know who said that??)

CHERI: Um, sorry I jumped off the wagon to the Funny Farm. Maybe you escaped too? :-) I hope so!

CHRISTI, RANDALL: "crystalline dreams turning to printed mind-numbing drivel" ... yup, that's the way my dream-stories end.

RANDALL: !!!!! I think our muses have, at one time or another in the past, gone drinking together or something! Your FLOWERS is very different from my SHARDS, but still some similar elements have touched our creative levels. Crystals, rainbows, mind-blowing natural/supernatural phenomena...I even have a heroine who is very much like a Native American...

TEEKAY: Curry? Blyuck! >-{ Make it oregano or thyme, and forget the wine (or have the wine separately if you must - wine adds nothing to the taste of anything, in my opinion!) - SORRY if I offended any wine lovers! It's the only 'whine' I know.

RACHEL: Me three! I'd love to see a pic of your intriguing home. SOunds like a wonderful setting for a gothic romance or something! :-) Glad your speech went well. Worse than public speaking, I hate "The FLY" movie and that poor deranged science experiment! (But "help meee" must be one of the most popularly quoted lines of all movies!)

HOWARD: Groooaaaaannnnn! I was afraid someone would say the edits are never done! It must be a matter of courage then, when you make the momentous decision to let your literary baby fly the coop. Good luck with your latest story on its rounds! :-]

EDDIE: More (((((HUGS)))))... Got lots. Keep coming back whenever you need 'em.

JON: Wise words perch between your ears! Your human must be spoiling you properly. An extra catnip treat for you!!

JERRY: Welcome, fellow Lutheran! :-] I was a "Methodist" for so many years I never realized how close to "home" I was until I started attending a Lutheran church a few years ago. I love the beautiful choral liturgies and the holiness of the sanctuary. Not all churches have that anymore. I am glad to find some peace for my soul Sunday mornings amid the rest of the week in the harsh world.

PAMELA: I see the scenes in my head too and let the visual drip into my writing arm...I run into trouble whenever I rush the words, whenever I don't sit and steep in the mental visuals before I try to recreate them in text. BTW, your memory is good!! I just checked Saroyan's HUMAN COMEDY and there is mention of an Ithaca, although it's off a Sante Fe/San Francisco train, so I don't think it's my Ithaca. Salinger's Glass family was in NYC, I think. And I liked your villain advice, to "find his distorted reasoning and make it your own while in his skin." :-] I, like TAYLOR, I think, just don't like to BE in his skin! 8-o

I am so enjoying the spurt of writing talk going on here! :-] Keep the ink flowing, you-all!

Mel 2-11-2003 14:30

Hmmmmm. Here's something I heard on the radio last night. It was an interview with a musician, of course, but I don't know who, since I turned on the radio after that was announced. :o>
"...It's either a good song or it's not. If it's not, you won't make it into a good song by tinkering with it."
The musician was talking about how years ago, the artists went into the recording studio well-rehearsed, and songs were recorded in only one or two takes. These days, songs are recorded and then tinkered with for ages, so that a song can be engineered into something 'most likely to be a hit'. But, as it was said, a crappy song won't become a good one by tinkering around with it endlessly.
THIS APPLIES TO WRITING AND EDITING!

Oh, yes.
I know I heard this snippet of interview for a reason!

All ye tinkerers - hear ye, hear ye! Arrest your hands and pens from thy tinkering! If it's good it's good. If it's not, don't spend a year messing with it. You could have learned why it did't end up as a good piece of writing, and gotten on to better work.

That's right. I will take my own advice if I have to swallow it with five gallons of orange juice and a dose of gravol!

:oD

Heather 2-11-2003 13:58

Eddie,

I am so sorry for your loss. I was away from the NB when this happened. Please accept my heart felt condolences to you and your family.

Teekay,

I’ve been taking religious studies classes. We did the west last semester and are not onto the east. I’m taking philosophy, psychology, anthropology, religious studies, you know the ology stuff ;o) My religious studies prof is also pretty heavy into the political sciences so we have some pretty wicked discussions in class. I love the the classes I’m taking all compliment one another. When I am organizing my class selections I do think of that. I try to get courses that will work as a team. I love hot pots! You and I cook the same way (yummy)!! My presentation went well. It went very well. By the time the question period began I was comfortable and at ease. I don’t have a problem with speaking clearly or at a good pace. I’m awesome at that. I just have a problem with people looking at me. I hate when people look at me. That is what I like about the internet, nobody is freaking looking at me. Last night I told myself reasonably that the class was looking at me because I was sitting at the front of the class addressing them. That seemed to calm me. I have other issues around public speaking, but the biggest is just that I don’t like being the center of attention. I’m the great deflector. If anyone puts something on me, I try to push it off to another, unless it is a private sort of thing, then I just love it and roll around in the attention. Kind of strange eh? I know what is at the root of my discomfort with public speaking and with being looked at, that doesn’t mean I can just make it be gone, though yesterday evening was a large step in the right direction of moving away from this issue. It will always be there, always be a part of me, but it doesn’t have to define who I am and how I act. Know what I mean?

Rachel

Christi,

Sure i’ll send you a picture. I guess I better get on this.

Jon,

My brave heart send you a warm hug. I think that Rhoda, Debra and I are fine. We all have strong feelings and positions. It doesn’t mean we don’t like each other, it just means we don’t like every little bitty thing about each other ;o) Who does? There are things my family and friends do that drive me nuts, it doesn’t mean I don’t love them.

Rachel 2-11-2003 11:41

Fran Pam-am (one childhood nickname)
Finally caught up on everyone's postings and excerpts, wow, I'm impressed! Jerry, you have really got me curious about what is going on with Richard and how such a simple situation is going to change his life. Randall, poor Tiki really is having a day from heck but it appears inevitable. Your descriptive writing of freaky events was great, that stuff is so hard to do.
Mel, as far as editing tips, what I do is read my stuff like I haven't written it myself, as a reader rather than a writer, it helps in ruthlessly chopping out my precious words (writing is not for the anal-retentive!). I think this works for me, Bantam hardly changed anything in my manuscript, just added some periods here and there to my long sentences. Richard, my new book definitely has film potential, sometimes I just watch a scene in my head and write down what I see.
Eddie, my heart weeps for you, I know how hard is was to hear Michael's favorite song and the anger you feel at your helplessness over his leaving. Jon beat me to what I was going to say about the song but I think it bears repeating: I think Michael CAN hear his favorite song, as well as music that you can't hear. Nikki should also know that he loves her and doesn't care anything about their little spat, it is so insignificant and he especially, from his vantage point, can see this clearly. I think maybe if you closed your eyes sometime and took deep breaths and tried to stop the noises of the world (meditation), you could feel him near you. I feel certain that he IS near you and wishes he could tell you all that he is all right. I followed your advice and went and gave my daughter a big kiss, know that I have cherished her more than ever after hearing of Michael's leaving. On the political front, I'm with you, gonna stay out of it, it's too depressing anyway. When I said we couldn't do anything, I didn't mean that we can't try to change things for the future, just that we can't alter the events of the past which have led up to the crisis going on now, I don't think we can change radical extremists whose hatred has been boiling for years or previous foreign policies which may have contributed to it. I don't think we can alter the fact that they hate us, or that they will try to hurt us, but we can alter the fact of our own fear so that they do not win even if they kill us. It's true that words without expressions are limiting, I mean for this to be apolital and uplifting but don't know if it is coming across that way. We all leave here sometime and I don't think that is a bad thing. When your number's up, your number's up and I think it's a waste of time to worry about it when you could be smelling the roses.
Debra, thanks for the update on the Sweetie books, I don't give a hoot if you're self-published (or never published, for that matter), I'm just glad you haven't had to set yourself on fire to get attention for your work. I think boys could use some education about abuse too.
Mel, was it "The Human Comedy" by William Saroyan that was set in Ithaca, or am I thinking of the Glass family of Salinger's?
About getting into the villian's mind, that can be hard and also a little scary to do. We have to use our imagination (which is what makes us writers) to try to understand the impossible, or what would be impossible for us ourselves to do. Many books offer the standard bad childhood for the villian or sociopathology, being unable to feel anything unless it is extreme, like the act of killing someone. I don't want to go into too much detail about my book (don't want to spoil it for you when it comes out!) but I have kind of a dialogue with the devil type of thing going on, which I'm actually having a little fun with ("Oh, if we only had cheeks, tears would be streaming down them from laughter..." after doing something nasty to someone). On the other hand, I DID go crazy in prison and had demons of my own, which I am drawing on for this, I just have to be sure that they don't come back again. Personally, I think the ugly creatures bothering me were real, since 1800 mgs. of Thorazine a day did nothing to dispell them and they didn't leave until I had a big showdown and told them to f**k off. I've been off medication for years now and they haven't been back. Anyhow, I think some people (and spirits) are just plain mean and, as a reader, I prefer these types of bad guys since I get too sympathetic over the ones with horrible childhoods (I even have sympathy for terorists who have been brainwashed since they were children and know not what they do). The villian acts upon logic, it is just unlike that which most of us follow, find his distorted reasoning and make it your own while you are in his skin.
Randall, I meant to mention that I love the fruitcake recipe, though it does dispell the rumor that there is just one fruitcake in the whole world making the rounds. Hope your stones are doing well and that your wife has recovered (nothing too serious, I hope?).
Howard, congrats on sending out a story, good luck!
As a hippie who still believes in the power of love, and a peace-loving Libra, I'm glad to see that cyber hugs and kisses have been exchanged and animosity has departed our pages.

Pamela 2-11-2003 1:35

Jon! Welcome home! You look even more dapper than usual.

Tina, What a way to start! I think your twenty paged edit ROCKS! Keep it up! I meant to tell everyone that if they didn't feeling like writing they could edit a couple of pages. Editing is writing of a meticulous nature.

Heather, Thank you for all your work on P**. My gosh what you've done with that! Hey, I meant to include compiling and submitting as well. Glad to see you back here, and in glorious form as well. I adore your posts!

Okay, (breathing hard) I managed 560 words. It was tough but man am I glad I did it. I acheived a turning point in my story that I didn't know was going to be there. Where does this stuff come from?

Anyone want to do it again tomorrow?

Christi 2-11-2003 0:24

Heather:

Everything you say helps me. Keep it coming.

Jon:

You are so nice. I miss you. Where have you been? I have never heard sweet and Debra together before; I like it.

Eddie:

I'll say a prayer for you. Grief is so lonely. I find with grief it's that split second or two when you are blocking it out and it's kicking the door to get back in. It's that brief moment whre you are holding back the knowledge with both feet braced on the ground and both hands on the door. It doesn't matter how long it's been either, you find yourself there over and over. It's more painful than letting it in. Like when you were listening to the music, for a second you felt........good. Then it wanted back in.

I'm so sorry for your loss. I know that doesn't help. We need better words.

Teekay:

Is that a true story?

Jerry:

Thank you for thinking of me. I've been kind of moody lately huh? Sorry! When they elevated the level to orange I went off the deep end.

Debra 2-10-2003 23:57

Ok, ok I can't do HTML code anymore, but the links work any how, click on them their neat, well I thought they were neat.

Last Sunday mom was saying how happy she was that my wife and I have changed back to the Lutheran faith and now attend the same church as the rest of the family.

I explained to her that had I been introduced to the Church when I was a kid, I would probably have been a Lutheran all the time.

Her explanation, we didn't have enough gas money to drive to town for church back then. I let it slide, but geeze back when I began driving, gas sold for .29 9/10 per gallon. We lived 25 miles from town so if our car only got 10 miles per gallon and I think it probably did a bit better then that, it would have cost 65 cents to drive to town, another 65 cents to drive home, so that's a bit over a buck and a quarter. Even back then I think we could have afforded a buck and a quarter every week, hell once a month maybe, we went to town once a month for groceries and booze, if they just got one six pack less of beer it would have covered the cost.

Oh well I was too young to remember back then anyhow I guess but she never explained why we never started going when we moved to town. We could have walked if there wasn't enough gas, we only lived, at the most six blocks from Church.

I guess I can't blame them though, I never started going when I got married and moved away either till I was introduced to the fact that none of us will live for ever, and a guy should be at least on a last name basis with God when that time comes.

Enough bitching.

Jerry 2-10-2003 23:45

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Jerry Testing 2-10-2003 23:06

Why, Jon, I am honored that you would think my words helpful toi Debra, and thank you for the prize!
Debra? Hope they actually did help...:o)

Heather 2-10-2003 22:32

Eddie - Your daughter is definitely in need of a hug! Pass it on....:o) A similar thing happened between my husband's brothers right before the youngest brother killed himself before Christmas. Although Lee did call Danny to say that they would get together and work things out and sort through the misunderstandings and hurt feelings, he never did. He was dead the next night.
In time your daughter will remember more of the good times and the little things, and she will not hurt so over the fights. I'm sure there was more than one, but with not being able to resolve the last one, it isn't an easy thing to live with. I don't have much advice on the matter - heck, I still feel guilty on and off about some things that happened between myself and good friends that have died. There's no repairing it afterward because they're not here. But I do take comfort in the fact that my love for them far surpassed anything I did or failed to do at any particular time. Maybe that's my advice right there.
MORE HUGS FOR YOU AND YOUR FAMILY, EDDIE!

TEEK - I am thinking...purple....charoite, or amethyst...
lovely!

Heather 2-10-2003 22:29

So much for that attempt at privacy. I didn't realise the programme would set that up as a link. Doh.

Thanks for the prize Jon. I'm honoured to the point of misty tears... ;-)

Tina 2-10-2003 22:22

Hey Christi! I edited 20 pages of 'Shadow'. Now I have to pack, and my realtor is coming over with some papers. Thanks for the boost to get at least some writing done.
And about needing fresh eyes to re-experience your surroundings... I do that here at home on purpose. I just stare at the hills and try to imagine seeing them for the first time. This valley is magically beautiful, but it's easy to forget how beautiful. Children and guests are wonderful at reminding us of that.

Eddie, music plays so deeply to our emotions. When my dad died 2 years ago, we drove down to the coast that night. We had to sit at the ferry for 2 1/2 hours waiting for the first run. At the dock, they have a huge screen that shows ferry times, advertising, movie previews, and music. They must have played JLo's 'Love don't Cost a Thing' video 20 times. Even yet, I simply cannot listen to it. If I hear it anywhere, a sharp pain lances through my gut. Same thing for the love song 'My Heart Will Go On'. My mom chose that as her dedication to my dad at his memorial. I almost bawl every time I hear it.
(((((HUGS)))))

As for my e-mail, I won't put it in the regular tag 'add e-address for instant spam' spot. I'm trying to keep my new address clean for as long as possible. It is airjunkies@shaw.ca

Tina 2-10-2003 22:18

JON -- Thanks for reminding me! I meant to comment on TINA'S "You can TASTE Arizona..." when I first saw it -- Brilliant, gal! I love it!

howard 2-10-2003 22:15

T Kaye -- No, the poke in the eye was not mine. It is a very old one that I just received again from my sister. Dunno who wrote it, but it seems to somehow fit in today's ~~insanity~~ ~~madness~~ political arena... We keep on running up to peek through the hole in the fence, and the bozo on the other side just sits there waiting to poke us in the eye all over again. We never learn. :-(

howard 2-10-2003 22:10

Yo, all.

Here are some prizes.

To all the Canadians in this forum. To Rachel because she's a brave heart, to Tina because she wrote a very inspiring post about one of the American states seen from above, and to Heather because she gave the best answer on the fears of our sweet Debra.

A prize for Randall. The fact that he proclaimed Texas the most powerful nation on earth is not only a great statement but also the second best joke of the year after Rumsfeld's trip to Germany. He is wrong of course, the most powerful nation on earth is Portugal. But humor is always a prize-winner.

Note: these are not the prizes of the year. The prizes of the year 2002 will only be given if there will be no war and if Jerry stops nuking people.

Now will Rachel, Debra and Rhoda join their hands, please, and send me a kiss.

Eddie: how can you be sure that Michael cannot hear his favorite song any more?

Jon 2-10-2003 22:07

+Christi+

Hiya, Cheri! I sure like you.

Teekay, I'm mailing you toot sweet, so watch out! :) Just kidding; I'd never want you to dread my emails. Mwah HAHAHA!

Mel, YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!!!!!! I know just what you mean. I made up a saying that fit my particular writing fault (the worst of many) and pasted it all around my house to remind me. "Procrastination never did a thing for anyone." (I left out the 'damn' but it's insinuated) Did it cure me? Nope. Do I look right past those made-up signs? Sure do! Maybe I should make a subliminal tape.
PS *whispered* hey, psst! I'd be happy with 250 (100?).

Honestly I'll be happy if everyone just cracks open something they were writing on, or begins something they wanted to start, or catches up on their journal. Even two sentences written is two sentences closer to THE END. Doesn't that sound fantastic? I'm gettin' the goosebumps thinking of those two little words.

Jerry, Great tip on the commas. Man, I try, and try, and try, but, they always, seem, to, sneak up, on me! Nice job on the assignment! Can you drop and give me 500 more by the end of tomorrow? Maybe someone else will take over shortie night for Mary for the time being (nudge nudge). The reason I'm doing word amounts is because so many here are working on novels or short stories or articles.

Can't believe I forgot to sympathize with you Randall! I loathe the ER. Nothing like a good old emergency to happen so's you can wait ... and wait ... and wait ....................... *clunk*. Hope the wife is feeling good, and I hope you will be very soon.
And Randall? Why you so mean to Tiki? :) I myself have a hard time weaving my dreams into stories. This is not for lack of trying, but each time I find that what seemed so crystalline to my dreaming mind comes out on paper as mind-numbing drivel. Yeesh.

Rachel, Me too, me too! I'm dying to see your house. I just drooled all over myself whilst reading your description of it. It's the perfect backdrop for a story. I've never even SEEN such a house, let alone lived in one. Pretty please???

Eddie, I think of you so often. I can't explain why really, except that I empathize like hell with you. It's just about the worst imaginable thing. I think people are afraid to even speak of losing a child for fear of it happening to them. I have lost only one close relative and the pain from that experiences still hasn't left me. It has mellowed a lot and most of the anger is gone, but it still hurts. I hope you have access to a lot of hugs and a really good punching bag. {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{HUGS}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}} from Arizona.

I'll check in later because I still haven't written my 500. Orf.

Christi 2-10-2003 21:59

Randall

Good evening everybody...

Screw politics...at least for now! :-) I sometimes call my novel "Flowers." This is to simplify a six word title. And this is basically the dream that started it all in 1997.

From WHERE THE ROCKS COVER THE FLOWERS
Randall Henderson

Joe Dan led them to a thick grove of juniper, which lay to the right of his tent. "Be careful I haven't cut any of this so it's pretty rough going."
The men helped the ladies through, but it was a struggle. They reached a wide area where immense, lichen covered flat rocks covered a large meadow like area.
"It was the biggest, prettiest ram I've ever seen." Joe Dan explained. "I chased him for an hour before he came through here. You can see where my horse came through those trees over there. The ram was standing here and I rode up to rope him. But my horse broke through one of these flat rocks. It's right here. Look how beautiful they are."
Robert walked to look at the broken rock. Joe Dan's horse had cracked the rock to expose a cavity only an inch below. Matt and Robert squatted next to the broken rock and began to enlarge the hole. The rock broke easily as if rotten. In the afternoon sun a brilliant gleam reflected back into their faces.
To Star Tiki, it was the suns reflection in a mirror.
Robert heard his mother gasp and quickly looked at her. She was staring at the rock crystals, obviously horrified and backing slowly away shaking her head. Tiki kept retreating till the thick wall of juniper stopped her.
"What is it?" Robert went to his mother.
"I didn't see it, I didn't know! This is it, the last sign Robert! We are inside the legend! I always hoped we could escape this, but it's going to happen! Andrea is the one. She will speak the words." Tiki moaned and held onto her son to keep from collapsing.
Andrea was in front of Tiki and Robert and saw nothing but the shimmering jeweled crystals glistening in a stone container.
Joe Dan knelt beside Matt and they cleared away the surface rock until a large area was cleared. Contained inside the large rock were hundreds of gleaming crystals. A rainbow would be pale compared to the multitude of colored crystals that gleamed and winked in the setting sun.
Andrea was drawn to the glittering crystals. She knelt and gently touched one. It was solid and beautifully shaped. Some were very small, slender as a straw, others three to four inches tall, an inch wide. She lay on the ground with Angel Kay sitting next to her. Red, blue, green, purple, orange, seemingly no two crystals were alike in color.
"So beautiful. What caused this formation?" Angel Kay questioned.
"I don't know," Joe Dan admitted. "Someone does, but not me. Matt, any ideas?"
Matt, still in his sheriff's office uniform shook his head. He was watching Tiki and Robert standing away from the others. He sensed something was wrong.
"I haven't got the slightest idea. But I'll tell you one thing. Look at the many rocks around us. They're all the same. If each one contains these crystals, it will be a hell of an attraction for tourists."
Andrea lay on the ground, lost in the beauty inches away. She looked up at Angel Kay. "This is so beautiful, why they're just like little flowers. Beautiful delicate flowers, frozen in stone. A diamond is such a small thing, nothing too compared with this. Beautiful little flowers, captive inside a rock."
Yards away, Tiki was shivering violently. "Last sign, oh no, my authority! It's collapsing, coming for me!" She whispered hoarsely, "Robert hold me, it's approaching!"
Robert felt his mother stiffen. Tiki groaned as the Web of Authority slipped from her command. Previously in tune with earth's own resonance within a specific vibrational frequency, Tiki's powerful magnetic link of dominion evaporated. The energy of the planet channeled to her without control. She leaned backward, and began to shudder. Tiki's hair bristled outward, her teeth chattering, her eyes rolling back into her head. She was struggling for control, but losing. Robert knew what was about to happen. Her power was surging, in, then out in wider and wider oscillations. At the end it would collapse, shorting her out. He saw the crackle of fire on the ends of Tiki's hair. Oh no he thought, it's been so long, we thought it was over. He looked at Matt for help.
Matt and Joe Dan were only a few feet behind Andrea and moving quickly to help. Tiki collapsed and began to convulse, flailing at the men holding her. Her control ceased and the splendid Web of Authority shattered like a delicate crystal spider web. Tiki's was defenseless as the effect of a collapsing system concentrated upon her.
Angel Kay turned and gasped at the sight of Tiki thrashing on the ground.
Andrea, oblivious of what was occurring behind lifted her head and spoke to no one in particular, her voice full of wonder. A prophecy thousands of years old was upon her. Behind her in spirit a hundred Ancient and Holy Ones stood in reverence of the moment.
"Oh Tiki! What a beautiful place this is. Where the rocks cover the flowers."

XXXXXXXXXX

Tiki screamed and screamed and screamed. She saw the Whisper of Jehovah, poised above the earth, the moon spinning out of control. She watched the earth's oceans lifting, attracted by a massive object, miles above their seabeds following the immense body as it swept by. She saw great ice sheets buckle, exploding, shreds of ice flying upward drawn by the gravity of a celestial object moving parallel to the orbit of the earth. She heard the great thunderclap of electrical discharge as magnetic fields of two great spheres collided, fought, then broke free. She saw gigantic spires of water collapsing and surging outward, tidal waves a mile high racing over the earth obliterating every vestige of life. She saw the great rainbow circle, overcome, shattered, dissolved. She felt Mother Earth groaning inside, tearing apart, she saw a red-hot magma torrent forth. She watched mountain ranges collapsing inward, others breaking free and jutting into the air, rock and dust smashed by a billion tons of sea water. She saw gigantic atmospheric storms form and died in minutes. She saw hurricane winds scour the earth ripping burning forests from collapsing, dying mountains.
Tiki felt the intense pain as animals and humans died. She heard their screams of fear. Tiki saw tunnels collapsing where many had fled for protection, buried by tons of falling rock. She saw Burrowing Coyote and other faint figures, trying vainly to reform the great rainbow circle of protection, smashed down, crushed by the Whisper of Jehovah.
Tiki screamed until she couldn't scream again.
Her authority collapsed inward overloading her mind with horrifying images of the death of humanity. The crystalline matrix so carefully nurtured and maintained over a lifetime lay in ruins, leaving her open to powerful Earth vortices of tremendous potency. An energy surge, a veritable avalanche of the cumulative memory of humanity slammed into Tiki. It blew her mind like a ten-cent fuse. Three strong men couldn't hold Tiki as the convulsions threatened to tear her apart.

Yeah...Tiki's having a bad day. But things get a lot worse...

Randall

Randall 2-10-2003 20:55

Debra - I downladed a PDF document on Homeland Security. I was going to Email it to you until I realized I don't have your email, so I posted it on my new homepage, click the link. It's in Adobe Acrobat format so you have to have Adobe Acrobat reader installed to read it. Acrobat is a free download at http://www.adobe.com if you need it. Once you have it loaded I think (?) you can save it to your hard drive and browse it at your leasure. It does have some good stuff.

Oh anyone else who's intrested feel free to click the link.

Jerry Homeland Defense 2-10-2003 20:39

Here's a little something which happened to me today.
I got into the car and switched on the radio. My son's favourite song was playing. This obviously upset me greatly and I cried like a baby. Then I got so angry that I almost smashed the front of the radio switching it off.
It is just so wrong that he can't hear it any more. His ears aren't hearing anything anymore. I can't listen to it again.
That's what happens to you, Anger - sorrow You get the emotions mixed up.
Later,
Ed

Eddie French 2-10-2003 19:21

RACHEL: What are you studying?
Hot pots never fail. Throw in some meat and vegies and beef stock and worchestershire sauce and some curry powder and a dash of red wine, salt and pepper to taste. make up lots of extra to freeze for more days such as this :-D

You know when you see someone you don't know fall over in the street. You feel embarrassed for them for a little bit and be thankful it isn't you. Well, public speaking is sort of the same thing.
You'll be just fine, take deep breaths and know that nobody is going to be judging you - much, and if they do it won't be for long. Speak calmly and what ever you do DON'T imagine anybody naked. It's terribly off putting. :-D

EDDIE: I agree.

Teekay 2-10-2003 18:41

Christi - sorry about that, I couldn't find your challenge, and forgot who did it, thanks for the assignment, it was good to get back to writing again. I read what I had posted and discovered I forgot to go over it with a comma magnet. My old English 101 instructor in college told me to REMOVE the comma key before I began writing, I should have listened. I usually go over my work and remove 60% of the comma's then I still have a couple of dozen extra's in the work. Somehow they insert themselves every time I take a breath no matter where my work is at the time. Guess I'll have to go on a comma diet.

What I posted was very rough but it was fun anyhow. Now if we could just get shorty night going again, I feel all the new folks could show us a thing or two...

Jerry 2-10-2003 18:39

Hi Teekay,

I'll send you a pic some time soon. Likely next week. I will be so happy when today is over. I had a unit test, I've got another, did the pre-lim for an exam and have just produced a twenty page paper that is the basis for an oral presentation that I need to do this evening. I hate public speaking. People say I'm good at it, but I hate it with all my heart. I need to go make dinner. Help meeeeeeee. Heeeelllp meeeeeeeee (grin/wink).

Rachel 2-10-2003 18:20

Did I really make those spelling mistakes?
Shame on me.

Eddie French 2-10-2003 17:43

Teek,
I do enjoy reading some of the lively politics on the notebook. The decision to keep my politics and or beliefs to myself is mine alone. As JERRY says 'somebody has to stay outside to remind you all of the sweeter things in life'
I truly believe in the old adage:
'I detest what you say, but I will defend your right to say it with my life'
Of course, you must take that literally....WHAT YOU SAY... this precludes any actions which might physically or emotionally harm another human being.
I was not always like this.
I have killed in time of war, for my country (This was what I believed at the time but hey, I was in the nether region of 18 - 21 years of age) I have had many people try to kill me, close up and fairly personal. (One day I will write about it all) In fact, I have around 80 pages already, but I've only just entered the active service zone.
Over the years my wiewpoint has changed somewhat. I cherish life so much more, and that did not just start after Christmas Day, as some of you will already know.
No....if I want politics I can get that anywhere, I choose not to join in here. (Now somebody is going to post something which goes right down to my soul aren't they!!) I know how it goes, it's called 'SODS LAW'. :¬)
Let me revise my position just a little:
I TRY VERY HARD TO KEEP MY POLITICS OFF THE NOTEBOOK
But you can debate all you like for me. Most times I enjoy reading the debates. As an observer I learn so much about you all.
The problem with the current debate is that it is too close to real for comfort and it is upsetting lots of people, and not surprisingly so. Just try to debate - not fight. There will be enough of that in the comming month.
Take care all.
Ed

Eddie French 2-10-2003 17:40

MEL: I'm not going to the funny farm, just to the shops for some more pens and stuff.
Don't feel like poking out eyes today.

RACHEL: Ooooh yes! Take some photos and email me some. I can picture it anyway :-D

TAYLOR: It was only that last bit about 'teaching you something', and only because during my epic story writing adventure which lasted such a very brief time I really did find myself on a journey of discovery. It was really quite thrilling.

RANDALL: Now that you've told me a secret, I shall share. My middle name is.................Kaye.
Did you guess? :-D

Cracked up about you wondering if you should call 911 for the ambulance. They deliberatley make you wait you know, just so's you won't come there for the hell of it - as if!

Teekay 2-10-2003 17:26

Hi All,
EDDIE: My heart goes out to your daughter, it must be tearing her up.

I know you're in a very different place from me right now, but I do disagree with what you said about not viewing political viewpoints and such on the notebook. I guess if no one wants to hear what the other person is saying, then they won't read it, or won't respond. To drag a really old and shaggy looking saying into it - it takes two to tango.
Personally, I think it makes the notebook richer and gives us something more to contemplate. I know myself, that reading all the differing viewpoints has added facets to my view of things.
We don't have to allow the opinions of others to hurt or offend us.

HOWARD: That's really good! Is it yours? Did the notebook inspire you :-D

DEBRA: Once upon a time there were 2 friends who lived in Germany, one was Jewish, the other was not. Despite their differing religions they had a great deal in common and spent a lot of time together. Both were incredibly intelligent men, both were scientists. Both were working on a project regarding nuclear physics.
One day the Government of Germany decided to implement his plan to make a perfect nation, and Jews for one weren’t included in the equation. Thus it was that the Jewish man went to America as a refugee.

Hitler then set the German man to work making an atomic bomb. The German man had a great deal of trouble with his conscience regarding this, and somehow managed to meet his counterpart and told him in a rather obscure message, what it was he was asked to do, wanting his friend’s opinion. The friend, misunderstanding the question and advice his friend was after took umbrage that he should be working on such a weapon which was intended for the annihilation of his people and made the bomb for the U.S.A. while the other guy went back and told Hitler that what he was asking was impossible to achieve in the time frame given.

America got the bomb first, but for his conscience and love and respect for his friend, how very different the story could have been.

I love this story.

CHRISTI: HAHAHAHAHHAHAAH good one :-D

MEL:: Right with you, I'll just grab my bag. The muses fault! I should've known.

Going all y'all.

Teekay 2-10-2003 17:07

MEL -- As one of the others who has been "officially published," I can say that the edits are never done! Even as I was reading my (only published)essay in Stories Worth Telling for the first time in a real live book (at the book signing in Barnes&Noble, no less)I pencilled in some changes! Even now there are things...

Seriously, as we continue to learn and develop as writers we keep finding new ways to flog words into doing their work more effectively -- into saying what we wanted to say, rather than what we said.

I submitted a short story last night, and even as it went out I saw a change that I should have made. Oh well, I'll make corrections on the back of the next reject letter...

:-)

howard 2-10-2003 16:43

MEL: Between making and eating dinner, going to Tae Kwon Do and getting things ready for tomorrow, I'll be lucky if I have time to write my name!

I am trying to write a little something in my journal, since I've neglected it too long already(SIX DAYS!). It won't be 500 words(I can't count that high in one day!) but it will be something.

Hello to RICHARD! I only post now and then, but I'm always lurking.

Good writing to all.

Cheri 2-10-2003 16:03

Cheri:

Don't worry about me leaving. I always hated people who quit playing monopoly when they were losing. Yes, I'm wrong a lot. I can take it as good as I can dish it.

I don't like to see people fight either. A couple of the giants here have done that and threatened to leave and it always broke my heart. They didn't thankfully.

Pamela and Mel:

Thank you for your kind works. I am working like an idiot over here. I have a call blinking right now on my phone that is from the tv station. They want to do a story this week. Also, about the govenor's office,I did get in first, but it's because I got in line first. I didn't cut anyone. I know no one said I did. I just want to make sure that was clear.

Pamela:

Everyone here knows this, but you, I think. Sweetie is self published. I am doing everything but setting myself on fire and dancing on the highway. It is one way of getting a commercial publisher to notice me.

For the meantime I am not quite a published author in the tradional sense. This world has changed so much since that term came out. But sweetie is every bit as good as I say. Soon it will be required reading. It will. No girl should ever leave high school again without being prepared for what might to come, domestic violence.

2-10-2003 15:43

Good for you, JERRY, for jumping right on CHRISTI's 500-word challenge!

I'm - uh - gulp! - going to attack said assignment tonight at home (I'll get the hubby on his computer game, the youngest child to bed, the next two up maybe watching a movie, and I'll sneak off to the bedroom and CLOSE THE DOOR, if that act doesn't bring them automatically to see what Mom's doing!!!)

If I don't --erghhh! -- complete this assignment, CHERI and I are headed straight to the Funny Farm by midnight (unless, of course, CHERI completes the assignment without me and leaves me chewing her dust!!!).

Happy writing, all! ;-]

mEL 2-10-2003 15:31

Was it Carol who said we should write 500 today? I think so but my heads a bit fuzzy today from the stupid pills that the Doc has me on, at any rate, I always love an assignement, and I'm attempting to get back my long short story (or was it a short long story?) from memory since I lost the damn thing when I had to reformat (but that's another story!).

Oh Eddie, great to see you posting again, stick around we need your level head to keep us straight when our emotions overcome our good sense. I've been guilty of that so many times in the Notebook myself but there's always someone there to give me a good smack.

At any rate, here's the first 700 or so words...

Richard Atkinson loved to shoot.

Not that he was a great hunter, the opposite was true, he loved animals and would never harm the hair on any of his wild friends, but he loved to shoot.

He spent much of his off time at the local police range. The range wasn’t much, just a berm that the City Crew had pushed up with their front-end loader and a gravel walk way from the shooting line, so marked by five fence posts designating the five shooting positions, and twenty five yards away was a half inch steel cable pocked with plenty of holes the result of shots missing the targets that hung from the cable. There was a shack of sorts, he thought it looked a lot like the entry from an old trailer house long abandoned with a slab of press board, now falling apart from the lack of paint or any other maintance. There was a padlock on the door but it was left open many years ago when the police decided to allow local citizens to use the range when they weren’t using, and they only used it a couple of times a year to qualify to carry their sidearms as required by the State.

Richard opened the door and retrieved a hanging target frame. There was already a target attached but it only had six or seven holes in it. He leaned it up against the building and drew circles around the holes so he could see which holes were going to be his, then walked the twenty five yards down to the cable and hooked the frame up against the cable and hung the man silhouette target, then turned and walked back to his pickup where he retrieved his old army .45 pistol. He walked to the line and took aim at the target, but never squeezed the trigger as he heard a car approaching through the muffs that covered his ears.

He turned and watched as his old friend Sam Anderson drove the patrol car down the dirt trail that led to the range. The car stopped beside Richard’s old Dodge pickup truck, Sam got out and began walking to the ready line. Richard shoved the old beat up pistol in his belt and went to meet his old buddy, the smile on his face told Sam that Richard was glad to see him. The frown on Sam’s face told Richard that he may not like what was to come.

“Sorry pal, the police range is off limits to all but Department Personal, orders of the new Mayor.”

“Shit!”

“Hey, not my fault.”

“I know it just pisses me off when some idiot who hasn’t got the brains to pour piss out of a boot takes office and begins ruling like some mini-Hitler.”

“It’s not like that Rich, the Mayor’s right, we should have put this place off limits years ago, do you realize the position we would be in if you shot yourself in the foot, hell we’d be liable and you could sue the City for millions, and in today’s world you’d probably win!”

“Just a minute, I’ve got something to do,” Richard said as he drew the old army pistol from his belt and aimed it at his left big toe. Then began to laugh and put the old gun back in his belt.

“Sorry about this but I have orders to lock up the targets and lock the gate too, so your going to have to leave, now, I’ve got other chores that the new Mayor has put on my new list of things to do. What a pain in the ass, but I’m sure you and the rest of the guys who use the range can find someplace else to shoot, heck if you find the land I’ll even try to get the City to push up another berm as a backdrop.”

“Ok,” Richard said, as he walked over to the old pickup and tossed the pistol on the seat, after dropping the magazine and jacking out the round from the chamber, then drove the old truck back to town.

Little did Richard know that this incident would change his life forever.

Jerry 2-10-2003 14:58

MEL; I'm coming right behind you to the funny farm!

ON POLITICS AND WAR: I'm scared just like everyone else, but feel helpless. I'm praying that the right course is taken and as few lives will be lost as possible. What else can I do? Mostly, I stick my head in the sand and hope when I come back up for air all will be clear and peaceful.

Please don't fight. That's one thing that hasn't changed since I was a child. I never could stand it when people I cared about fought and yelled at each other. Don't leave either, I'll miss anyone who leaves.

PEACE to all who wish it and love in my thoughts and prayers to all.

Cheri 2-10-2003 14:44

*Mel*

Hi, everyone! A snowy, blowy Monday here in Ithaca, NY...

CAROL: The NB is a great big room (or many little adjacent rooms?), thank heavens, with many conversations going at once. I'm veering onto the veranda where I think I heard you struggling with character passion. That is the meat of fiction writing, I believe, and so vital to the success of any story. And it's the very same thing I'm wrestling - I will THINK I have a scene written the way it echoes in my head, then I re-read it and realize the characters are still flat; their true passion hasn't been captured by the words at all. I can FEEL their passion but to put it into the proper words... So, here I am, still back at the beginning... sigh.

DEBRA: I'm so glad your SWEETIE book may be considered as required reading for your state's schools!!! What a trip! :-) One of the best rewards I can imagine for any writer is to have your work not only noticed but adored enough to be useful to many lives. One life, one writer CAN make a difference in our world!!! You go, girl! :-]

TEEKAY: re: procrastination? Nah! It's ALWAYS the muse's fault! :-) Now let's head to the stationery store and buy some shiny new pens to oggle, and maybe some nice clean writing pads (do you prefer spiral, legal, journal books, or ... ???) ;-]

RANDALL: You and your wife get all better now, y'hear? We can't have any more people falling apart at the seams. The quota's been overfilled this year as it is! (((HUGS, GOOD VIBES, Chicken Soup, and prayers coming your way)))

TAYLOR: re: The villain's mind (see remarks to CAROL on character passion) - this is part two of my troubles, I think. It IS difficult to portray the nasty guy(s) when all you want to do as a writer is get to the happy ending and give that baddy what he/she's due! It did help me immensely, however, the day I mentally took my villain to lunch in a secluded restaurant and, boy, did I learn some incredible stuff about him!!! I'm still trying to mold and shape that new slab of clay he slapped on my writing desk - trouble is, I was never much good at the potter's wheel... but I'm not giving up! You hang in there too and try a few different versions - we can play "Will the real villain please stand up?" If you stumble on the best villain scene before I do, let me know! :-)

RICHARD, SUNNY, JACK, RACHEL, AMERICO, ALLEIN, EDDIE, LITTER, and all others who have officially been published at least once, HOW do you KNOW when all the writer's edits are complete and the story is ready for submission? I keep telling myself, I'll just know, but at every re-read, I find more stuff that needs a face-lift...aarrgghhhh!!!!

CHRISTI: Your 500-word assignment is just what I need. Already I hear my muse (or is it my conscience?) making excuses: I already blew my lunch-hour doing other things, I have to finish work, the bus home will be bumpy and too dark for writing, I'll get home and be so distracted by husband and children that the idea of writing anything will completely disintegrate in the hustle-bustle and noise of the household...and then it's tomorrow when the syndrome will repeat itself... aarrgghhhh!!!! 8-/

One of these days I'm gonna pop if I don't do some serious writing soon -- and I mean more than the mental stuff! (I'm so glad you're all writers and you know what I mean by mental stuff, heh heh, so I know you won't send for the guys in the little white coats yet... at least, I hope you won't... um, is anybody coming with me to the funny farm this trip or am I on my own? ergggggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Mel 2-10-2003 13:54

Hey friends!

Eddie, I'm with you. Thank you for the reminder.

Teekay, Yippee! Woo hoo! So excited! Never thought of myself as a taskmaster. *sound of whip cracking* Get going, girlie. Drop and give me five hundred!

You too, Richard!

Anyone else? C'mon, it'll feel sooooooooo good. I'll check in at the end of the day. Written words, they're addictive.

Howard, That got a real, live outloud laugh! HAH!

Here's one of my favorites:

There is this gang of lifers in prison. All know each other; they've been together for years. They all know one another's stories, each man's claim to innocence, their kids' birthdays.

What they especially know is the jokes they've been telling for the past thirty years. These jokes have been told so many times that the convicts begin to shorten them to one sentence, and then to a single word. Finally they have shortened each joke to an allocated number.

Every time Moe says, "32!", the bunch melts into hysterics. When Hal yells "14!" they all laugh and pound each other's backs with tears in their eyes.

One day a new guy is admitted. He sees the group of lifers and is attracted to their obvious comeraderie. He watches them for weeks, and one day he walks up with a gleam in his eye and shouts, "25!"

There is not a sound. Every man in the cafeteria is staring dumbly at the new guy. Hal is actually shaking his head in disgust.

"What'd I do? Why didn't anybody laugh?" new guy asks.

Hal walks off with Moe and says, "Some people just don't know how to tell a joke."

Christi 2-10-2003 12:38

Haven't read all of the lively weekend conversation yet, just wanted to post something I forgot to include in my last one: !!!DEBRA!!! HOORAY FOR YOU, GOOD WORK, CONGRATULATIONS, YOU'RE THE BEST, YOU GO, GIRL !!!!!! Getting to meet the governor without having to wait like everyone else, yes, why just meeting him at all is GREAT! More congratulations heaped upon you for the success of your "Sweetie" stories (books?) being introduced into the schools. Could you tell me a little more about them, I gather they are about abuse which is great, kids definitely need to be educated about that. Such naughty writers we are that we got so imbroiled in politics that we did not take the time to recognize your wonderful success, at least not right away. So I propose a toast to Debra and her wonderful accomplishment: HEAR, HEAR, CHEERS, SKAOL, WELL DONE, HOORAY FOR YOU!

Pamela 2-10-2003 12:38

Eddie,

I really liked your comment!! I totally agree with your thoughts.

I came to this forum to find fellow writers and I was amazed at the [olitical debate going on and some of the anger flying about the place.

But as I've been told, that is what a forum is for, to exchange views, make new friends and have heated debates!!

But I loved the sentiment of your message.

Richard

Richard Amazon 2-10-2003 12:18

Who was it asking us to post our email???

I knew there was a reason I stopped doing that a couple of years ago, the reminder is now all over my email box!

Since I put my emial on this page, I've had: Enlarge your Penis!! Get your Email List HERE!!! You've WON a free ticket to ten PORN sites! Collect your prize HERE! and about fifty other STUPID SPAM!!!!

This on my email address I reserve for my kids and close friends (those here included)

I stopped posting my email address when we switched to the new ISP, and have been STUPID SPAM free, or very nearly so, with only one or two sneeking aboard since then, but NO MORE, now my clean email address is SPAM CENTRAL!!!

I don't blame anyone here, as I'm aware that there are SPIDERS that harvest email address from sites like this but I surely do regret posting my new email here last week.

The bad thing about all this is that I have TWO spam email address that I use EVERYWHERE but here, guess I'll have to move this site to one of them too if I ever put my email address down again. Trouble with that is that I only clean them once every week or two so will miss emails from my friends here.

Jerry 2-10-2003 11:08

America may export actors, movies raunchy music and....porn, but we also gave birth to electricity, cars, the phone, planes you know the list.

I know someone will post yes and the a-bomb. Yes, and the a-bomb.

The man that invented it, discovered it or whatever you want to call it regretted it for the rest of his life.

We are the land of the free for pete's sake. We're going to have a few klunkers blowing up in our faces.

The point is, freedom gave birth. Without freedom no birth.

Freedom is evil's greastest enemy. That's why evil hates us.

Debra 2-10-2003 10:56

Even this inspires me!
Here is a new Jack Dooley episode.........
I remember when I was a wee nipper. The protestant school was a few streets away (Imagine Victorian terraced streets)
One day a rumour went around our school that the 'Proddy Dogs' were going to wait outside the school at 4 0'clock and beat us all up.
Partnerships and friendships were tested sorely for a few days prior to the big day!
Please don't think that I am trivialising the real trials that await you in the future. It's just the scale and the heartbreak that differs.

I feel for all of you.
For the first 35 years of my life I listened to the sceptics informing me that I lived on an American Aircraft Carrier parked off the coast of the USSR. It was called The USS Great Britain.
Go find one of your kids right now and plant a huge wet kiss on his/her cheek. When they look at you like you've gone nuts....just smile and walk away.
Ed.

Eddie French 2-10-2003 10:54

DEBRA,

The pornography issue was only an example. I mentioned it because it is often brought up by people in the Middle East.

The fact is on a gut level, many in the Islamic world connect American freedoms and American civilization with our vices. They have a distorted impression of our world brought partly about by our own media. They don't see the balance of that because the media does not promote it. If all I knew of the United States was what I saw on network television, most major fashion magazines, and what I heard through pop music, I would reject this culture also and think it a blot on humanity. Fortunately I know that these images are aberrations. Well many in the Middle East don't know that.

I am not disputing anything you have said, DEBRA. But I do not fear them overpowering us and coming over here and forcably enforcing their will on us. That will never happen.

When the United States falls, and most great societies do, it will be of our own doing. The thing that will destroy us in the end will be when we believe that we are entitled to greatness and wealth. It will be when we lose our humility and our ability to examine our actions as a nation. It will be when we lose the ability to have free political and social debate. It will be when we are so drunk with our own wealth an power on individual levels that we no longer care about the corporate good. Selfishness, greed, and personal evil are the bane of any society. These are the real enemies, and the scary thing is that you can't blast them away with rifles or bombs. They reside within the human heart. I believe only a right relationship with God can cure these evils, but when the majority of people forget God and do not seek his truth, and they look at their own selves as God, then the society they inhabit is in trouble.

Rhoda 2-10-2003 10:50

Rhoda:

One more thing. America has citizens from absolutely country on earth. We have immagrants from every country. Word of mouth is more powerful than any form of communication there is, still today.

People don't just think we are only about our actors and movies and songs. They know we are much more than that. Go to our airports and borders some day. Talk to these folks.

They all know America is the land of the free and the home of the brave and yes, and uncle or two peeing in the flower garden.

Debra 2-10-2003 10:38

Howard:

That's a knee slapper or is it an eye poker.

Debra 2-10-2003 10:21

Rhoda

I don't really care who created cruelty. I know it's been around a long time. I respect the Iraqis. I don't respect Osumma. He thought the goings on in Afghanistan were right. It seems like evil always wants the same thing. I can see all the religions and evil sitting around a round table for centuries. All the religions will want faith, hope and love and evil will wants rape and pillage.

Next century religion will want faith, hope and love, evil RAPE AND PILLAGE.

I respect other religions not evil.

Those fundamentalists are not religious people. You can't have both, rape, pillage and faith. It's an impossibility. I have heard arguments to that one. I can't hear another one. They are liars and hippocrates and I don't have once of respect for them. I watched a documentary shortly after, THE DAY. They were saying true Islam was cut out of every minute of the day during Taliban and Osmma rule in Afghanistan. They were just going through the motions five times a day. The rest of the day, RAPE AND PILLAGE.

I saw a famous Iraqi American person speak the other day. I couldn't take my eyes off her. She was amazing. I knew she wasn't Catholic like me. I respected her hugely. What she said about life under Saddam made my nails curl. She wasn't lying. She wants to go back and make a life there,right now she can't. I don't think this is about oil.

I cannot say war or no war. I'm not qualified. I am qualified though to say...... rape,........ pillage...... BAD. It would make a great t-shirt. Wouldn't it?

You mean export pornography? Right? I don't know about pornography. I don't have any research on that. I have one question though. Are we forcing people in other countries to view it? I'm not crazy about porn. If we take man power and times it by problems to solve and divide it by new problems coming every day, where do we put most of our energy. I'm sure it isn't in sex as revolting as porn is. I would love to have time to stamp that out too. Imagine the other side of that argument. I mean let's face it.

Look at the problems I'm having trying to get everyone to agree we don't want our families shredded by rape, murder and kidnappings.

Can you imagine the problems I'd have then. My head would be on a stick by noon.

Palardy's trying to stamp out revolting sex, GET HER.

Rhoda I do respect you immensly.

Debra 2-10-2003 10:16

This somehow makes sense...

There is this guy that was walking by an Insane Asylum one day and
he hears people chanting "thirteen, thirteen, thirteen" and his
curiosity gets the best of him.

So he decides to look through a hole in the fence and as soon as he
puts his face up to the fence someone jabs him in the eye and as he
pulls away in pain he hears the crowd chant "fourteen, fourteen, fourteen"

howard 2-10-2003 10:12

Taylor:

I never got the feeling that you don't care about anything. In fact, since you mention the planes flying over head, I want to mention something that has stuck with me ever since THE DAY.

They halted all flights. THEY SHUT THE SKY DOWN. I still remember how quiet it was.

I had never ever noticed in my life how much brackground noise there was from planes flying over head. I live in the middle of the Northeast. So it's busy here.

The quiet wasn't a comfort at all. My girls noticed and they were only two then. The birds noticed. The squirrels noticed. My dogs noticed. I'd be sitting on the step of my deck and Max would lift his head, and I just knew he was thinking, it's quiet too quiet, and it was. I never realized there was a constant low hum about life.

It created the kind of feeling one would get if they were standing quietly alone in the dark listening to the crickets and a slight rustling noise could be heard making every cricket stop immediately. Imagine the dread in that blanket of quiet. That's how I felt. That's how quiet it was. It's didn't last a second either.

The skys were absolutely still for days and I realized I had never experienced that before. At night it was extra quiet. It seemed like something one would like. It wasn't.

Debra 2-10-2003 9:43

EDDIE,

We must have posted at the same time, for your post was not on the board when I posted mine. Had I read yours first, I would not have posted. You are absolutely right! I hope no one responds to what I wrote, because in the sceme of things it really doesn't matter.

Rhoda 2-10-2003 8:54

JERRY,

You make a good point. Fire power has never been a problem in a war for the United States for a long time. I agree with you and hope that we can avoid this war, because they often do become painful, drug out affairs, and they hurt from within. Plus I do not want to send men and women abroad who will not come home.

DEBRA,

I understand your frustration. The Islamists are determined people. I try not to fear them, but I do respect them and their determination to prevail. But they are mere mortals, human beings just like you and me. Yes, their beliefs make them brutal, but they have not invented cruety or injustice. These things have been with the human planet since the beginning of time.

I really believe that the most powerful weapon people have in this war is prayer. I believe that the people of the United States do have much to atone for. We kill thousands of innocent, unborn children every year. Another thing is we import pornography around the world. We also present a really ugly image of ourselves in our television shows and in our magazines and other media. How does this look to the rest of the world--in particular the Islamic world? They can rightly make the case that this influence is corrupting, and they are right. They have every reason to be outraged. I am at the influences my children have to deal with every day in a society that constantly undermines much of the teaching my husband and I try to instill in them.

I am not saying that any of this justifies the actions taken by Osamma bin Ladin and his friends. I also do not believe at heart that the American people are a perverse and immoral people. But if all they know of us is what they see through our advertising and media, I can understand why they might think we are a great Saten.

The forces of Islamists have been present a long time. It is a movement within the Islamist world that perverts Islam. It is a movement as ferocious as Communisiam or Hitlerism ever was, but for years the United States and the countries of Western Europe refused to take it seriously. In the early days, it might have been countered with dialogue and communication. The lies of these cleric could have been exposed. I think it is too late for that.

The people whom these radical Islamists control are dupped, used, and treated more cruelly than the enemies they blow up. I wish to see these people free. I wish to see them open to new ideas and wish to see them with the ability to make up their own minds with the help of real information.

The only reason I support a war is only for self-defence, because I believe totally that the United States, Israel, and Western Europe are their ultimate targets, but I also believe that if the God of the Universe is not with us in this effort, we will fail.

To me it means that in order for the United States to fight a just war, it must be a just country. Are we? I hope so.

Rhoda 2-10-2003 8:32

I just can't lurk anymore. I am watching the notebook being torn apart by words. Words without the added information of gestures, facial expressions and physical contact!
Words blind us to the meaning of true communication. Communication is so much more than words, and printed black words on a white background are just so much ink on paper.
All of you, take a breath and look inside, You will see that your fears are the same, you just express them differently.
I'm not about to get into an east/west Christian/Muslem debate. That one has been raging since well before Richard's Crusade when he went face to face with Saladan.
Most of you who know me know that my politics stay firmly in my heart and off the notebook. I am not apolitical, I just choose (wisely, so it seems) to keep my politics where they belong. It really hurts to see the way that the ever increasingly precarious situation that this world is rushing into is effecting the good people of this forum. Don't ever say that there is nothing that you can do about it. Write to your MP/Congressman etc. If everybody puts their feelings on paper and sends it in then the politicians will be too busy to fight wars. (Of course, all of the good people of Iraq would also have to do the same. Maybe they could sign theirs 'ANNON')

Think about this for one moment. Not so long ago my daughter (Nikki) had a bit of a row with her brother. She never saw him again to kiss and make up! Now she suffers more than most. Don't fall out over words without smiles.
Take care all.
Eddie

Eddie French 2-10-2003 8:17

Rachael:

Okay

Debra 2-10-2003 7:29

Jerry - you are so right on that level - how different each of us are, as individuals. There are many riveting aspects of heredity vs. habitat, etc...
But what makes us individuals also makes us alike. (As I read it once, "You are unique; just like everyone else" --Author Unknown)
I try to see it on a level where we are all learning beings, here to experience a lifetime of fascinating things! So in that respect, we really are all here for one of two possible reasons: for learning, or for fun.
(Some people consider horror films entertaining, to use film genre choice as a method of allegory. Or is that analogy? Anyway, no matter a person's main reason for being here, it all comes back to those two things.)

I love to hear about your life, your creative works, the choices you have made, the things you have seen, people you love, the hardships, the poignant moments, the wisdom, everything. That goes for everyone here - this is the stuff of life! I like to know how your mind works, what your heart thinks, and what you, as a soul incarnate, find compelling. I love to be blown away by what wonderful people there are in the world, and what amazing thoughts they possess.

That's where I find a great amount of bouyancy, in the currents of everyday. Or, as some movie I've never seen is titled, 'Hope Floats'.

To bring that interest and caring into perspective, I think most people on this planet (and elsewhere, I'm sure) are absolutely worth getting to know.
That's why, when it all comes down to the wire, I'd rather just figure out the best way to gain calm. People get along better.

If I had to, I would fight a good fight to protect the good things about existing here, with all of you for incredible friends on this strange trip through a lifetime. But not all fights are physical, and the flesh is a temporary arrangement. There is a big picture so grand, we can not begin to grasp the meanings, let alone view the whole vista.
(Perhaps this is what draws Tina to the infinite space of sky)

I know, I tend to get uprooted in my thinking and float off into daydream, but this Utopia has a leg in solidity somehwere, or there would be no light to see by. No beacon for those at sea.

*****Please excuse my lucid thinking, but it is so wonderful to stretch out once more since the Notebook is feeling comfortable again********

I am leaving off, with incomplete thoughts and whatnots... but I must go to sleep.

HUGS all around, and may the peace that passeth all understanding be with you.

Heather 2-10-2003 4:57

**Taylor**

Debra: Living in Australia, I guess 911 didn't have the same impact on me. A strong impact nonetheless.
At times I find myself almost holding my breath when I hear a low flying aeroplane overhead. Seems strange since I live on a flight path where planes pass right over my house while descending.

After the Bali Bombing on Oct 12th... Being so close to home, I didn't exactly feel fear about it or even a little anxious. I just feel really, really peeved (putting it nicely) off about how there are people out there who would carry out these DEVASTATING COWARDLY deliberate acts against civillians.

However I'm just a little bit frightened of what will happen next and of more lives being lost and more people losing loved ones.

Well that's enough of my ranting.

Taylor 2-10-2003 4:53

**Taylor**

Teekay: I don't think your comments were deragotory... Or however you spell it.

Suddam Hussein's nickname for the U.N. How about "The Gullible Lot"?

or

"Sylvester" or "Tom" in reference to the cats always chasing after the mice or the Tweetie Birds. But never successful.

Taylor 2-10-2003 4:42

Hi,

Randall - I am so sorry to hear about the nightmare wait you had in ER. I know you didn't want to go into it, but I wish your wife a speedy recovery and trust she is much better now. You too - good luck with the "stones".

Christi - Thanks for the motivation. 500 words it is today. I'm on the case.

Pamlea - Thanks for your warm welcome. Sex and an axe murderer. I can see the Movie Premiere already!! Good luck with it.

Maybe we could all share nicknames that our parents called us. Randall - I loved yours. My Mum called me "Tiddle". Whatever that means???!!!!#

Perhaps the UN Weapons inspectors should do the same with Iraq. Wouldn't it be nice if they all swapped nicknames today! ;-) Any ideas what Saddam's might be??????!!!!

Have a great day.

Richard.

Richard Amazon 2-10-2003 3:43

Heather - I understand where your coming from, about all folks being the same, but on that matter I disagree.

Now don't get me wrong, you can worship who, or whatever you want, as far as I'm concerned you can believe in the gods of the Norsman, you can believe that god is an extratrestreial, or whatever, but we are not the same.

No, we are different, sure deep down we all have one heart and so forth but the way we were raised, what we've been taught, how we interact with others all depends on who raised us, and to a great extent where we were raised that way.

If you were raised in the highlands of Vietnam, you would not only be different from someone who was raised in North Dakota, or Canada, but you would be different from someone who was raised in the lowlands of Vietnam, in fact you would speak a different language, believe in a different God, and have a totally different outlook on life then others.

Much the same those raised in Iraq have a totally different outlook on life then someone raised in Lemmon South Dakota, or London UK.

Even say, Eddie would have a bit different outlook on life then I, so would Americo, and to possibly a lesser extent, you.

It all goes back to the nature/nurture fight. By nature, we are much the same but nurture makes us different. Heck back when I was a kid, it was a total shock to my system when we moved to town. Before that time, all the people I knew had the same last name as mine. They all had parents who drank way too much, and fought like cats and dogs. When we went to town, my sisters and I stayed in the back seat of the car, and if we needed to use the facilities we went into the bar where Mom and Dad were drinking, so all I knew of town life was what happened behind and sometimes in a bar.

When we moved to town, I met people who had a different last name, people who's parents didn't get drunk and fight, parents who sent their kids to church, and who offered to take me along ( ya right! )

When I enrolled in school, it was a total shock because I was no longer the ONLY person in my grade as I had been in country schools, and this school had such wondrous things as movie projectors, reading machines, film strips and slide shows. They had real music rooms, and we SANG, not just at Christmas but every day!

I was so happy when we moved north of the tracks and I could go back to a country school again, even though it meant a bus ride to and from school, I was back at home and while this country school had a few more kids, it was what I had grown up with, and my year in town school fell away into the past.

So if you give it a bit more thought, I think you can understand that we are very different from those in the rest of the world.

Now I would agree, that we have the same hopes and desires as most of the rest of the world, but like most folks we love our homeland (recall Germany's Fatherland and Russia's Mother Russia)

Anyhow I think you know what I'm saying.

Oh and another thing, just for the record, I agree with the President sort of but I really don't want to see another war, because I know what they can and many times do become, despite our superior firepower, look what the communists did to us in Vietnam, and many of them had no training and inadequate weapons, yet the US with all her modern firepower couldn't or didn't defeat those primitive people who were lead by an old man with very old ideals.

Jerry 2-10-2003 0:36

Debra,

If ranting makes you feel any better, I guess it is a good thing. I imagine that from time to time I will bolt up and reply to one thing or another. Of course you can go on to whoever you want about whatever you want. I've said it myself, this is a free zone. Honestly, if I don't like what you have to say I don't have to read it.

Quite honestly I'm worried about you. I'm not saying that to be unkind or mean or imply anything. If I didn't care about you, I wouldn't bother with you, so, given that I've bothered with you so much these past few days, that should tell you something...

I'll try to resist jumping on your back at every turn on this.

Okay?

Rachel 2-10-2003 0:01

Rachael:

I do want to say this one more thing responding to my going on since 911 with the peoms and all. Am I safe to assume I can still speak to others on the notebook about his topic after this last post to you. I don't mean this is my last post to you, just on this topic.

Anyway, am I scared? Yes! Was I scared before 911? Not really. So yes, they won that battle they made me sacred.

What I am really scard of isn't so much them marching into America and taking over. I still think I'm reasonably safe there.

What I'm scared of is our young boys and young women of the military going to war and some not coming back, some coming back broken on the outside and worse, some broken on the inside. You better believe I'm scard of that. That's real. We are an inch away from that. I have heard stories as far back as the Russian war in Afganistan right up until now and even from the Chehs. This particular enemy breaks every rule in the Geneva Convention and some that haven't even been written yet, from disembowling people to things our minds refuse to think up.

I'm scared for those young boys and girls as if they were my own family. You know why? They are. The human family. I'm as worried as for our so called enemy too. I have listened to stories of people from Japan and America getting together after that war and crying for what happened there, grown men. You better believe I'm scared

And for that he has won.

YES HE HAS!

That rotten bastard!

Debra 2-9-2003 23:35

RAchael:

We're friends. WE were friends before and we stil are.

We both have a boat load of kids and spend from sun up to sun down taking care of them. We live the same lives practically.

You don't want to talk about we won't.

I won't apoligize for responding to my world. I'm not a cardboard cut out you know.

Debra 2-9-2003 23:09

Debra,

You ever read the saying "don't believe everything you read?" You need to turn off the news and take a walk or something.

Also, if you are so into the news take a look at what happens in the streets of North American every day. We have rape, murder you name it. It isn't even done my crack pots, it is done by regular every day folks.

It is a big bad world. I know that. I also know that it can be a wide beautiful world.

I don't want to do this again Debra. Your next post on this matter will not be likely to get any attention from me. If all you can do is fixate upon this, then go to. You've been at it pretty much nonstop since 9.11. Poems and dreams and who knows what else. In your case terror has won the war. You aren't really living any more, you are dying, paralized with fear. You've let them have exactly what they wanted. Maybe that is why you hate them so much.

Nite Deb.

Try to take care of yourself.

Rachel 2-9-2003 23:05

Geeze I left for a few days and look what happened. That comment about taking sons and raping daughers came from reality. It happened in Afganistan daily. The people who knocked down the twin towers lived this way. They loved it. I don't create the news I just report it.

That's where I got that, from reality. If they get what they want they will create that same hell here. That's what I'm saying. Yes, Usoma has stated he and his followers will not rest until we are all practicing Islam. That's what he said.

I know many a woes have happened by all religions and mine too. I know. Of course I know.

I don't want to go back to those times. That's what I'm saying.

I don't hate the Iraqies. I think they are a people who show great strength. I look forward to the day when they are our friends.

I try very hard not to talk about things I don't know much about. I have been paying attention to plenty.

My question was he has put his cards on the table. He Osuma, I don't care if that's how his name is spelled, has stated they won't rest until the world is all Islam.

WHAT DO WE DO?

I am very proud to be an American. Of course some Americans have embarrassed the country. It's just like being proud of your family. There's always an uncle some where peeing in the flower garden.

America is a place that has every country recognized, every religion recognized, every value recognized. We pulled if off. We all live here together under one flag. We get along for the most part. We help every country that gets into trouble because we ARE every country. Well from what I see we try to help where ever possible. Do we still have problems, yes. Every country has their problems. But we are still a land that embraces freedom for all. I love that about us. I really do.

What I see is a dictator rising from dirt looking directly at us. He showed us in Afganistan what he sees for our citizens. I told you. You don't what to hear it again. He put his cards on the table and WHAT DO WE DO.

Just answer that. That's all I want.

What do we do?

Debra 2-9-2003 22:41

Randall

Teekay...

My middle name flashed all over the internet doesn't bother me. Now, Teekay, listen real close. Just between us ... (whisper) I don't wish the other notebookers to hear. My mom (look left, then right) called me Lynnie Ben. But for Gods sake don't let anyone know. I do have my reputation to uphold!!! My Lord, no telling what Richard might do!!! :-)Actually Mom called me a lot of things! But always with love.

R

Randall 2-9-2003 22:01

Rhoda,

I hope we don’t go at it again either. I however can not promise. I wouldn’t do that. I try not to make a promise unless I am sure I can keep it. I don’t like the idea that I made you teary-eyed. You should get a picture of me and shoot some darts at it or something. That might be a good idea. It’s okay to be pissed with me. I’m okay with that. I send you a hug too. Here, have a bowl of my cheese and potato soup. It about soothes anything.

Heather,

In my area, it isn’t so much that folks are high-minded, they are just high (merry laughter). I can’t count the grow ops that get busted around here. One was busted right next door to me shortly before I moved in. We got this house because the owner said that with all of our kids we wouldn’t have room to grow any pot (he also owns the place next door where the grow up was).

Hey there Teekay,

My heads on straight? You sure I’m not pulling a Linda Blair on you ;o) My house is pretty. I still wonder what I’m doing here when I drive up. It doesn’t seem like a house I would live in. It seems that a lady in fine cloths should reside in this place, not me in my mud smudged jeans and T-shirts. I’ll need to get a pic on disk so I can send it off to you. Just think Victorian, huge, green with white trim, wrap around verandah, set nice and deep, porch swing that overlooks the playground which has a little playhouse on the second level that is a replica of the big house. It’s cute. I think the thing I love most is the rope swing in the front field area. There isn’t much like a pull on that. Sometimes playing like a kid is better than anything.

Hi Heather,

I also happen to love a lot of Statesians. I have whaps of cousins, a grandmother (Southern Beauty that could take your breath away), aunties and uncles all over the states.

Rachel 2-9-2003 21:55

RANDALL

Pamela...

You know I like/use quotes, because in some instances I'm lazy or choose to keep my mind in neutral. :-) After all it is Sunday. I always practice conservation, mental and physical. On a lighter note I have just returned from a five hour stay in the local ER. No, not my "stones" but my wife was ill. When it rains it pours. We sat, well, she lay across two chairs very sick for two hours. After an eternity we made it into the ER, for another two hours waiting for treatment. During this interval I crossed swords with two nurses over my wife's treatment, informed the ER doctor (no, not George thank God) that a hydration should have been already started, and debated quite seriously whether I should pick up a nearby phone, dial 911 and ask for an ambulance!!!

(Sigh) Well, I'm to tired to get into it and here is the quote I promised as referenced to my thinking these days.

"My dear Watson, there we come into those realms of conjecture where the most logical mind may be at fault."

Sherlock Holmes.

I believe this is from ... The Adventure of the Empty House.

Night all. You too Richard. :-)

Randall

Randall 2-9-2003 21:49

HEATHER: Cool! What kind of jewel?
Anyone getting a strong sense of deje vu....de jevu.....dejevu.....day jar voo.
Yeesh, French!

Teekay 2-9-2003 19:12

TAYLOR: The end of my last post to you sounded a bit derogatory - it definitely wasn't meant to be.

Teekay 2-9-2003 19:10

Oh my gosh! What have I done! I used the wrong brackets. I just wanted to wish a {Big Hug} to RACHEL, and I changed the font of the Notebook.

Forgive me, JACK.

Rhoda 2-9-2003 18:46

Teek, you are a true jewel! HAHAHAHAHA~!! I just about spewed Cola out of my nose when I read your post. (Read that as a good thing) Just hilarious!

Heather 2-9-2003 18:44

RACHEL,

I agree that we probably have more than common than not. I am all teary-eyed. <> Let's don't fight again.

HEATHER,

Absolutely! War does not solve everything, and we must never do it hastily. I really hope it does not come to that, and think there is always hope. Something good might happen yet and many innocent men and women in all nations involved won't be called upon to lose their lives.

Trying to work out some problems with my novel. I signed up for a conference the end of April and I hope to have the novel finished so I can pitch it during an editor appointment.

Rhoda 2-9-2003 18:44

TAYLOR: Even though he's the bad guy, and you don't like what he does, he's something you've given life to, and as such should feel an understanding of. You should know this guys motivations, you should know how he came to think as he does, know what drives him, and unless you do your bad guy is going to be dull and one dimensional and won't convince anybody of anything.
He might be a bad guy, but he's human, and in every human there is something we can all relate to.
So once you know where your bad guy is coming from, you won't have any problem with some of the stuff he does between the pages, and he might even teach you something :-)

Teekay 2-9-2003 17:54

Hmmmm. If we Northerners are truly high-minded, isn't that a GOOD THING? I'm not talking about sticking noses up in the air and being snotty, as if we are better somehow than the US. Nah. There just aren't as many Canadians per square mile in Canada as there are Americans in the US. There's a lot to be said for more breathing space.
We would be much more like the US if we had as high a population, simply because so many of us have similar ways of life and similar beliefs. Oh, and we have a lot of the same restaurants. HA HA HAHAHAAAAA!!!

Heather 2-9-2003 17:46

Ah, good, you're all up :-D

RACHEL: I agree with you.

RANDALL: I agree with you.

RHODA: I agree with you.

There are too many shades of grey, at the end of the day I'm just gonna have to go with my gut feeling, after all God gave it to me to save me from the beasties and other such hazards.

RACHEL: I always knew there was something more to you than the kisses and hugs, and I'm so glad you finally shared. You have your head on straight, your heart in the right place, so I think it's safe to say that you could never show us more of yourself than we'd care to see, :-)
I do envy you your turrett. Your house sounds gorgeous - any pictures?

CHRSITI: I hear it.......it's coming.....closer.....closer. Do you think it'll find me if I hide under the bed?
Okay, I'm taking you up on your challenge.

PAMELA: Hee hee, bags not running the world. Can you imagine the stress!
And can you imagine a president with PMT. Not that I'm personally susceptible to it, but I'm not going to be running the world am I?
I think maybe men are good in the front line. Admittedly, they have a high level of testosterone, but it usually runs along a fairly smooth path (unless you mix in some mental disorders, or past childhood traumas)
And running the world would be terribly squelching to creativity.
I myself would prefer to run it indirectly when I was in the mood. I would say, "Darling, if you promise to pass legislation on the abolishment on tree lopping in the state forest, I promise not to spend too much on the credit card."

RICHARD: Lynn huh? Methinks that RANDALL is defintiely not going to want to be your best friend anymore.

RANDALL: Never fear, my Grandpa's name was Phillis,(it was meant to be Phillip) and he lived to a ripe old age.
HAHAHAHAHA, I'm only kidding, ain't nuthin' wrong with Lynn, it's better that &Debbie, and a sight prettier than Marion - that was John Wayne's middle name (I think)

And now for some absolutely stunning news that will have you all reeling.......

huh? What's that

Oh sorry, wrong board

Feelin' insane today. Wish I was runnin' the world today, but I gotta go take out the garbage.

Teekay 2-9-2003 17:40

Hey Rachel - I'll have to drink a lot of cups of tea to pee a line around my territory, but your thoughts on how truly 'civilized' people are on the whole, well, they're not wrong as far as I'm concerned. Anger and fear are still largely motivational. Fear especially. Heck, that's why we buy insurance, isn't it? Anyway, it isn't necessarily all about sides, but it does come down to that at some point - as the old saying goes, "If you're not for us, you're against us." And we are both for the US if it comes down to it. Whether all of us here agree or not, if push comes to shove I will stand by the US. I happen to love a good lot of them! LOL

Rhoda, Randall - I totally understand your points, and want you to know that. Maybe I'm really an eternal hippie - I'd much rather avoid war at all costs. I just don't find war solves everything - and maybe it's just that war has always been such a huge sacrifice for such little gain. That doesn't have much bearing over what war might be like if it happens in the very near future. Still, I'd rather avoid it, as I'm sure many of us would.
There has to be other ways of solving the entire mess. I just don't happen to hold any keys of brilliance at the moment.

And now....I should go back and re-read just to be sure I was even responding to what was said!

Heather 2-9-2003 17:40

Rhoda,

I do not dislike you either. I wish you and your family the best. I wish you security in you homeland. I respect what you've said in your most recent post and think that you and I can agree to disagree, though, I doubt we really disagree all that much.

All the best to you.

Rachel 2-9-2003 17:29

RACHEL,

It was not a threat. Only an example. I am sorry I took the bite. I really should have stayed out of the discussion. I have not made nearly as many posts on this subject as RANDALL or DEBRA has. Am I angry? For the moment, yes. Am I insulted. You bet. Do I have feelings? Yes, I do and I will not deny it.

I do not dislike you. I never did. I have no hard-feelings toward you at all. I wish you and your family every good thing.

I just despute some of your ideas, and all you can do is respond with your own little brand of hatred.

Yes this is a free board, and anyone can say what they please. I would have it no other way, but I find your posts rather unpleasant now, and as long as it goes on like this, I have no desire to post here again, because it is pointless.

I love you all.

Rhoda 2-9-2003 16:14

Rhoda,

What a surprise, you stewing for a fight... Anyway, I will call it hate. Perhaps the reason you respond so heatedly to me is because you know in your heart that I have a point, one which you do not like. I find that any time a person responds with the sort of intensity that I’m seeing here it is because you’ve challenged something deep inside of them. For that I’m happy. I hope I have made you think. Feel free to respond to me Rhoda, in particular if you have an actual argument to present and not just repeating hate/fear declarations. I’ve read those enough. Why would you knock on my door and hit me in the mouth is a better question. I don’t live my life in such a way that would invite that sort of action. That is why I do not fear it. If you came to my door to hit me, I would block you, disable you and try to establish what the issue was. That is, if I knew it was you. Your post about people coming to my door is crazy talk. I think you are only sick of this topic because not everyone will agree with you. I’m tired of listening to the rants of a few on this NB. So, here it is. I won’t debate who has more compassion for who, that is also foolishness. I’m tired of it, do you hear me Rhoda? That doesn’t mean I’m going to duck out and wait for the smoke to clear (that solves lots doesn’t it?) What it means is that if anyone spouts off about something I don’t agree with I also will feel free to disagree. So just buck up and accept it. This is a free zone, Rhoda. Free for all, even high minded Northerns.

Good day to you.

Rachel

Rachel 2-9-2003 16:01

RACHEL,

Call it hate all you wish. I do not care what Canada does, I only detest the overwhelming self-righteousness on the Northern Border.

You said some pretty provocative and ugly things yourself, things I did not even respond to.

You make a point some of us do not agree with. Fine. I respect your opinion even though it doesn't line up with mine.

Hatred has nothing to do with it. If I knocked on your door and hit you in the mouth, how much love and mercy would you have for the moment. You would probably hit me right back. What if someone were to threaten your family? Would you feel so loving and so high-minded and ask yourself while wringing your hands. "Whatever did I do to piss this person off?" I don't think that would be your response.

No I do not hate Islamists. I have more compassion for these people than you know, and I think I have a lot more compassion for them than you. I hope they back off and try some sort of dialogue. I hope they renounce their violence against my country. I hope we can live in peace, but if that is not possible, then yes, we must fight. Self preservation demands it.

And that is all I wish to say on the subject. Anyone on this Notebook can call me any name you wish.

I am off this thing for the next week or two. I have a book to finish and I have a family to take care of, and I am really sick of this discussion.

Rhoda 2-9-2003 15:41

Christi,

Hi you (smiles and hugs).

Rachel 2-9-2003 14:23

How could I have left Pamela out! Sorry! And you too, Debra! Like Teekay, I'm beginning to regret naming names. There are many more out there. Gariess, you've got one hell of a novel/short story collection in you. "The Bulb in my Shorts", by Gary Souza. And Americo, Jon, and Pussy, oh my! And Allein, the inspiration for my recent weight loss! And Mary! How I do miss you!

And to the exclaimation !!! purists I say, nyah!

Christi 2-9-2003 13:58

I think the way to solve all the problems of the world is to let women run it, the men have done a piss-poor job. They can't help it, I know, it's all that testosterone befuddling their brains (located below the waist) and they get into these international weenie-wagging contests. Okay, okay, if women ran things we might have some problems a few days of every month, but hopefully not all at the same time, which would no doubt result in global destruction. (What's the difference between a woman during PMS and a pitbull? Lipstick.)

A god by any other name, like a rose, would remain what it is. Whatever may happen (including nothingness) when we leave this place will not be altered by what we believe or what name we choose to call it while we are here.

Hi, Richard, welcome to this group, which I have recently joined myself. In answer to your inquiry about members, I was lucky enough to have a novel published ages ago and am now working on re-writing a rough draft of another, it is a supernatural, psychological thriller with an ax murderer and sex. Perhaps you can guess that this is pretty much a commercial endeavor although I do plan to get a little of my own spiritual/philosophical ideas in there, the supernatural aspects are not of the horror genre, but something that could very well be real (just not physical). I will check out your link later, today took quite a bit of time just to catch up on recent postings.

Randall, of course we're still friends, I consider everyone on this site to be a new friend even if I don't agree with what they say. If everyone agreed on everything, it would be a boring world indeed. I do think your responses to me and to Richard were a little extreme, do you think it is possible that you are transferring some anger (perhaps from 30-year-old nightmares you were made to endure) onto others?

Rachael, re: "the call of the wild", my two Canadian girlfriends and I had a lot of fun but I haven't been wild for three decades (but for occasional lapses). Actually, I misquoted her, it was "the call of the Yukon" and I still feel it, would love to take that train trip that goes across Canada.

Debra, about your prophecy dream, years ago I saw a show about an organization that recorded such things and tried to stop catastrophes from happening. I don't remember their name but maybe you could track them down on the net.

I am going to try to ignore what is going on in the world right now since there isn't a damn thing I can do about it anyway. I will try to practice love (have taken a little time off writing to make architectural drawings of a plan of mine to donate to a man building houses for indigent Indians), try to enjoy the blue of the sky and the hug of a friend and not let myself get contaminated by hatred.

Pamela 2-9-2003 13:45

~Christi~

Whew! *choke, gasp!* It's gettin' smokey in here. Put down your arms guys and take a breather. One, two, three, inhale .... exhale .... ahhhhh. My intention is not to demean or poke fun at the debate (debacle?) going on, but I think we all need to count to ten and shift into friendlier tones. Not to say that friends can't debate, but it does take time to heal after such weighty convos.

Richard, Welcome! Blessed be any who comes here to talk about writing. I agree with Mel that that is when I get most inspired here--that and posts like Tina's and Teekay's and Mel's last ones.

Teekay, It's coming ... can you hear it? A whirling whisper on the wind that sweeps ever closer until you can finally hear its cry. "Finish me, finish me, oh please won't you pick me up and give me life again!" THOTH calls!

Heather, Yep, there it is ... hell, I can hear it from hundreds of miles away! Symphony, begging for your artist's touch!

Tina, You've heard it for months now and it's right at your door. Shadows is coming for you! Oh the agony of these haunted manuscripts. They're waiting, and so are all of we, the world, to read each one of their pages.

And you, Mel! And Randall, Mark, and sunny Sunny! And Carol! And Rachel! And Eddie, dear Eddie! And Howard! And Jerry, yes, you too Jerry! And you, Richard! And, oh gosh, I know I'm forgetting tons ... and me! And all of you, you know who you are, whether you post or lurk. With the continuous support of our friends we can complete these and many other novels and stories, and grow from the experience, and begin to come into the wisdom that years of writing and living have to offer. Am I being cheesy? Who cares!

WOW, Tina! You've descibed Arizona better than I have ever been able to do. I guess it sometimes takes a fresh, new point of view to show it to you. Suddenly I begin to see the beauty in my home that was always there. :) Thanks, chum.

How I wish I lived closer to the amazing friends I've made here, but then I remember that I'm being greedy. I'm lucky to live in a time when it was possible to meet them in the first place.

Sorry, Sunny, about our lack of email addies. Most of us used to post them regularly, but I think we just plain forget now.

I'm giving everyone here an assignment today, to be accomplished by the end of Monday, the 10th (should you wish to accept it). It's small and manageable: Five hundred words on your novel manuscript or short story or essay or journal. It does take nerves of steel some days. But when you open up a rusty old document or pick up that tattered notebook you could get inspired by (strangely enough) yourself.

Ready ... set ... GO!

Christi 2-9-2003 13:39

Randall

Oh Jerry! You're too bad!!! :-)

R

Randall 2-9-2003 13:06

Randall

FYI everybody...

PLEASE NOTE DATE: Heather and other Canadians...I disagree with Rush's statement on Canada. This comment was posted before the fine Canadian men were killed by friendly fire.

IT'S HARDER TO SPREAD GOOD THAN EVIL

Rush Limbaugh

September 11, 2002

In this country and the world today, there are many people who agree with the bizarre statements made by Nelson Mandela in Newsweek. Many people, including most students and many elected officials, agree that the United States is imperialist and that our military is the focus of evil in the modern world. The truth, of course, is that we're the most giving nation in the world.

We have no empire. We do not invade or annex. We liberate. Despite the talk of the resources we use, we use those resources to feed, clothe and protect the world. When Nelson Mandela or one of these terrorists sees America, they ask, "How did they do this in less than 230 years? We've been around here for centuries, and we still can barely muster working toilets." It is this that the terrorists see, folks – and it makes them envious.

Yes, envy. They look at the U.S. and see what they thought they were supposed to become. That's what they thought their religion promised them. I'm not speaking of all of Islam here or Muslims in general. I'm speaking of the militant extremists, particularly from the Wahabi sect, who looked at those towers and said, "How did they do that when we can't even pave a road?" If I were a citizen of a country that had been around thousands of years, and was still basically a sand pit, when I looked at America, I would want to come here, not to tear this country down.

DO THESE PEOPLE THINK AMERICA IS JUST AN ACCIDENT?

If these people ever stop blaming America, they'd have to blame themselves. That's how somebody got hold of these hijackers when they were very young, and filled them with hate at Hate is an instinct. You don't even have to know anybody to hate them. But love, it's not an emotion you can turn on and off. You either do or you don't. You have to work at liking people. Disliking them - hating them, for some – is easy. It's the same thing with good and evil, and that's why it's hard work. But, it's worth it, because who would you rather see win out day-to-day, year-to-year, in eternity - good or evil? Question answered. They understand the desire to be free, but they don't understand how it relates to capitalism.

Consider the fascinating piece in Wednesday's Christian Science Monitor if you agree with this notion that this country is evil and imperialistic.

The theme is its opening line: "Compared with past great powers, say the Mongols or Romans, America wields a light touch." We rebuilt Europe and Japan. We let the Philippines and Puerto Rico opt for independence.

We didn't stay in any of the nations where we've sent troops to go to war. We even paid for the land we won from Mexico in our war with them, at a time when some (even Mexicans!) called for the United States to absorb all of that nation into our territory. Imagine if Canada's neighbors were Iraq or Nazi Germany or the USSR or imperial Japan or any powerful empire. Would they sleep so well at night? The Boy Scouts could crush Canada with zero casualties, yet we let them opt to keep welcoming in terrorists and to thumb their noses at us on Iraq.

"But Rush, if good is so good, why is it so hard to triumph over evil? Why is good content with what it is, even as evil metastasizes?" Look, we're trying to spread freedom, goodness and democracy in the Mideast. Yet evil seems to be able to take over these places in a snap, even in parts of this country. Goodness always is going to be the tougher battle, just like doing the right thing is always going to be much harder than doing the wrong thing, just like love is always going to be a little harder than hate.

Hate is an instinct. You don't even have to know anybody to hate them. But love, it's not an emotion you can turn on and off. You either do or you don't. You have to work at liking people. Disliking them - hating them, for some – is easy. It's the same thing with good and evil, and that's why it's hard work. But, it's worth it, because who would you rather see win out day-to-day, year-to-year, in eternity - good or evil? Question answered

Enough said...folks this is the why and why for.

Randall

Randall 2-9-2003 13:04

Ok, I understand Heather, but I still think Patriotism is a good thing, at least most of the time.

Anyhow how about a politically uncorrect joke to get things boiling a bit more, got this from the "Other" Jerry Ericsson today:

At a small air terminal in the Texas Panhandle, three strangers are awaiting
their shuttle flight. One is a Native American passing through from
Oklahoma. Another, a local ranch hand on his way to Ft. Worth for a stock
show. The third passenger is an Arab student, newly arrived at the Texas oil
patch from the Middle East.
>
The cowpoke leans back in his chair, crosses his boots on a magazine table,
tips his big sweat-stained hat forward over his face. The wind outside blows
tumbleweeds and the old windsock flaps, but no plane comes.
>
To pass the time they strike up a conversation on recent events and the
discussion drifts to their diverse cultures. Soon the Westerners learn that
the Arab is a devout Muslim. The conversation falls into an uneasy lull.
Finally, the Native American clears his throat and softly, he speaks: "Once
my people were many, now we are few."
>
The Muslim raises an eyebrow and leans forward, "Once my people were few,"he
sneers, "and now we are many. Why do you suppose that is?"
>
The Texan shifts the toothpick to one side of his mouth and from the
darkness beneath his Stetson says "Cause we ain't played Cowboys and
Muslims...yet"
-----------

Randall you might like that one, got this one just this second from another of my old cop buddies (he still lives in North Dakota by the way)
North Dakota Found To Be Harboring Nuclear Missiles

BISMARCK, ND—The stage was set for another international showdown Monday, when chief U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix confirmed that the remote, isolationist state of North Dakota is in possession of a large stockpile of nuclear missiles.

"Satellite photos confirm that the North Dakotans have been quietly harboring an extensive nuclear-weapons program," said Blix, presenting his findings in a speech to the U.N. Security Council. "Alarmingly, this barely developed hinterland possesses the world's most technologically advanced weapons of mass destruction, capable of reaching targets all over the world."

After initially offering no comment on the report, North Dakota officials admitted to having a stockpile of 1,710 warheads at two military sites and confirmed that the state has been home to an active nuclear-weapons-development program for decades.

Blix called the revelation a "terrifying prospect for the world at large."

Within hours of the announcement, U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan urged North Dakota to abandon its program.

"This is clearly an excessive number of weapons for a place like North Dakota to possess," Annan said. "In this post-Cold War environment, we should be moving away from nuclear proliferation among developing states."

European leaders also spoke out in opposition to North Dakota's weapons program.

"North Dakota, still in its cultural infancy, cannot be trusted to responsibly handle weapons of mass destruction," French President Jacques Chirac said. "We are talking about a place that doesn't even have a Thai restaurant or movie theater that shows foreign films, but still they have the resources to build thousands of warheads. Do not believe their claims of being 'The Peace Garden State.'"

According to Chirac, North Dakota's development of nuclear arms "represents a grave threat to peaceful states the world over, none more so than its longtime neighbor and rival across the 45th Parallel, South Dakota."

"The South Dakotans, while a simple people themselves, are friendly, hospitable, and far more in touch with the outside world," Chirac said. "Many people, myself included, have passed through and seen the Badlands and Mount Rushmore. North Dakota, on the other hand, is a bleak, racially homogeneous state that few people ever enter or exit."

After a joint meeting of the French and German cabinets, German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder said the two nations "agree that this situation must be rectified" and implored North Dakota to cease its uranium-enrichment program immediately.

"We have opened the door to talks," Schroeder said. "But, unfortunately, North Dakota seems unwilling to engage with the world community at this time."

According to Blix, North Dakota is home to 500 Minuteman III ICBMs and 50 Peacekeeper missiles, giving it one of the heaviest concentrations of the weapons on earth. The biggest discovery made by U.N. inspectors, Blix said, was a missile field at Minot Air Force Base, where they found an "almost unbelievable" stockpile of warheads.

The rogue state was also found to possess enormous stockpiles of fissile material.

"North Dakota could have as much as 75 metric tons of weapons-grade uranium and 8 metric tons of weapons-grade plutonium," Blix said. "Just 55 pounds of uranium are needed to construct a simple nuclear weapon. Do the math-—the prospects are terrifying."

The man at the center of the controversy is North Dakota's leader, Gov. John Hoeven. Having risen to power in 2000 after amassing tremendous wealth in the private sector, Hoeven lives a life of comfort and excess inside the heavily patrolled North Dakota governor's mansion, a lavish dwelling paid for entirely by the state, while many of his people engage in subsistence farming.

Some suspect that Hoeven is using the nuclear program as a bargaining chip to gain badly needed economic benefits for his state. Hardly at the forefront of technology in other aspects, North Dakota has a largely rural population and a child-poverty rate of 14 percent—-a fact critics have been quick to point out.

"North Dakotans live a horrible life of isolation and deprivation, struggling to grow crops in a hostile, sub-zero climate while their indifferent government routinely prioritizes bolstering the state's military might," BBC World correspondent Caroline Eagan said. "There are people starving there, and yet high-tech weapons laboratories and military bases abound. It's deplorable."

Added Eagan: "And, no big surprise, the U.S. played a major role in arming this place. I hear most of the missiles are American-made."

Many U.S. citizens have expressed fear, some realizing for the first time that North Dakota has thousands of weapons capable of reaching any major American city within minutes.

"It is absolutely frightening that there are all these weapons of mass destruction practically in my backyard," said Karen Stiles of Moorhead, MN. "Do we really know enough about these people who have their finger on the button that could kill millions?"

Added Stiles: "How did our elected officials let this happen?"

Jerry Jerry's home page 2-9-2003 12:33

Heather,

Is this really about sides? I think it is about lack of education all around. Everyone thinks they know what everyone else is about. If push came to shove I of course would stand by the Americans. Honestly, their way of life is a whole lot closer to my way of life than anything I've observed from the other side. At least our way of life in a capitalistic, surface sort of way. I would stand by the states because they are our neighbours, because I think they are well intended. That however brings back the old trite saying about things done with the best intentions. It all seems to pointless and stupid. We rush into things, guided by our guts, no better than men with clubs from out past. It all turns into grunts and killing. Crap! There just has to be a better way. If there isn't maybe we should stop pretending that we are all "civilized" societies and face up to the fact that we are really only savage animals fighting for territory and dominance.

Rachel 2-9-2003 12:32

Sunny - sorry, I forget to post my email sometimes!
Richard - thanks!! Stick around - it's not always this heated over politics in here.
:o)
Rachel - I agree with you. Lack of education fuels hatred indeed.

Heather 2-9-2003 12:03

Hi Teekay,

It was nice to have a post from you. You bust me up. I've been chewing a hole in my lip for years trying not to respond, or I respond with a poem, or something else. I'm worn out with being indirect and quiet. I'm afraid you could see more of my heart that you care to ;o)

Hope the day is good to you.

Rachel

Rachel 2-9-2003 12:02

Randall

Richard...I stand on my post of 2/8/2003.

Randall

Randall 2-9-2003 12:01

Hi Deb,

You are repeating yourself. You are spouting the same hate over and over. You’ve got nothing to back it up. You have no philosophical stance. There is no rational argument that I can pick out of your words. All I read is the ranting of a fearful woman. I understand that. I’m okay with that. However, when you try to present it as an argument, it is going to fall on its face. You don’t have a clue and you don’t want one. You are happy to wrap your hate and fear around yourself, snuggle up in it and blame, blame, blame. Well, go to girl. Give a lovin to your ethnocentric heart. Don’t take a moment to think about cultural relativism (which, incidentally does have its flaws as well - I would be happy to debate them with you, if you investigated the matter). I want to tell you something else, then I am going to try my best to stop, as I am tired of answering in new ways to your repeating hate posts. What you are writing here is hate literature. It is full of spite, fear, anger and prejudice. It is revolting.

On the basis of my observations of you in the past I do hold a warm place for you in my heart. I however find that I am recoiling form you more and more, as one would recoil from a snake.

Rhoda,

As your post reads quite like those of Debra, you can apply my recent replies to that as well.

My sons taken away, my baby girls raped, my husband killed, my God kidnapped. That's why our ancestors left Europe all those years ago. All I see is the beast has followed us.

I'm sorry if I'm getting radical.

The situation seems to call for it.

If they win, our original consitition can be used for toliet paper. If they win, I can see it happening in my minds eye. Just like the distruction of the Budda statutes. They were older than our consititution.
Debra 2-8-2003 12:58
------------------------------------------------------------------------
In Afganistan women lost their sons, from ad little as two yrar old boys up. From all the information they had they were never going to see their sons again, ever. I remember my sons at two. They were attached to me like a sticky bun. We were together all the time. Mothers just like us, watched as these little guys were pulled off their hips and dragged away screaming.

Their daughters were regulary raped. If women were caught teaching their daughters how to read and write they were beaten or killed. Their husbands were routinely murdered in front of them. ONce their husbands were dead they were forbidden to work. They could only beg for money, covered from head to to in cloth. If they did leave the house they were beaten by laughing, cackling, bearded men. They just beat them and laugh and laugh. That was life in Afganistan under taliban. Usoma thought it was heaven on earth.

They are saying America join that club or fight. In fact either the last statement or the one before that Osuma stated he and his followers wouldn't rest until every one joined them.

Just tell me do you want to join that club? If you don't tell me, does it sound like heaven on earth? Does it sound like a loving God? Does it sound like anyone's God?

I would never preach death to other religions. I have never, would never. I'm saying no land pirates.

THEY DON'T BEIEVE IN GOD. That's my feeling and I'm sticking with it.

Still love you.

Rachel 2-9-2003 11:58

JERRY - I did not say that a patriotic person follows his leaders blindly (though that's a possibility) what I said was that patriotism blinds people in general to the fact that everyone on earth is basically the same. Patriotism divides people into 'Americans' and 'Englishmen' and 'Africans', or 'Cubans', and you get the idea. Patriotism means we only see our own as being 'right'. We see only our own as being on the 'right side'.
The truth is, dividing up the world into countries has made divisions in the minds of men.
We are all children of one God.
Some people think His name is Mohammad, some think it Jehovah, some think it is Buddha....

Heather 2-9-2003 11:50

JERRY - I know patriotism is not just an American thing. It is part of the reason the Iraqis don't want to back down, too. What is the reason people are so patriotic that they would chase the enemy through hectares of jungle and face unknown danger and hardship? Pride. Losing damages that pride. Can't be on the losing team - must put everything on the line in order to win, or die trying.
That thinking is fuelled by patriotism. No matter who you are or where you come from.

Heather 2-9-2003 11:44

Hey Deb,

This fighting is about history. If you want to understand it, you are going to have to read back futher than Sept 11th. What do I suggest? I suggest you learn what the cause of this is, instead of trying for some easy fix, some easy blame. I think that if you read your history you would find that it isn’t other religions who have issues with the Gods of others, it is our own. The Christ religion has beaten and abused the world for a very long time. People who don’t appreciate the history of that, can not appreciate the level of animosity that some can feel towards the Christ God folk. Who did what to whom first? You wouldn’t like the answer Deb, nope, you wouldn’t like it at all. You don’t know the war that is being fought here, that is half the problem. You think it is about the twin towers, it isn’t about that, only for the U.S. There have been other layers and textures that have been added to the religious aspect of animosity and it is those that have managed to blur the issue into a mess that on the surface seems to be impossible to solve. My answer, is education, understanding, compassion and level heads. That is my suggestion. That is my answer.

There's one question and only one.

If you don't want that life and the land pirates are not taking no for an answer THEN WHAT DO YOU DO?

They are forcing that question on the table NOW and they are forcing the answer. If they should be free to have their God then so should we all be.

THEY DON'T AGREE WITH THAT.

What do you suggest?

Rachel 2-9-2003 11:44

pa·tri·ot
(click to hear the word) (ptr-t, -t)
n.
One who loves, supports, and defends one's country.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[French patriote, from Old French, compatriot, from Late Latin patrita, from Greek patrits, from patrios, of one's fathers, from patr, patr-, father; see pter- in Indo-European roots.]

Jerry 2-9-2003 11:25

Debra,

For clarity, I have posted the words I am responding to below. I will respond to each of your comments. I can’t resist responding to this sort of foolishness.
I wonder what that says about me?

Your post suggests that as the U.S. was fighting for their lives on home soil, not just chasing shadows and seeking scape goats, but having a visible enemy, on their land (not chasing shadows in a land not their own). You are saying that if Americans were being killed by invaders, who were going door to door killing men, women and children, that we in Canada would sip tea and play chess, then in the evening tip a few beer. Then when it was all over for you and the invader came to our door we would say “Oh dear, oh my, whatever will we do. We never expected this.” Deb, you read like a fool in your post. I doubt you can see that though. The loyalty and courage of Canadians is above reproach. Read your history and you’ll know that. then again, maybe your history leaves out the parts where other people do good things. Seems that it must if you can have the intestinal fortitude to post such a blatantly offensive, rude post. What a simplistic, foolish post. And, for crying in a bucket, stop romanticizing the enemy. They are not Pirates. They are fundamentalists, just like countless crack pot religious/political groups all over the United States. The only difference between them and the American fundamentalists, is that they got organized!

Rachael:

Just for one minute imagine this scene. Imagine they came here to America and defeated us. Remember the USA we have never bothered you guys for one minute??? So any way, they defeated us. We women have had all our clothes burned and replaced with beige burcas and live in houses with our windows painted black. They raped all of us and the pretty ones they forced into prostituation. They steal our money and pull our sons right out of our arms, why? WEll because mothers and girls and sons are boys. Before you say no, they do do that, as early as two. They beat every one in the street and dump all make up and lotions in the ocean. They killed our husbands because they complained about their making their wives and daughters into sex toys.

Now they are scratching their chins and wondering who's next. That usually requires a slight tilt of the head. Yes they are looking up, north, Canada. You're next! ONce you see your children raped and your sons snatched and your husband killed and your windows painted black and you are forecd into prostititoin with all these smelly land pirates are you going to be saying well they are doing it for God?

If so, you're are a better human than I could ever be and I applaud you. Because I'm crumbling and turning into a dreadful host. I won't be the hostest with the mostest for those land pirates.

Rachel 2-9-2003 11:24

I have a request: If possible, would everyone please put in their email address with their next post? Sometimes I have a comment or question for someone personally, and I don't know how to reach you. Thanks!

Sunny 2-9-2003 10:38

Heather - I can't agree with you on one point - A patriot isn't a person who blindly follows his leaders orders, he is not someone who would say "My Country Right Or Wrong!"

No, at least in my figuring a patriot is one who deeply loves his nation and is willing to die for that love. A patriot is one who would assist his countrymen in any endeavor that would protect his motherland.

I've known a few men who I would call patriot, and believe me none of them was in any way stupid, or blindly following someone else's orders.

You may have seen patriot's from the U.S. back in the 60's/70's in Canada, those who left the nation they loved because of their belief that the Vietnam War was wrong. You could find patriots in Vietnam carrying an M-16 through the jungle.

There were patriots in the first golf war, they were in the "Police Action" in Korea, they served their nation in both World Wars, no that's not right, they served the FREE WORLD in both world wars. Patriots are not necessarily American's, other nations have their patriots too, including your great nation.

A Patriot is one who loves his nation, no matter what that nation may be, heck there's patriots in Iraq I'm sure too, and in every other land in the world. But the last thing a Patriot would be is blind or stupid.

We look back in our nation's history and find patriots from day one such as George Washington, all the way up to Oliver North and hundreds, no thousands more who love their nation enough to give the ultimate so that nation can live on.

There's nothing wrong with patriotism in fact it's something all nations, all peoples should stive for.

Jerry 2-9-2003 10:13

MEAN AS HELL
(Johnny Cash)
« © '65 Southwind Music »

The devil in hell we're told was chained a thousand years he there remained
He neither complain nor did he groan but was determined to start a hell of his own
Where he could torment the souls of men without being chained in a prison pen
So he asked the Lord if he had on hand anything left when he made this land
The Lord said yes there's a plenty of hand but if I left it down by the Rio Grande
The fact is ol' boy the stuff is so poor
I don't think you could use it as the hell anymore
But the devil went down to look at the truck
And said if he took it as a gift he was stuck
For after lookin' that over carefully and well he said this place is too dry for hell
But in order to get it off his hand the Lord promised the devil to water the land
So trade was closed and deed was given and the Lord went back to his home in heaven
And the devil said now I got all what's needed to make it good hell and he secceeded
He began by putting thorns all over the trees
He mixed up the sand with millions of fleas
He scattered tarantulas along the road put thorns on cactus and horns on toad
Lenghtened the horns of the Texas steer put an addition to the rabbits ear
Put a little devil in the bronco steed and poisoned the feet of the centipede
The rattlesnake bites you the scorpion stings
The mosquito delights you with his buzzing wings
The sunburst are there and so the ants
And if you sit down you'll need have soles on your pants
The wild boar rooms on a black chapparral it's a hell of a place that he has for hell
The heat in the summers are hundred and ten too hot for the devil too hot for men
The red pepper grows upon the banks of the brook
The Mexican use it in all that he cook
Just dine it with one of 'em and you're bound to shout
I've hell on the inside as well as it out
My hands are calloused July to July I use a Big Dipper to navigate by
Fight off the wolves to drink from my well so I have to be mean as hell
A sheep herder came and put up the fence
I saw him one day but I ain't seen him since
But if you need a mutton we got mutton to sell
We're cowpunchers and we're mean as hell
Neighter me nor my pony's got a pedigree but he takes me where I'm wantin' to be
I'll ride him to death and when he is fell I'll get me another one mean as hell
I shot me a calf and I cut off her head
Cause the boys in the bunkhouse are waitin' to be fed
They rise in chime with the five thirty bell
And the best one of any of 'em is mean as hell
**********

howard 2-9-2003 9:58

Rachael:

That was awful what happened to the four Canadian people with frndly fire. I hate war. I love Canada too. You are missing me inside my point.

Debra 2-9-2003 9:30

Hi Taylor,

Just because you put bad thoughts and feelings down on paper about a villan in your book, does not mean deep down that is how you feel!

I think it's called imagination and every writer draws from it. Blame it on your Muse! ;-)

Richard

Richard Amazon.co.uk 2-9-2003 8:34

Hi Heather,

I love your gangly postings!!!

:-)

Richard

Richard 2-9-2003 8:30

**Taylor**

Sitting down and trying to write my novel, I realise that there's just one thing I really hate about it sometimes. Trying to get in the mind of the enemy, the main bad guy is something I really dislike trying to do sometimes.
I guess it's silly going through the what-ifs... If you can put it down to paper, do you, deep down actually feel that way about somethings.

Eddie: My deepest condolonces about your loss. Even though it's never a good time to lose a family member, I can't imagine a worse time than Christmas day. My thoughts and prayers are with you during this difficult period of time.

Taylor 2-9-2003 6:45

Richard - (here I am, the endless post-aholic)
I'm sure you've noticed by now that posts are added with the most recent first - so my looooooong post was first, then the 'five buck' post, and then the welcome for you.... just didn't want you to think that I meant 'I wouldn't regret posting' a welcome to you. ERRRRRGLE, I'm sure my explanation is as gangly as I am feeling!

I'm sure you got the drift about half an hour ago...:o)

Heather 2-9-2003 5:08

Hi Richard! I'm sorry, I didn't catch your arrival right away - WELCOME!

Heather 2-9-2003 5:06

I'm not going to regret posting that, and here's my five bucks to prove it:

$5.00

But it's Canadian money.... HA HA HAH A HAHHH AAAAAAAAAAA

Heather 2-9-2003 5:05

Rachel - I've heard jokes about 'If Canadians ruled the world'.... There may be a few thousand bar brawls per year, but no out and out war.
If I know one thing about patriotism, it's this: for the most part, patriotism is a form of blindness. We can't see that people everywhere are pretty much just like us - we have to find differences we don't like and let that stand between 'us and them'. Of course, no one wants anyone else to tell us what to believe, or that there's someone else out there with a different, and perhaps better version of the truth. We shouldn't need constitutions to tell us that we all have rights to be whomever we wish to be. That should be a given.
.....so with patriotism, there has to be 'sides'. And when you have sides, you have competition, you have winner and loser; and this engenders the need to protect what you've got in case at some point you lose and have to forfeit. Americans are naturally very patriotic, very competitive, and truth be told, protection is not too much to ask for. I just don't like any sort of fighting. Bar brawl or full out war. But I would stand by the US because I happen to think they are closer to truth than the Islamists, and I can't sit the fence on this one.
However,
I would rather play a game of touch football with friends than pro ball against opposition ('the enemy') any day. And when conflict gets heated, I find the more patriotic a group is, the more difficulty in seeing that we are all just playing football. Well, you know what I'm attempting to express.
We're all just in bodies, on Earth, to experience what we came here to learn. If that lesson is, "Loosen your collar and don't press any red buttons when angry", then so it is.
I have my doubts that this is our collective lesson, but with all the hatred and stubbornness abounding, you never know. What Tina said - I'm going to enjoy every drop of happiness I've been blessed with, in each moment as it comes.
Getting riled up past breaking point is not going to help any of us ace any tests, or kick the goal through those two little posts. That's my way of looking at it.
Then again, I might just be 'too Canadian' LOL. I hear it said that we don't get too excited over much, we Northern folk.

DEBRA: I would like to please ask that you calm down a trifle. Who said anyone from Iraq actually WANTS to come and claim America as theirs? Sorry to say this, but I'm sure they'd rather just destroy it rather than take it. Besides, they've got a heap of oil over THERE, and plenty of land to boot. If they view all North Americans as infidels, then they wouldn't 'soil themselves' in taking your land if they didn't have to. I'm sure they find Americans ugly, as I'm sure Americans find Iraqi folks ugly at this point in time. Who wants an ugly people's land?
The fear you are magnifying is simply a projection of the mental image of 'bad guy', which you are placing onto Iraqis in order that hatred for them be instilled, therefore no one will feel badly for killing them off. Do you think the army is stupid? They train specifically so that patriotism is number one. Our side or death.
And NO, I don't think that putting the 'bad guy' label on specific terrorists that have done wrong is incorrect at all - they deserve true justice for their actions - but I also believe that man doesn't have the scales in hand on the matter. We may believe we are the judge of other men, but deep down, we know better.
One-up-manship is the mark of low evolution.

Heather 2-9-2003 4:58

Hi Rachel, Hi Mel,

Thank you both for your warm welcome. I think maybe I caught Randall on a bad day. I'm sure he quite pleasant really.

Mel, thank you for your wonderful bios on some of the forum family, you made me smile.

Richard

Richard Amazon 2-9-2003 4:23

Hi Teekay,

Randall's middle name is Lynn!!!

His wife is Debbie and he has 3 kids and has written 4 books, none published.

Thought I'd get to the bottom of it for you!!! ;-)

Randall, my Grandmother said, "In Life You have to toot your own horn because there are lots of people like Randall out there who won't toot it for you." ;-)

Richard

Richard Amazon.co.uk 2-9-2003 4:17

Oh yeah! I've thought more than a few times that we get far too much incomplete, unverified quick information pounding on us. I think the 'information age' is highly over rated.

Tina 2-9-2003 1:30

Aw hell,

I can't go on with this. I wrote my last post to piss Rhoda and Debra right off. I wanted you to freak so I could write back and ask you how you liked reading an irrational post based upon generalizations and assuptions puked up from half digested interpretations of what you think you saw or read.

Whatever. I'm tired of this. The two of you are clearly blinded by your hate.

Take care.

Rachel 2-9-2003 1:22

Anyone else have this deep desire to turn back the clock to the day when the world depended on the weekly newspaper for the news of the day?

Jerry 2-9-2003 1:02

Hi all!

So, Teekay, can we row our boat together? Almost done, needs some editing, rework a few scenes... seems to describe where we're each at. Starting to submit, getting the momentum, some things published (for you, not me ;-) It will come!
And if you feel that your work is too English, then make it pure in-your-face Aussie! I think I know exactly what you mean; plenty of Canadian writers need to stop writing like Yankees.

Artists express, artists communicate, artists interpret. They take what is around them, and cast it from a new slant, give it new light, so that their audience might stop and say, 'oooOhhh!' Sometimes that audience is 10,000 readers, sometimes it's themselves. And so long as honesty prevails, it is valid. That which is around us now is already being translated by our artists. Already the music is reflecting events. As writers, it may take more time to distill through our thoughts onto paper, but it will happen.

Of course, the only way for that to happen, is to write it down...

The hungry war beast is chewing up each of our lives in a million different ways, and I see us all reliving the trials of our grandparents. In the meantime I'm choosing to scratch every happiness out of life I can.

Visual. (longer than I intended sorry)
Arizona is a foreign land to me. Perfectly flat, interupted by inspired cliffs that thrust up into the sky. Cactus and mesquite and sage share the land with a multitude of plants I don't recognise. The earth is hard; not just in texture but in spirit, very different from the soft moist forests and glacier carved valleys of my home. Dust and grit coats my teeth, my eyes, my shoes. I can taste Arizona.

The thing that is familiar, though, is the sky. Blue, perfectly endless, dizzying. I am here to visit the wind.

Acrid fumes from the engines. Climb the ladder in the storm of the prop blast . Squished onto the seats, belted in, helmet on, takeoff! The Twin Otter shakes the ground, the air, my blood. We pass a thousand feet, five thousand, now ten. At thirteen thousand feet, we level out and the orange light comes on above the door. The engines cut back, a green light winks on, the door slides open.

Now I am at the door, and the earth is far below. Quilted cotton fields peer upward while cotton clouds glare down. Count to eight... and I join them in the sky.

Mountains of cloud are herded through the sky, each one refracting the late afternoon sun into a thousand hues. A thin cloud spreads below me; I hold my breath involuntarily as I pass through, then let it out, laughing. The mountains that thrust so high into the sky are below me, I dwarf them now.

I fly.

At four thousand feet, I reach for my pull. The line of death is drawn around me... until the wind pulls my canopy open and I am suspended in the liquid Arizona sunset. The mountains are frosted with gold and copper, long shadows begin to blanket the ground, clouds glow as the last light surges over the horizon, guiding me back to the ground.

I am a stranger, and I have come home.

***
Okay I went on WAY longer than intended. Gotta go pack. :-p
Blue Skies!

Tina 2-9-2003 0:13

Debra - You got me thinking, what can I do to assist in the war effort?

Now mind you, if I were able and say thirty years younger, I'd probably be holding up my right hand right about now swearing to protect and defend, but that's out of the question, I don't think I could even stand long enough to take the oath anymore, at least not without my cane.

No there has to be something I can do, I laid awake most of the night thinking about things, thousands of things ran through my mind, the last sand box war, I assisted in the collection and shipment of reading materials for the troops. That wasn't much but then I was still working twelve hours a day, plus doing night supervision and taking a shift with the pager for our ambulance service (I was a nationally registered EMT back then too.) But it was something, and I felt involved. I worked with an old retired Sgt Major and a Lt. Col in the Reserves then, the Sgt Maj is dead now, planted at the Vet's cemetery at Fort Abe Lincoln just outside Bismarck. He was an interesting fellow, only guy I knew that sued the Catholic Church for not cleaning their sidewalks and won. He was a hell of a guy too, and me and the old priest up there had bets on which way his soul went, I bet it went up, Father Hughes bet the other way.

Now that's not a bad idea I guess, but I want to do more and with many of our very own guys and gals off to serve I though maybe I could offer our computer for Email for their relatives who don't have access. I don't know exactly how I'm going to get this going but I am beginning to put it together. I have a bunch of old Pentium I computers in the back closet doing absolutely nothing, their shy monitors but I do know a fellow south of town who said he had a shed full of monitors.

I think I'll contact the Legion, heck I've been a dues paying member of the American Legion since '85 even though I don't attend meetings any more. Maybe they can furnish the space, I can furnish a couple of machines that we can set up down there and put the word out. I even have a couple of extra egg web camera's that are gathering dust, maybe we can link up with them on AOL or Yahoo messenger.

We have to do something besides cutting down on fuel usage (if not for the war effort, for the pocket book, have you seen the prices on the pumps lately? Gone up over thirty cents a gallon the past week here!)

On a completely different subject, my mom told me the other day that the last three times they filled her propane tank it took exactly the same amount of gas.

I checked our bill the past two fills have exactly the same amount of gallons too, so I had our daughter check her's her's was exactly the same gallons too. Not the same as each other's mind you, but the same as last months.

Something fishy there, it's beyond belief that such a thing could happen on three separate tanks hooked to three different homes, built at three different times, using three different type materials, none even close to the same size, and I'm sure the days between fills would be different.

This is due a bit of investigating, I'm making a trip to the gas company Monday to see what's up. I know they hired a new guy to drive the truck but he'd have to be an idiot not to be able to read the pump on the truck, I've watched them fill, it's exactly the same as a gas pump at the gas station.

We are lucky there are two gas companies here, and if this one is going to screw with our bills, we have an option of firing them and hiring on with the other company, only problem is, I like these folks, heck I went to high school with the owner and his son is our plumber, hate to loose their friendship, but something's amiss.

Jerry 2-9-2003 0:13

Randall

Hey!

Bound for a sharp eyed Teekay to spot an error. I miscued the cursor on that post dear lady. Pretty heavy posts today. Lets end the night with some Texas humor!!!

Poking ‘round the web looking for the lyrics to a Johnny Cash song. BTW ... anybody know the lyrics to MEAN AS HELL by Johnny Cash? Anyway, found this bit of nonsense. Kinda reminds me of Lucy's medicine routine or Robin Williams play on Julie Childs.

Fruit Cake Recipe

You'll need the following: a cup of water, a cup of sugar, four large brown eggs, two cups of dried fruit, a teaspoon of salt, a cup of brown sugar, lemon juice, nuts, and a bottle of whiskey.

Sample the whiskey to check for quality.

Take a large bowl. Check the whiskey again. To be sure it's the highest quality, pour one level cup and drink. Repeat.

Turn on the electric mixer, beat one cup of butter in a large fluffy bowl. Add one teaspoon of sugar and beat again.

Make sure the whiskey is still okay. Cry another tup. Turn off the mixer.

Beat two leggs and add to the bowl and chuck in the cup of dried fruit. Mix on the tuner. If the fired druit gets stuck in the beaterers, pry it loose with a drewscriver.

Sample the whiskey to check for tonsisticity. Next, sift two cups of salt. Or something. Who cares? Check the whiskey.

Now sift the lemon juice and strain your nuts. Add one table. Spoon. Of sugar or something. Whatever you can find.

Grease the oven. Turn the cake tin to 350 degrees. Don't forget to beat off the turner. Throw the bowl out of the window. Check the whiskey again and go to bed.

Hoppy halidaze! Please share free to feel this recipe with others.

http://www.texascooking.com/humor.htm

Randall

Randall 2-9-2003 0:10

Rhoda and Debra,

I will post more later. For now I think you should both calm the heck down. I know that Canada is not immune. I mentioned that in my post, if you bothered to actually read it, instead of inserting your own thinking over top of my words. The issue here is that Americans seem to think that for some reason unknown to me, that the U.S. should be immune to all evils.

I will read both of your posts with more attention later. For now I am watching a movie with my kiddies. I just checkede in to see what murder, kill them all statements had been made this evening.

I know what. Why don't the two of you get a party going and decide that Canada must be in on it! Oh yeah, we aren't nearly sympathetic enough. We aren't sending any of our boys out to play with you. I suppose we could be worried they might get blow up... That friendly fire is a bitch isn't it?

Rachel 2-9-2003 0:08

AND TAYLOR!

*sigh*

I guess you guys must be all abed.

RACHEL: I understand that you are simply removing yourself from a situation and making an observation :-)
Totally loved your recent posts, at last a deeper glimpse of RACHEL's heart - and, not that you care or should care, but I really like it!

TINA: Welcome back! I'm so glad you had a wonderful holiday.
At the moment I'm reading Treasures in the Trunk, by Mary Baywater Cross - it's a history of Women on the Oregon Trail and their quilts. Stop yawning! stop yawning I say, it's very interesting.
And also The Queen and I by Sue Townsend, which is a total crack -up. A republican government gets elected in and the Royal Family have to go live in a housing commission estate. The author has portrayed the characters so well, you can just imagine them acting the way they do in the situations she puts them in. Highly recommended reading.

RANDALL: Why are you signing your wife's name also? Just curious is all. I'm assuming Debbie is your wife and that '& Debbie' isn't your middle name. And why only in one post?

I shall get to the bottom of this.........

Teekay 2-9-2003 0:04

I'm sorry about all the drama. I'm just tird of those rotten B's. The only thing is I think they are gassed up by Saddam. If he goes, most of them will lose steam with him. I really think that.

Teekay:

I do fear the little germ too. The thing is, I do believe in God. He's decides when it's over, not terrorists. So maybe I'll calm down about that one.

Debra 2-8-2003 20:16

Awww man! AND RHODA AND RACHEL!!!! I had you guys the first time, but I deleted it and started again, and forgot to put your names back

*SOB*

I'm never naming everyone ever again! - I'm just not up to the challenge.

Teekay 2-8-2003 18:15

RACHEL,

It is as simple as this: kill or be killed. I don't care how the Islamists live or worship or how they think. I only know that they have determined in their hearts to destroy my country and my way of life. Perhaps someday they will win, but over my dead body. I might also add that as DEBRA pointed out the struggle is not merely against the United States, but against the whole Western world, and that does include Canada.

I will also add that Islamists are only about 50% of the Islamic world, or perhaps less.

As far as I am concerned, the war has already started.

Regarding Iraq, why sit around and wait for them to complete their nuclear bombs and watch helplessly as they attack their neighbors? Someday they will be able to deliver those weapons to the United States. Should we just wait?

Oh, well, I am beating a dead horse. I really don't care what anyone else thinks. Judge us any way you like. The fact is we are going to war whether anyone likes it or not.

Rhoda 2-8-2003 17:59

Teekay - you are *passionately* Australian and I "got it" in just a few sentences. With power like that, you damn straight better finish that book! ;-)

Sunny 2-8-2003 17:54

And if you're wondering why it's posted twice, it's because I went for the accelerator instead of the brake.

2-8-2003 17:26

Sorry, for all of you who have also taken out your brains for one reason or another, that last post was mine.

Teekay 2-8-2003 17:20

SUNNY: Your questions boosts the idea of making it more Australian :-D

More Australian is about being earthy, and rugged and plenty humorous. It's about heat, and dust and flies. It's about an ill defined social structure, it's about saying bloody, and bugger and only having a minimal grip on the faux niceties of the english which have had years an years to establish a more refined way of life. Niceties which tried valiantly to thrive in a newly settled country, but wilted miserably in the hot antipodean sun. It's difficult to keep your pinky bent just so, when there a blowfly doing laps in your tea.

HEATHER: Oh dear, I wonder which would have been easier to conquer, fear of failure or laziness. I'm guessing fear of failure (or success) as I've been nurturing laziness my whole life and it's a fairly formidablle force at this stage. if you've ever watched Ghost busters, it looks like that great big green wobbly ghost thing.

You must be the captain, coz I'm pretty sure I'm not. Where does one find a good captain?

LOOK WITHIN YOUR HEART- boomed the voice from everywhere.

Bugger! (see SUNNY) if I keep doing this I'm going to end up organless, gerk, yargh eaeg squelshhhhhhhhhhhj'q98u........

2-8-2003 17:16

MAN! I HATE THAT! As soon as I pressed send EDDIE popped into my head.

And I see EDDIE too.

Now, I'm removing my brain so it doesn't happen again, and then I'm pressing send, so if your names not their, don't blame me, right, here we go, I'll just mmph, erk, eegh squelchhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh,.e,mrvy27b 9[8
[]LWEQIO'JBGFSFD

Teekay 2-8-2003 17:00

Oh yeah, forgot.

Saw 'Signs' last night, and the only thing that saved that movie from being a complete and utter dud, was the amazing acting ability of Mel Gibson. YAY, you go Mel!! And don't forget, dinner at my place tomorrow.

DEBRA: Your posts made me extremely uneasy. That such evil is able to exist in this world and can mandate itself to rule a country is so very much scarier. I think about it a lot too. While I'm sitting in the comfort of my lounge room in front of my TV watching the news comfortable in my taken for granted freedom, I wonder how very tenously I am removed from such evils, and such fate as the victims I see on the screen.

I also wonder that maybe, on the other side of the coin, a democracy weakens a country. If you look at how this latest turn of world events have divided people, people who hold the same values, people who are convinced they have the best interests of freedom of speech and people's rights at heart, you get the feeling that there is no glue holding it all together, it keeps bringing the saying 'divided we fall' to mind.

I hate the idea of this looming war, I would love to curl up in a warm cosy ball stick my fingers in my ears and scream NO! NO! THERE SHOULD BE NO WAR!
I question wether my opinions are the right ones, and wonder if I'm in the boat bound for hell, is God looking down on me shaking his head and saying "tsk tsk, silly girl, it's all written in the bible", but deep down inside I feel that if we don't do something now eventually it will be too late.
Ironic that maybe with all the guns and might that have been invented over the years, mankind might be eradicated by a tiny little germ they could only see under a microscope.

And well done on the book (I hope)

CHRISTI: Hi Girly :-D Is there a photo somewhere we can see?

And I can see HOWARD, and HEATHER and JERRY, and RANDALL, and GARIESS, and MEL, and MARY, and AMERICO, and LITTER, and MARK, and ROSEMARY, and VIV, and CAROL, and TINA, and SUNNY, and JACK, and PAMELA too.

Now, be good children and drink all your milk.

Teekay 2-8-2003 16:58

Dear Teekay:
You are not lazy. You aren't even relaxed. You are afraid of your novel failing, or worse yet - what if it is successful? You mean, I have to do it again? What if I can't?

The answer to that is, if you can do it the first time, you can do it again. You have had success with your short stories, and there is NO reason you will not succeed with a novel. Unless of course, you never finish it.
And...how do I know? I believe you are riding in the same boat I am! I hope I'm not the captain. :oD

Heather 2-8-2003 16:34

Teekay,

What's an "Australian feel"?

Sunny 2-8-2003 16:33

Hi All,
read this REALLY cute saying the other day and want to share:
Thousands of years ago cats were worshipped as gods;
Cats have never forgotten this.
...............................(Anonymous)

MEL: You're right! I'm shocked at how transparent I am :-O

The '&%^#$@()&*&*&^$$#@#$&%%*****NOVEL (that's a sort of drum rolly thing - it seems a bit muffled coz it's coming from the deep dark depths of somewhere long forgotten) has become a victim of my psyche. I have approximately 4 chapters to go. While waiting for my fat drunken muse to return from his cavortings I tried to analyse why it was that I was procrastinating finishing it. The 2 things I came up with was:
(1) I don't feel like it and
(2) The novel has too much of an English feel to it and I should really start all over and write the same again, but give it a more Australian feel.

I don't know if either of these two reasons have any validity or I'm just trying to justify my own laziness, but you seem to know how I work, so could you please let me know.

Could it be fear of failure? Hmmmm, guess that seems to be assuming quite a lot :-D

If you conclude I'm simply lazy (which I'm thinking you might do)could you please let me know gently, and try not to use the word lazy, use something like 'relaxed' maybe.

Avag'day all.

Teekay 2-8-2003 16:16

Hi All :)

Oh, so very active in here recently! I'm going to stay in the group that avoids the political views.

The writing has been going up and down the past few weeks. I'm going to keep patting myself on the back for continuing the same story, for moving it forward and not sticking it in the drawer like so many others. And with my pats on the back, I have to give Viv a big thanks! Without her encouragement all this time, I'm not sure I would have gotten this far.

I started on a scene yesterday that needs a lot of sensory details to -- is impassionate a word? -- well, if not, it should be cause that's what I need to get into the scene. The high intense passion that the character is feeling. This is one of my difficult areas since I am essentially a laid-back person and don't allow myself to exhibit strong emotion. Perhaps my trick of removing my glasses, closing my eyes and sending my memory deep will help ... . Best warn hubby first though. :)

(there- that info is for Richard who wanted to see writerly stuff!)

Have a great day everyone. Remember, in spite of the world's climate to take a moment to savor your life.

Carol 2-8-2003 15:53

My sons taken away, my baby girls raped, my husband killed, my God kidnapped. That's why our ancestors left Europe all those years ago. All I see is the beast has followed us.

I'm sorry if I'm getting radical.

The situation seems to call for it.

If they win, our original consitition can be used for toliet paper. If they win, I can see it happening in my minds eye. Just like the distruction of the Budda statutes. They were older than our consititution.

Debra 2-8-2003 12:58

In Afganistan women lost their sons, from ad little as two yrar old boys up. From all the information they had they were never going to see their sons again, ever. I remember my sons at two. They were attached to me like a sticky bun. We were together all the time. Mothers just like us, watched as these little guys were pulled off their hips and dragged away screaming.

Their daughters were regulary raped. If women were caught teaching their daughters how to read and write they were beaten or killed. Their husbands were routinely murdered in front of them. ONce their husbands were dead they were forbidden to work. They could only beg for money, covered from head to to in cloth. If they did leave the house they were beaten by laughing, cackling, bearded men. They just beat them and laugh and laugh. That was life in Afganistan under taliban. Usoma thought it was heaven on earth.

They are saying America join that club or fight. In fact either the last statement or the one before that Osuma stated he and his followers wouldn't rest until every one joined them.

Just tell me do you want to join that club? If you don't tell me, does it sound like heaven on earth? Does it sound like a loving God? Does it sound like anyone's God?

I would never preach death to other religions. I have never, would never. I'm saying no land pirates.

THEY DON'T BEIEVE IN GOD. That's my feeling and I'm sticking with it.

Still love you.

Debra 2-8-2003 12:44

RANDALL

Morning!

While pursuing the world news I came across this tidbit of information.

"THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

ISTANBUL, Turkey -- Border police on Friday denied entry into Turkey to a former U.S. Marine who is leading an anti-war group of "human shields" headed for Iraq ahead of a possible U.S.-led attack, an official said.

Ken O'Keefe, the founder of the "Human Shield Mission" protest group that had flown into Istanbul from Italy, was not let into the country when he presented a passport issued by the World Service Authority.

A spokesman of Istanbul airport said that Turkey does not recognize this passport.

The spokesman said O'Keefe protested, shouting that he had traveled across the world with that passport and was a "citizen of the world."

Five other activists accompanying O'Keefe were allowed into the country, while O'Keefe flew back to Italy."

An airfield outside Baghdad.

Colonel Omar Flee Rapidlyian of the Iraqi Republican Guard is on the phone.

"Yes sir I understand General. These peace loving American human shields are here to help us. Yes Sir! I have received my quota, yes will feed them and furnish them lodging next to some of our most high value targets at this base. Sir speak a little louder, there is a loud roaring overhead. You wish me to ... I ... sir ... well sir I don't understand? I don't feel there is a reason for me to be present at all times. I have other duties ... and to defend our homeland must remain concealed to monitor communications. Well, I have stationed the brave Americans close to the missile bunkers and will observe them from the command bunker. Command bunker? The slit trench I dug yesterday sir. Uh, about 2 kilometers General. I didn't catch that General. Women? Sir from what I observe now I would not want any of these women in the trench with me! Yes sir! Oh yes sir! I have my long range binoculars and will closely monitor these brave American human shields. Yes sir! Oh yes sir I will not hesitate to defend our glorious leader with the lives of these brave American human shields. Ah, the roaring noise is so loud General. I must retreat to the trench, uh, communications trench."

You gotta wonder sometimes.

Randall

Randall & Debbie Henderson 2-8-2003 12:37

I still love you!

Debra 2-8-2003 12:30

There's one question and only one.

If you don't want that life and the land pirates are not taking no for an answer THEN WHAT DO YOU DO?

They are forcing that question on the table NOW and they are forcing the answer. If they should be free to have their God then so should we all be.

THEY DON'T AGREE WITH THAT.

What do you suggest?

Debra 2-8-2003 12:29

Rachael:

Just for one minute imagine this scene. Imagine they came here to America and defeated us. Remember the USA we have never bothered you guys for one minute??? So any way, they defeated us. We women have had all our clothes burned and replaced with beige burcas and live in houses with our windows painted black. They raped all of us and the pretty ones they forced into prostituation. They steal our money and pull our sons right out of our arms, why? WEll because mothers and girls and sons are boys. Before you say no, they do do that, as early as two. They beat every one in the street and dump all make up and lotions in the ocean. They killed our husbands because they complained about their making their wives and daughters into sex toys.

Now they are scratching their chins and wondering who's next. That usually requires a slight tilt of the head. Yes they are looking up, north, Canada. You're next! ONce you see your children raped and your sons snatched and your husband killed and your windows painted black and you are forecd into prostititoin with all these smelly land pirates are you going to be saying well they are doing it for God?

If so, you're are a better human than I could ever be and I applaud you. Because I'm crumbling and turning into a dreadful host. I won't be the hostest with the mostest for those land pirates.

Debra 2-8-2003 12:21

RANDALL

Morning! Big News!

But first ... Richard "best selling author" Armorall. Welcome, and with all respect ... butt out or go with the flow. As a citizen of the most powerful nation on Earth (TEXAS!) I am a little leery of a self proclaimed "best selling author." My grandmother said, "If you choose to toot your own horn it's usually because no else will toot it for you." Really now Richard ..."best selling author?" 2000 copies! WOW! I have a friend who sold 2,000 copies of a book she paid to be published! Are you self-published? And no I will not be contacting you about what I can write on the NB or beat the bushes for your novel. And I would have spent a little more time on the title, kinda bland for my taste. Sorry pal, but self proclaimed "best selling author" John Grisham wanna be's give me a pain in the keester. (YAWN) When you sell 10,000 drop me a line..."Best selling author!" Until then...write on!

Now the bad news gang. Move over Jack! My gall bladders gotta come out too. Maybe next week or later but the "stones" are after me. Spent Thursday night in the hospital after a torturous 2 hours in the ER. (No George Clooney there either!) Kinda upsetting. I always thought I was immortal.

Randall "Never sold a darn thing" Henderson

RANDALL 2-8-2003 11:37

Here's my latest poem. I sent it to the Library of Congress last week. It was in a document of poems called,, guess what.

Rantings of an Idiot.

That's the document where I put my poems. Even after reading my poems you're still not sure who's the idiot.

Dirt
Sending us a message they take lives including their own, then become a martyr
Wouldn’t just holding a sign up be much more effective, faster and smarter

Instead they killed my mother so I killed their son
Then they killed my sister so I had to take from them another one

A month a go a bomb went off and made a building fall
Everyone in it was lost they got them all

After the smoke cleared there was nothing but a shell
To have died that way, must have been living hell

They say they hate us because of our belief
So it must be our turn to cause them some grief

To satisfy our spirits with faith will be forever our fate
Our hearts rise up for our beliefs but for them only deflate

They call us infidels because we don’t look to the same one
They want to make us believe looking down the barrel of a gun

Infidel just means one who doesn’t share your same view
So of course we can say the same thing right back at you

That would mean every one of us is an infidel to some degree
To have faith for our chosen one is our right in which we should all be free

They refuse to be our neighbors yet they are not asking us to move
Instead they want us dead another option we must behoove

The longer our allegiance continues so does their resolve
This ongoing problem between us I fear we’ll never solve

Go travel the world to chronicle our differences you’ll find only similarities
You’ll meet people like you who love their heritage, their home and their families.

I’ve often found with life’s toughest problems they often have a simple solution
With the oldest one called hate I have come to the same conclusion

Through the years how many people will have to die during someone’s last stand
before we realize the problem can be solved just by sharing the land

© Debra J. Palardy 2002

Debra 2-8-2003 11:26

Rachael:

I do still love you.

Just remember if I'm right America isn't their only target, it's just first. Guess who'll be second?

Let me ask you, did you ever get the feeling that pirates were doing what they were doing for some higher purpose?

I didn't.

They are middle eastern land pirates. That's all.

It says in the Bible to love your life here is to hate God.

What that means if you're willing to forgo everything he holds important to make your life here better you have no God. That's what they are doing. I don't believe in killing, either. I do have a huge love of screaming like an idiot though.

I don't have the answer on war or no war. I'm not qualified to say.

So I don't.

Debra 2-8-2003 11:21

Hi Ricahrd,

You are not the first person to post a note like the one some posts below this. There are a lot of sites that will focus directly on writing and nothing else. I am sure you can find those easily enough. This site has a focus on humanity, on the heartbeat of many different nations and states, provinces and so forth within those nations. This place breaths whispers from around the globe. I believe that writing is life and life is writing. I don't really see how one can exist without the other. I think it is great that you have published a book. I also have been a part of publishing a book. It is an amazing feeling. I still like the completion of the first draft feeling better though. I have several other books close to completion and in need of edits. I am currently attending school so do not know when I will complete the novels. I, for the time being, am not worried about the date of completion. Each novel will be completed when it is and not one moment before.

Take care you.

Rachel

PS - Look out, this place is addictive.

Rachel 2-8-2003 11:19

Mel:

I'm so out of breath as I'm writing this. I can't bleieve you mentioned sweetie when you did. I just got off the phone with the govenor's office. We got a new one this year and he has decided to meet regular people on the last Thursday of the month. They started taking applications two weeks ago and now there's a one year waiting period. Well not for MEEEEEEE! I'm meeting him this month. This month! I got in! I got in! I got in! I'm not going to waste one microsecond wetting myself either. Well I hope not.

Not only that person I spoke to, has spent her whole life working in domestic violence and she is as excited about sweetie as I am now with a little bacrground of sweetie from me. She's positive if it's as good as it sounds he'll recommend sweeite be required reading for all high shcools in RHODE ISLAND. They are working on that as we speak here in my home town. I had to start here first.

You know abusers remind me of terrorists a little. They claim their horror is in the name of love just like the terrorists claim their horror is in the name of God.

They're both liars. I exposed those abusive bastards for everything they are in sweetie. They're going down.

Thank you Mel.

Debra 2-8-2003 11:14

Debra,

I am relieved to see that you are not making sweeping generalizations. Your posts read as if you were. I still disagree with you about these groups and their belief in God. Just so you know, I believe that they see you in the very same way, as godless. I don’t think that they are trying to hide anything. I believe that they think they are right. The fact that they think they are right doesn’t make it so, but it gives them the passion and dedication to push forth and die for this.

It is closed mind thinking that has brought the world to the brink of war. If you are going to think the way your post suggests, then you are no better than those you declare you hate for. You want them dead too. Isn’t that what it comes down to? You want them dead because they threaten your way of life. Well, they want the very same thing. I am not defending them, don’t think that. I am only saying you need to open your eyes and take a look at the big picture. Have you thought about why it is that they feel the way they do? Do you imagine that they came awake one morning with an unquenchable hate for the U.S., or do you suppose that it has built up over time? It’s just a thought.

Just as an aside, did you know that the U.S. refused to yield to repeated British requests that it rein in the Irish-American involvement and support for the IRA, which the British government charged was a terrorist organization. I think that terrorism just looks different when it is in your own yard.

Don’t start jumping up and down and freaking that I would feel different if it were in Canada, because I would not. I don’t think Canada is immune, I never have and I don’t expect I ever will. I think it is that the U.S. felt immune to attack on their home soil that it is such a shocker. It is a sad state, a desperate state of affairs, that will not be solved with further narrowness of mind.

It is nice that you still love me (smiles and hugs). I however do not know how you will feel after reading this post.

Maybe we should agree to disagree. What do you think?

Rachel 2-8-2003 11:13

OK - Richard has brought me off my lurk status, too. ;-)

Richard, my first book sold almost 100,000 copies (How To Be Organized In Spite Of Yourself), and I'm 1/3 through my second, but I honestly don't know how well I'd be doing now without the existence of the Notebook and it's amazing community of talented, compassionate people.

My first book was written with an established co-author, but this is the first book I've ever done on my own, and it's a bit scary. When I'm nervous or frustrated or stuck, I come to the Notebook and never fail to feel connected again.

It's a privilege, to me, to read about the accomplishments, struggles, concerns and experiences of such a diverse group of people, and even though I don't post very much, I can say without hesitation that if you spend time here, you will come away enriched. :-)

Welcome, and felicitations to everyone else!

Sunny

Sunny 2-8-2003 11:12

*Mel*

Hi, everyone! :-) RICHARD has brought me off the lurk!

RICHARD: Welcome and pull up a chair! You'll find this site very inspiring for writing, generally, and when we get specific about it, you'll be amazed at the energy that flows between our muses. :-] I too prefer to talk about writing - it's what brought me to this site in the first place. And then I discovered a lot of wonderful people--driven, like me, by the need to write-- and suddenly the writing world is not so lonely any more. It's true, life has a way of interjecting itself into our conversations here, but underneath it all, we're still writers, and we're still writing. It would be better than wonderful if everyone here chose to share their writing endeavors more frequently - THAT's what inspires ME best. I glean every ounce of inspiration I can get, as I have a most unruly muse, prone to share her energies with me only when she whims, darn her! >-

The neat thing is, RICHARD, the longer you hang at this site, the more you can read between the lines, heh heh. For instance, while JERRY's voicing his retired cop-oriented views, I know he's really struggling to put together that collection of chair-gripping police stories that he's destined to write. (Um, JERRY, you ARE still working on that idea, I hope?) :-)

And DEBRA hates the violence in the world as much as I do, but while she talks about it here, I know she's really working on her next SWEETIE book to encourage young women from making the wrong dating choices (aren't you, dear DEBRA?).

TEEKAY stays off the site when she' not writing much, like I sometimes do, then she returns with bright inspiring quips about the world, and I know she's writing again. (YEA, TEEKAY! Welcome back - now where did you put that novel??)

HOWARD may write short posts here but his original poetry collection, if poems were stretched end-to-end around the globe, would circle the Earth a few hundred times. (That is right, HOWARD, eh?)

HEATHER's pretty good about keeping us up-to-date with the PHANTASIUM anthology project she's editing for a bunch of writers from here. Meanwhile, she has a SYMPHONY playing for her through her own muse, and other projects, I'm certain, as you can't keep a busy writer not writing several things at a time.(You go, HEATHER!)

JACK, God speed his recovery from surgery, I believe started this site with the intention we post about our writing lives, and he's kindly put up with all our veerings from that most important subject of conversations, because he knows we'll get back to it - it's in our heartbeats to write and to talk about writing with other writers. And while HE talks about diving, he's really going for underwater inspiration for a great sci-fi novel he'll one day write about an ocean-world of the future (aren't you, JACK?). ;-]

You see, RICHARD, everyone here has projects on the foreburners and on the backburners. The trouble with my muse is, she likes to sit on the stove until she feels warm all over and then she wonders why dinner isn't ready. 8-\

Take some inspiration from RANDALL; he knows how to weave his opinions of the world into his marvelous short-short stories he often shares here with us. The world is not so serious that you can't laugh at it. At least, writing about it is good stress relief!

So many, many wonderful writers here, RICHARD; I haven't time to describe them all. All I can suggest is stay awhile, get to know us; post about writing as often as you like; lurk when the conversation strays from your interests or skim posts that don't inspire you, then post something here to inspire everyone else, preferably back to writing about writing! :-]

A good WRITING day to RICHARD and to every writer here (I know you're lurking!!!)

CHRISTI: Thanks for missing me. Any new developments in the area of time-twist romances or the like? :-)

I better go before JACK yells at me for taking up so much SPACE!!! (Now, where did I leave my muse? Oh yeah - sitting on the stove...)

Mel 2-8-2003 10:05

Rachael:

I'm not saying that people who worship Islam don't believe in God. Of course they do. Remember Mommaah Ali was taken to court in the seventies because he wouldn't go to war? He was a practicing Islam. He said it was against his religion to kill. They didn't make him go after learning about Islam.

I'm saying the people who are from al-quada and other groups like them don't. They don't. Period!

The taliban were the biggest hypocrites on earth. No one can tell me other wise. What's more fun than human targets. They sell drugs, rape women, seperate families, kill women who they already covered up in cloth and now they want to have more fun. So they called a international duck hunt. That's that.

They are using Islam to hide the truth. They are middle eastern pirates. Period end of sentence. I dont' want to be their play thing and end up dead for their enjoyment.

And the whole thing pisses me off to no end.

Rachael. I still love you.

Debra 2-8-2003 10:03

RICHARD -- First, welcome! I think that if you stay awhile and get to know us you'll appreciate our group as we do.
Second -- what would you expect a writers group to be talking about, given the current climate across the whole world? We're first human beings, and some of us have been here long enough to consider this a part of our extended 'family'. We care about each other, and seek one another's opinions on things that matter. Like the threat of war that affects all of us. If you expected to see any normal (I think we're normal) group of real people not discussing so important a topic, you've landed in the wrong galaxy -- not merely the wrong url.
We are happy you've sold a book -- congratulations! Sincerely! But we have as well, and, thanks to Heather and Mark, we're about to do so again.
We do write -- and continue to learn to write -- here, even through the chatter. The first two (especially the second) are rather necessary to the group, but the third is optional.
You're welcome to join us if you're so inclined!

howard 2-8-2003 9:14

Hi,

I came upon this link at ebookpalace and hoped that it moght be lots of writers discussing their work, publishing etc.

Disappointed to see yet another discussion about war.

Maybe you should direct all your anger onto paper and write a book about it.

Have any of you had your books published? I'd love to read your stories, books or whatever you're writing right now.

I live in England, UK so we are pretty wrapped up the war issues too. I personally feel that whilst our Governments are democratic, I don't want to waste my time going on march's etc to try to alter our Government's plans. I don't think war is the answer, but George Bush and Tony Blair will ultimately do want they want with backing of the UN.

So instead I'm spending my time writing my next book. I have 3 more lined up and my first book, "The Habit" has sold over 2,000 copies so far and I'm so pleased.

So if any of you wanna discuss books and things and not war, let me know.

Best wishes,

Richard

Richard Armour
-------------------------
Author of The Habit
www.richardarmour.co.uk
Order a signed Limited
First Edition Hardback.
-------------------------

Richard Armour Richard Armour - Best selling Author 2-8-2003 6:43

Hi Christi,

You are a sweet thing :o) I hope you are feeling much better. Having the blues bites. Welcome back (hugs). Hang in there.

Rachel

Rachel 2-8-2003 1:16

Hey Debra,

Let me give you a hug. Maybe I'm trying to hold onto you so you can't hit me for what I'm going to say. They don't believe in your God. Those folks do believe in a God. They believe in thier own Divine Commands, just as you believe in yours. Maybe the issue isn't with God, but with Divine Command, which, if you examine it calls God into question. I've been doing an exam in which I have to work with the Divine Command Theory. Your post caught my eye. I imagine you are feeling a lot of passion at this time, and if you want to freak on me, you can, but, remember, they do have a God, most people do. We just aren't all worshiping the same thing. Please don't sit up and tell me that all Gods are the same, just a different name, cause that is a load of crap and we all know it. The Gods that I've looked at are as different as you can imagine. I'm sorry to bring this up, it just bothered me to see you write that. It isn't true. Just like not everyone is part of that club you mention. There are good people and bad people all around the world. There isn't any one place that has cornered the market of rapist, murder, power freak, godless monsters.

Take care you.

Rachel

Rachel 2-8-2003 1:07

Jerry:

I don't know. I really don't. But one of the reasons I hate them so much is because they are the biggest hypocrate in history. They turned Afganistan into the biggest boys club on earth. They raped women and turned others into prostitutes. They don't believe in God at all. They are trying to kill people like they are in a duck hunt. That's it.

I don't want to see one more innocent person die to be their play thing.

Debra 2-8-2003 0:10

Something tells me that nuclear weapons are NOT the answer. Hmmmmmmmm. It couldn't be memories of Nagasaki, or Hiromshima, could it? What right does anyone have endanger the entire world with fallout and all that jazz? Not that jazz is terribly deadly...

never mind.

Heather 2-7-2003 23:36

Jack - be nimble, be quick, heal quickly, since I have lots of candlesticks.....

Wow. My sense of humour just went plop.

Christi, good to see you here, girl!
I'm tiring fast, but still plugging away on Phantasium tonight. Why doesn't that manilla envelope look any fatter????

Heather 2-7-2003 23:34

Debra - What do you suggest? On the news tonight there was a group of ladies from the New York area who are traveling to Iraq against State Department (orders?) warnings to protest for peace, but I don't agree with them, and I surely don't want to be in Baghdad when the missiles start to fly.

We could protest, but I don't think I am all that against going after Sadam of for that matter Kim Jon Eill or what ever that idiot who runs N. Korea's name is.

Nuking the middle east surely isn't the answer (or is it?).

We could go terrorist hunting, but what does the terrorist of today look like? Like my VA Dr. or the old fellow who rented that old cold house to dad forty years ago? Maybe like any other person of middle east extraction, and if your hunting them, where do we get the hunting license? Oh and what's the limit?

Ok this isn't anything to get funny about this is dead serious, but truthfully I don't have an idea what to do.

Jerry 2-7-2003 22:09

Jerry:

NO we have to do more. I hate those terrorists. I just hate them all!

Debra 2-7-2003 21:34

Jack - surgery is no fun at all. When I went in for my first back surgery, the Doc said he would make an incision the size of a thumbnail, but when I woke up I was split from ass crack to the middle of my back. When the Doc came to see me, he explained that I was a bit "thicker" then he thought. (After the third my regular doc looked at the incession and commented that it looked like a zipper with three sets of scars from the stitches, and to tell the truth, it does) (you know you're getting old when you can swap surgery stories!)

Luck on healing and I hope you're back up and about real soon.

Debra - I'm not exactly comfortable with what's to come either. Bout the only thing we can do is sit back and watch I guess.

Jerry 2-7-2003 21:27

~~Christi~~

Jack, Good to hear you're okay. Have a few good weeks off and heal speedily. You've got drugs, right? :)

Eddie, I checked out that link. Still not sure how I feel about it. I sure didn't like how he talked about creativity and talent, as if those are bad things, are even cumbersome if you use his method. Hmm. But I AM interested. He's very persuasive and makes some good points. My worry would be that it would be all about money, fame and status, and suck away the love and passion of writing. But the way he tells it, I've bought into that way of thinking and am a big sucker. What are your thoughts?

Rachel, I'm sorry you're leaving for a couple of weeks, though I know you are busy. Come back soon, I love to read your always-interesting posts.

Tina, Hey girl! Feel free to post any of the pictures. :) I'm afraid I look like Godzilla next to petite you, but hey, just remember everybody, I'm ten pounds thinner since this picture! Like anyone but me cares. Heh heh.

I'd join in the political debate if I knew exactly how I felt and why I felt that way, but I don't. All I know is that I have this awful feeling, as anyone does who feels that war is imminent, and I worry that our resources will be too thinly stretched--too many balls in the air. Personally I have just as much interest in the Korean situation as I do in Iraq, and wonder why all heads are focused solidly on Sadaam. So many 'badies' out there.

I can't help remembering an Iraqui woman's comment directed at America, saying that violence at this point will only breed more anger and hatred, and ultimately more violence. Ah, the neverending vicious circle of violence. Sad that we have evolved so little as humans.

I wrote this from my memory, and have missed so many people. Hi Mark, Howard (glad that idiot missed you!), Teekay(hey girlie!), Debra, Jerry, Randall, Carol, Litter, and hey, where's Mel? Hey Heather! How's it hanging? Great to see life goes on as always at the Notebook, no matter what else may be happening.

VIVA! VIVA! VIVA!

Christi 2-7-2003 20:44

Well hello all: Way out of the loop. Just got back from being discharged from my gall bladder surgery. As it happened, I was among the two per cent that they had to open up and lost a lot of blood. This called for longer recovery, two units of blood infused and am still way way woozy. So, I now have four smaller scars where the attempt was made to go in laproscopically and a six inch scar with lots and lots of staples. They even stapled my belly buttonn :-). At any rate, this means I will be down from diving probably six to seven weeks, instead of the three to four I had initially planned on. Will keep everyone posted when I am a little more compus mentis and off of the percocet. I suspect it is time to archive the Notebook, but will have to wait until I am a little more on top of things. Hope everyone is well. Take care.

Jack Beslanwitch 2-7-2003 14:49

What is this that I have a bad feeling about? The news and the color change in terror threats.

Debra 2-7-2003 13:53

Hi guys,

I'm about to vanish again for a few weeks. Hope you all keep well.

Rachel

Rachel 2-7-2003 13:46

I have a bad feeling about this. REmember my dream about the air show. It hasn't left me. Not only that it gave me a timeline of progress of my book sweetie on domestic violence. I just heard this week that they are making it required reading at my high school and I have a meeting set to speak to the governor of this state to make it reguired for the whole state, THIS WEEK.

I dreamt about an air show where the people watching were on the right side of four huge stacks that looked like nucular stacks. The stacks were visible off to the left of the seats. The fourth plane it started to sputter and it crashed into that group of towers and the impact was so huge I spent a long time, maybe weeks shaking when I thought about it. What do I do? I did finally tell someone at the FBI but it took a long time before I even found someone who would even humor me.

If anyone knows of an airshow that has that set up please let me know where it is.

Debra 2-7-2003 12:58

I am very loosely paraphrasing the famous Mary Lockwood when I say, "Arm thyself with a can of super-hold hairspray, and immortalize the arachnid!"
A crowning achievement for hairspray science the world over, I say. But did they KNOW when they invented it what a chilling use it would find, one day, many years later?

Sorry, at least all I'm oozing is sarcasm. :oD

Heather 2-7-2003 12:58

RANDALL - Yep, even when I was in the Army in most of the 70's we drove many civilian type vehicles. Back then they just painted them OD and put vehicle numbers on them. They were for use of Officers who needed transportation, and many driving guard posts. I still have my old Military Drivers License. It was six pages long, and they could put like six vehicles on each license. Back then you needed an operators license for each type vehicle, including generators, so my generator license was two of the pages. I recall driving the Officer of the Day around when I had that duty in an old '69 Chevy 4 door sedan, driving up and down a stupid runway at the Army Air Field in an old GMC Pickup truck.

When one had CQ (Charge of Quarters) duty he was issued a Jeep and driver to make rounds of the Motor Pool every hour or so in addition to walking the halls of the Barracks to insure that all was peaceful. (Many a day walking those halls put one in such a stupor you wondered what you were doing there in the first place, as all the pot smoke coming from under the doors of the troopers was enough to make the whole company high, and not being a pot smoker I think it had a stronger effect on my brain.)

Jerry 2-7-2003 11:34

Heather:

It's the spiders that's the problem. Just so you know. There's the chill again. Shit! On the ship!

Debra 2-7-2003 9:33

Damn it Heather:

That remark about the rats sent a chill up my spine. I may never recover. Happy!

Debra 2-7-2003 9:32

JERRY - very well said.
Howard - that is great news about your family moving closer, and awful news of the flu. I hear ya. Hopefully I won't be hearing you barf all the way up here! HA HA HAAAAA

Today's Jack Handy-ish thought:

Whenever I'm afraid, I always ask myself, "What's the lighter side of this situation?"... The lighter side of my garage is that the rats aren't as big as the spiders.

Heather 2-7-2003 8:11

As always, you're on the ball Mark. Though I didn't point it out, that is exactly the problem link. I'll make the change you suggest, and see what happens.

Okay, why is it that my muse kicks into overdrive when I have the least time to let her out? Now that I'm working two jobs, kinda a third, packing to move, looking for a place to move to, and jumping at least one day a week, I can't stop thinking about writing!

I finally got the latest Diana Gabaldon book. It took me 8 months to get it from the library! Talk about a highly sought book. And it's so worth it! I don't have much time to read, but I'm managing short bursts.
What is everyone else reading these days?

All you sick people, I hope you're feeling better soon, but keep your viruses to yourselves! ;-)

Blue Skies

Tina 2-7-2003 2:11

Well it looks like the shit is about to hit the fan, not that it will surprise anyone who has had a pulse for the last year or so.

I guess it's a good idea, somebody has to stop the madman in Baghdad, but I'm not exactly sure why it has to be us (U.S.).

In that little corner near the very back of my mind I keep seeing a son going after the man who his dad failed to get. The man who tried to kill his dad and I guess were I in the same boat I would probably have that in my mind too.

Not that there aren't plenty of very good reasons to get the ass hole, there are more then this page could hold were it blank and we had all day to type reasons into it.

The President is doing it right in one way I guess, by getting the Guard and Reserves into the fro, he's insuring that folks from all over the country keep an eye on what goes on, support their troops, and their leader. It's not that he has much choice though.

There was a change in forces since the fall of the Eastern Block, many of our full time units were disbanded and their missions given to guard and reserve units, as we down sized from the cold war. This makes the military completely different than the one I served in so many years ago.

Just got an Email from my old combat unit historian, we've been keeping in touch since he found me on Classmates.com and I sent him a bunch of photo's of the old 18th Engineer Brigade in Vietnam. At any rate, prior to the cold war down size, in fact as part of the end of the war in Vietnam down sizing, the old 18th was disbanded, it's colors retired to their museum at their last post in Fort Riley Ks. It has just been reactivated and is now assigned to duty in Germany. This as part of the war build up for the present sand box fight that is about to happen.

The rumblings from Iraq are ominous, with Sadam releasing the trigger on the Chemical Weapons, the ones he says he doesn't have to the whim of the field commanders, for use against the forces of the alliance (if there is in fact an alliance).

I hope he's just blowing smoke since I fear the our strong, and sturdy leader may indeed unleash the power of the Atom one more time, leaving Baghdad and surrounding area a cinder, unusable for the next, oh say, ten thousand months.

Na, he wouldn't do that would he?

Sorry for being political, or is it hawkish? Dovish? Whatever, just putting my concerns down on the web for consideration.

Jerry 2-6-2003 23:45

Miss a couple of days and this place really lights up! I'll stay out of the political arena -- got my own opinions (and hopes) about our prez's intentions and motivations. Let it suffice to say he is our president, and I believe we've been told to pray for him, though not necessarily agree completely and blindly with him.

Just got back from our daughter's house in PA. They're in the process of selling it and moving back up this way. They'll be an hour northwest (above Ithaca) instead of four hours southwest (State College,PA).

We weren't much help in getting ready for the move -- my wife started exhibiting the worst signs of this stomach flu the night we got there, and I took over last night. Grandson Joel has been alternating ends on us for the past two days, and we're all feeling pretty punk. I just hope Andi and Bryan (our daughter and son-in-law) don't get it now -- they're painting tomorrow, and packing the truck on Saturday. Not much fun to do either while running to the loo!

howard 2-6-2003 21:29

RANDALL

Evening!

I ... aye, aye, aye, aye, aye .... Awoke at 4:00 this morning, put on my housecoat, turned on the computer, plugged into the notebook.....read my post, turned everything off, went back to bed, wondering what in the world possessed me to tie into poor Pamela.

Pamela...are we still friends?

I find as I get older intolerance is a little harder to keep at bay. I believe it's because, indeed, most of us that are past 50 have been hammered by a lifetime of political events beyond our control. It's the same kind of a force, kinda like gravity, that has forced my stomach down and out. This constant stress is a lot worse when one is politically aware and historically oriented. A great Democrat, John Kennedy made me aware of politics. A voracious appetite for history brought me into the literary word and historical novels of ... America's wars. Couple this with an active imagination, I see events we are experiencing today in Iraq and North Korea as comparable to Germany and Japan in the 1930's. In Germany there was a person, a dictator who could have been stopped by powerful nations at Munich. He wasn't. Estimates of the dead have run as high as 50 million from the lack of immediate reaction to his policies.

Could the tide of Bushido been halted in Japan, say 1935? Probably not...this was something that had stirred the Japanese military mind for decades. But powerful nations could halt North Korea now...China for one. Will they?

The daily pondering of situations beyond my immediate control, solution, outcome, result, aftermath cause outbursts like last night. My wife says I am like a volcano with snow on the roof, but fire in the belly. On occasion the snow begins to melt, the fire moves upward, and blows all over everybody! BOOM! Then its over and the volcano lies dormant, but the stress remains.

Tina ... storm over.

Pamela ... your turn to tie into me. :-)

Jerry ...I talked to Sean a couple of nights ago. He said he is accustomed to the cold and "loves" it up there! I asked him what he was doing? Sean said he has been in a driving school, class in the morning, driving in the afternoon. I commented how did the Hummers ride? He said, "HUMMERS! DAD! We have 4-wheel drive Chevrolet Tahoes and Ford Expeditions and Excursions!"

Well, I guess that's the Air Force for ya!

BTW (sigh) I understand Dustin "Tootsie" Hoffman offered some irrational comments today. I think I'll leave this one alone...

Randall

RANDALL 2-6-2003 20:23

Hi All,
RANDALL: You really ought to get a job publishing your opinions and thoughts in a newspaper somewhere - you would then be one of the very rare media men I could abide by. There's a few newspapers over here I imagine would benefit greatly from your outlook.

Re: governments, I have a lot of faith in the government that is in at the moment, but the oppostition scares the crap outta me. If any government but the one we have were to be elected, we'd be in deep cacka.

About Australia, yes, it's mostly one long beach, interupted occassionally by rugged cliffs. A few thousand miles of arable land all surrounding a great big wasteland of desert, and red dirt that, though rather useless in sustaining a wide number of human life is undeniably beautiful.
I'm all for convict labour (or anybody who's willing) digging trenches and laying water pipes in order to irrigate (of course normal working conditions and hours would apply, also sunscreen and hat issued- I'm not mean), but any greenies or peoples rights activists would probably have my guts for garters for saying so. I can envision all the placards now.
But really, what better way to pay one's societal debt, and leave something of yourself behind for generations to come. Also, think of all the angst and violence that would be shed along the way - And what a grand sense of achievement.
I also have no problem with it being left alone. It depends on which debate I'm partaking in.

About stars that use their celebrity to voice their opinions, it's not really they who annoy me so much as the media who give airtime and page space to those insipid opinions, and also those of the public who, because it came from the mouths of 'superstars' think it must be gospel.
Lor' save me from the deep thinkings and inconsequential ramblings of George Clooney.

Have a good day y'all :-D

Teekay 2-6-2003 16:20

TINA -- You didn't say which one is the problematic link. I looked at the code on each page and it all looked normal. Going back to see if I missed something, the 'skydiving' link took me to mainskydiving.htm where it had taken me to skydiving.htm the first time. 'Main' may be the issue. It's a keyword in some systems. Computers are not supposed to make mistakes like that, but I wonder if you sometimes get 'main'skydiving read as skydiving. I'd rename mainskydiving to skydiving1 and see if the problem clears up. If not then apply Preparation-H.

Mark 2-6-2003 11:36

Randall - Ok - Don't get me wrong, I do love this country, and I have a lot of respect for the Congress and the Administration. What I have a problem with is the bureaucrats who've been locked into their jobs for eighteen years, who run their offices like they are indeed the dictator that the law allows them to be.

I do think that we have the greatest nation that ever was on this insignafant planet stuck out in a little visited corner of the vast universe.

Oh sure there are those in congress that I dislike, even despise such as our pimple on the ass of the Democratic party Senate MINORITY leader Dashal who only remains in Washington DC because he KNOWS nobody wants him to return to South Dakota and add to the idiot population, and Senator Kennedy who is now so brain damaged from all the scotch he's soaked up, and that little incident on a bridge on Martha's Vineyard some thirty years ago.

Anyhow on a different note completely Randall - your son has been introduced to COLD, especially last night, if he had the duty, according to the news the temp in Minot last night was -42 (wind chill, I think the air temp was like -22). Sure hope he dressed warm, I was thinking of him last night as I watched the weather report. My son lives up there too, but he has an indoor job and, I hope, enough sense to stay indoors when it gets that cold.

It's one above right now and a bit breezy, I would guess the wind chill is around -10. The wife just left for the health club and her daily exercise chore. It's done wonders for her knee pain, and she's shedding pounds so fast now that I barley recognize her from day to day. She's down over thirty pounds now since she began her diet/exercise regime. I wish I could join her but my Doc says to wait till we get the damn pain under control, and the new meds haven't made much difference yet. I see him again tomorrow, and if it goes as planned he'll boost the dose on a couple of them for another two weeks then another re-eval.

Jerry 2-6-2003 11:28

Heather:

I am very lucky to still have a husband. I do know that.

I love him very much!

Debra 2-6-2003 8:19

**Taylor**

Me again, just a few more things I wanted to add.

Sorry to hear about the Shuttle Columbia and the loss of her crew. I heard about the tiles as well. It seems a tragic loss. But as I say, I'm sure they knew the risks involved.
However my mind wanders to John F. Kennedy. If he would've known there would be such a death toll from the Space Program would he have still pushed hard to get a man on the moon by the end of the 60's?

I was watching a documovie called "Robert Kennedy: And his times" just last week. Thought that a joke would be worth mentioning about how much flak the Kennedy's got when John was President.
"If Robert and John Kennedy were in a sinking boat, who would be saved?" The answer, "The country."
I found it kind of funny even though I have respect for what the Kennedys had done.

That kind of 'Disrespect' to the President from then to President Bush I reckon is kind of low. But it is a "Freedom of Speech" thing after all. All the things that has been said by Alec Baldwin, George Clooney and even Tom Cruise they seem to be lacking one thing, "Accountability" for what they say. Most of the networks and TV programs refuse to question major stars about what they say.
And when a program does, the stars do what the early 60's propaganda film said to do, "DUCK & COVER"
Here's something I want to see... An uncensored, unrehearsed hour program with George Clooney or Alec Baldwin appearing with Bill O'reilly on FNC's "O'reilly Factor"
That would be interesting. But they've turned down O'reilly's invitation to appear on the Factor.

I still reckon that stars and everyday people should have to explain their point of view... Though I've already given up on Bill Clinton for doing that.

Sorry about the long messages... Catch up with you all soon

Taylor 2-6-2003 2:56

**Taylor**

Sorry I haven't been on to post 'Merry Christmas' to everyone... But at the moment, getting hooked back on the internet doesn't feel like it's near the top of my "To Do" list.

Well wishes to all who has had ailments and been sick. Just too much to catch up on at the moment.

The weather in West Aus is really hot at the moment, I'm looking forward to winter already.

All I can say is things have been really interesting this year already and now I'm looking forward to quiet time hopefully.

On the subject of one's death posted awhile back... This I have thought about a bit lately. I do not wish for immortality, I don't even want immortality. Not that I know it's impossible but also because life does have an end, that's the order of things. You live, you die. You can't change those things, but you can change how you choose going about it. It's funny, I'm 29 this month and it has only recently occurred to me that one day I am going to die and there's no avoiding it. However, when my life ends I want to be able to stand up to my 'final judgement' or whatever you want to call it. And be able to say, I didn't let that get in the way of my life.

On a writing note, it seems that my muse is in and out. My writing has been off and on at the moment. I guess I'm just trying to latch onto a novel idea. Though that has not stopped me from writing altogether.

I hope my absence isn't so long next time. Later all and goodluck in your life's endevours.

Taylor 2-6-2003 2:34

Hi, all. I'm interested in joining in but I'm disoriented and I must explore what this site has to offer.

I just came across a site that promises to be able to get you to write a book very quickly; of course I'm a bit skeptical, but I've read the site twice and even spoken to the owner, Steve Manning, and I admit I'm taken by his enthusiasm.

Anyway, have any of you heard or know of anyone who has purchased this course? Please check it out and email me with your thoughts before I blindly go into this.

http://www.writeabooknow.com/welcome/write2583now

I thank you. And by-the-way: I am NOT selling this product. I recieved this offer via email myself.

izariizari@earthink.net

Eddie 2-5-2003 23:03

Hi, all. I'm interested in joining in but I'm disoriented and I must explore what this site has to offer.

I just came across a site that promises to be able to get you to write a book very quickly; of course I'm a bit skeptical, but I've read the site twice and even spoken to the owner, Steve Manning, and I admit I'm taken by his enthusiasm.

Anyway, have any of you heard or know of anyone who has purchased this course? Please check it out and email me with your thoughts before I blindly go into this.

I thank you. And by-the-way: I am NOT selling this product. I recieved this offer via email myself.

izariizari@earthink.net

Eddie 2-5-2003 23:01

Randall,

I hope your son keeps safe and your family keeps well.

Rachel 2-5-2003 21:48

(takes cautious step up, ducking the storm coming from Texas...)

Heather, thanks! If you want more shots of me, follow the link to 'Our House'.

For all you HTML people, why do A HREF links work sometimes and not others? I have one lazy link on my site, that occasionally works but not always. I don't know what to do with it!

Pamela, I met a whole swack of Alaskians while I was in Arizona. What a great batch of people! Makes me want to go north for awhile, not just to see the land but to know the people. Even though they are American, they have very Canadian attitudes about some things. Cool folks.

Jack, //////\\\\\\//////\\\\\\ good vibes heading south for you.

Mmmmm, just made a yummy batch of lemon poppy seed muffins. Mmmmmm. Think I'll go eat one, or two, or three...
C-ya!

Tina 2-5-2003 20:57

RANDALL

Afternoon...I come home to take care of my wife who has the flu and what do I read...

Pamela, Pamela, Pamela. What am I going to do with you?

"...our government is one of the most corrupt and dishonest in the world..."

Sooooo Pamela, when are you leaving the country? Dare I ask when, where? Boat, train, air, car, bus, foot? Obviously if you believe the government of America is that corrupt (your words, not mine) you will immediately take steps to remove yourself and all loved ones in your family from such a terrible place. :-) Why, life is too short to spend ones life in a disreputable nation like America, where the country is "corrupt and dishonest." The world is simply too grand a place to stay stuck in a hole of inequity like America. God! I can't believe I have managed to hang on as long as I have! And ... Holy Cow! I was even snookered into Vietnam service. What a sucker I was! Serving America for dishonesty and corruption! Why didn't someone tell me this years ago!?

Let's consider areas for your relocation on our side of the world. Canada! Hey, now there is a FINE place. Lots of open country, fresh air, friendly people, high tech. Ask Heather to help you settle in! Mexico and live in the sun! Not a bad idea. I have reasonable information that the government of Mexico is NOT corrupt and dishonest. But I would stay away from Mexico City. A recent estimate of smog and pollutants there, broken down, estimates a million tons of dried doggie do do enter the atmosphere every day. How About South America? Venezuela... They love Americans down there, especially the kidnappers. No? Well, perhaps not. All that rioting in the street, you know. Panama? Good choice. Honduras? Not bad.

How about Europe? Africa? Asia? Asia Minor? The Orient? No? Hummmm

Well, Pamela ... is this the fabled Alec "Big Mouth" Baldwin syndrome.

"In response, many have seized upon Baldwin's promise to get out of the states if Bush won the recent presidential election. One man wrote, "Well, George W. Bush will be the president and I was wondering when and from where Baldwin was leaving so that I could wave goodbye." Another critic wrote, "I want to take this opportunity to wish Alec Baldwin a safe trip to wherever he decides to set up his permanent residency...

"It's unclear why people have taken Baldwin so seriously, but some would suggest that many hard-working middle class people are irritated with wealthy celebrities using their ultra-visible status as spokes people for the Democratic Party while they get crushed financially by Democratic tax and spend policies. For Baldwin's critics, however, the current turn of events has become a no-lose situation. Either Baldwin leaves the country, thus ridding them of his irritating presence, or is duly exposed for what he truly is - an outspoken actor whose sense of self-importance is exceeded only by his ignorance in assuming that people care what he has to say."

Buzzle.com

Perhaps Tom "Shortie" Cruise who recently said his children would be better off raised away from America. Ah, had any conversations with Tom recently? Well Pamela, how do you feel about Tom Cruise? You know he wants to raise his children overseas. Australia is a fine place to live! Ask Teekay. One long beach... English speaking, friendly folks (I've been there BTW)

TOM CRUISE: U.S. IS TERRIFYING

With Carl Limbacher and NewsMax.com Staff For the story behind the story...

Monday, July 1, 2002 Tom Cruise: 'U.S. Is Terrifying'

America turned Tom Cruise from an obscure, undereducated yahoo into a multimillionaire star, but is he grateful? Just the opposite.

"I think the U.S. is terrifying, and it saddens me," he told the British newspaper Daily Express.

"You only have to look at the state of affairs in America." (I.E.Corrupt and dishonest?)

And his adopted children are too good for the U.S., the pampered Hollywood actor says. They'll be raised overseas, probably in Australia, the homeland of his ex-wife, Nicole Kidman.

"Cruise, whose character became similarly disillusioned with America in 'Born on the Fourth of July,' said raising children in the U.S. is a risky business. He said he could no longer keep his 'eyes wide shut' to America's terrorism threat, crime, faltering financial status and corporate corruption," Fox News Channel reported today.

"I do worry about my children. As a parent you are always concerned," Cruise told the British paper.

"I just want them to be in a place where they are going to be strong enough to make the right choices. Unfortunately, we're in a position where people are so irresponsible that human life holds such little value to them."

As a NewsMax reader wrote: "Can you please get a scoop on another sorry of sack of ---- out of Hollywood trying to make this country the villain and cause of all that is bad in the world. Tom Cruis (sic) is now an official left-wing ass! Fox is running the story now. Let's get it out there too."

So Pamela, you're not alone in your distaste of America. With stalwart citizens like Alec and Tom by your side...how could you possibly lose by leaving such a corrupt and dishonest country like America? Any place is better than America!!! One can vote with their feet as well as with their ballot! Get out before it's too late!

WAIT!!! And how about good old George?

FROM http://www.pdawwg.com/archives/000127.html

GEORGE CLOONEY IS AN MEAN IDIOT.

"""Needed a new category for this! Hollywood Dumbasses is an oxymoron, but what the hell.

Why is it that the left and especially the entertainment left is sounding, well, mean, in addition to stupid? Take this comment from George Clooney:

"'Are we going to try and talk [to Saddam Hussein] without jumping in and killing people first?' asks Clooney."

Cool, I nominate you to go talk to him. Collect all of his biological trash, any remaining warheads, bring them back so we can destroy them, 'kay? I'm sure he'll happily and with no fuss turn them over to you. Let us know how it turns out.

Then this:

"I don't believe we're going to wait until the last resort to do it. That's what bothers me."

Um, when is the last resort? After he gets nukes either on his own or buys them from our favorite whack-job Kim Jong Il? After he sprays us or Israel with ricin?

Then this: "Clooney says Bush has cut deals with France and Russia so the United Nations Security Council won't complain when 'we go into a war [with Iraq] and kill a lot of innocent people.'"

Do you have proof of this? Has France and Russia passed you zee secret paipers?

The most telling:

"The government itself is running exactly like the Sopranos,' he tells talk-show host Charlie Rose tonight."

(HOLY COW!!! There it is! the smoking gun! Corrupt and dishonest! Bound for an ER doctor to know!)

I think this says it all. You equate reallife with a television show. George, "The Sopranos" isn't real, 'kay? It's a show done with actors and a script and a producer and is shown on HBO."""

(SIGH) Three dandy left wing liberals...

But Pamela you might wish to consider a stalwart English leader of some note...

Democracy is the worst form of government except all those other forms that have been tried." WINSTON CHURCHILL

And I hate to say this...I really do...so don't get me wrong. It's just with a son in the Air Force and a bloody war looming in Iraq and Korea...

AMERICA, LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT!

PEACE BABY!

Randall "Wrap me in the stars and stripes" Henderson

RANDALL 2-5-2003 18:49

JACK - MY BEST WISHES ARE WITH YOU AND FRAN!

Heather 2-5-2003 18:45

OWWWWWWw, Debra, your husband's condition gives new meaning to the term 'blue balls'. I would say I feel for him, but that would be sending the wrong message entirely! Glad he's ok, and I hope everything gets sorted out.

I haven't had much chance to read all the posts since I was bagged out (no pun intended) with the flu for a week and a half... Today is the first day I feel like I'm somewhat normal. I know, don't laugh. Normal is a setting on the dryer, and that's about as close to normal as I get: standing there, waiting for a dry pair of undies!

Well, isn't this a revealing post? Guffaw...

Not much to say about the space shuttle. Horrible news.
Makes you look at the sky with apprehension all over again: What's going to come screaming down from it, or exploding in it?

Of course, then there's TINA! As long as it's just your parachute brightening up the skies, I'm happy! Loved your website and the pics, though the pictures of you were few and far between, girlie! You're a beautiful person. Give us a good head-shot, will ya?
LOL
I love the pic of you just leaving the plane with your jump partner. Leaves room for interesting captions, that's for sure! Actually, your jump suit reminds me of the Ibis, a bird native to the Amazon. (I researched it a bit for my children's book, Pajamazon) It has striking feathers in red and black.... just breathtaking!

Christi! Gotta see your pics, too, wondergrrrrrl!
(winky winks)

Which reminds me - Mary and I are soon to be launching our new and improved Hemlock website! We'll let you know when you'll be able to have a peek!

More on Phantasium soon... I am still getting one to two stories their last polishes per day, but were we ever prolific! The stories just keep a-comin'!

Pamela - yup, I agree.... but further than that I can't tell....government secret, ya know...LOL

Heather 2-5-2003 18:44

Pamela,

I also do not watch the news very often. I used to do the head in the sand trick, but I kept getting kicked in the butt when I wasn’t looking ;o) I know that I’m lucky and that I have a good life. I just wonder why me and not some other person? It ticks me right off that everyone can’t be comfortable. Hey, and don’t get me wrong. I don’t own this place, I rent. I can’t afford a place that would fit Dan, myself and all the kiddies (we have six). I went out this morning and spent some time with the horses. I need to take a breath now and then and put things back in perspective. Thanks for your cautious and kind words (smiles to you). I really am not a fire breathing devil woman. I’m just cranky because I’ve got a midterms looming up and I’ve given the past three days away to a friend. I couldn’t afford to have that time gone from my studies, but I also couldn’t let my friend down. I wouldn’t want to ever have her feel badly about my falling behind in things, so I have to keep myself available and paste a smile on my face. It leaves me a little less than my chipper self. Leaving that job was one of the best things I’ve ever done. It was a service to myself and my family. I’ve no regrets about leaving. At the time of my leaving my family did almost sink into financial hell. Actually, we did, before we had recovered we lost the only thing that we actually owned, our car. All that aside we did recover, life went on and we moved forward. When you friend says that you have “The call of the wild.” Is that to say that you like nature? Or is it saying that you are a wild woman who is a party animal? Either is good, I just wonder which it is, or perhaps both?

Jerry,

I am sorry that you lost your home. It sounds like a nightmare. I watched my mother and father have their house taken from them. I saw them suffer and eventually recover. I only hope that the recovery for you will be swift. It frustrates me when bad things happen to good people. If I remember correctly you sold off your gun collection to try to avert the loss of your home and to maintain the welfare of your family. To have given up something so loved and then have it not work out must be difficult. I wish you the best Jerry, I really do.

Rachel 2-5-2003 14:41

Healthy thoughts going out to Jack, hope all goes well.

It's true no governments are totally honest, though some are less harmful than others, just as some people are like those poor Rachael had to deal with (good for you for leaving a cushy but intolerable job) while others are as nice as we all are (aren't we?). There's good and bad and lots that is in between, just going along, living life, trying to get by. Jerry, that is so awful that you lost your house and had to declare bankruptcy due to your injury and the lack of prompt recompensation. I have been struggling with disability purchased through work and it's been hell but thank goodness I've managed to hang on to my house, I hope you've gotten another one now. Christi, welcome back from DepressionLand, I'm sure we've all been there and yes, I think all writers must be, if not neurotic, then some other kind of crazy. I recommend not watching the news when down, my own head-in-the-sand method. Rachael, when you feel puked-out by the world, think about how lucky you are to sleep in a turret, your house sounds wonderful! Are you in Canada? The pictures from Tina (?) were great, I have a brother who lives in Alaska and was lucky enough to spend a summer up there. I met some people from Canada, notably White Horse, where I am welcome to come and visit and would love to get back up there someday, I have what my Canadian friend calls the call of the wild. Speaking of Canadians, one of my favorite comedy troupes, Kids In The Hall, is going to have a special on pay-per-view this month, looking forward to that. I'm totally mad at myself for not taping all of their episodes when they were showing here and will definitely tape the special and the shows if they ever come back. Scott Thompson as the middle-aged housewife reminds me of my aunts up in South Dakota. That reminds me, Jerry, did you like "Fargo"? I thought they really nailed the midwestern stoicism. I recently saw an earlier Coen brothers film on IFC called "Blood Simple" that was sort of a Texas version of "Fargo", not exact same plot but serial confusion and criminal ineptitude, also starring Frances McDermond(?) though she's a blond floozy in this one. I love those guys, talk about wierd creative people!

Pamela 2-5-2003 13:41

PAMELA,

You have described all governments--at their bests. There is not a government on the face of the planet that is open and honest with all of its citizens. That is simply the nature of the beast. Government is a necessary evil, for without it there would be anarchy.

Which is why I am a conservative. The belief behind that is not to support the government or make excuses for the government, but to limit the government and to hold it accountable. Big government, no matter how well intentioned, that interferes in the lives of law abiding people, telling them how to think, talk, believe, worship, raise their children, etc., always becomes oppressive.

The United States has done some bad things at times and has kept devestating secrets. The United States government and military has a tendency to abuse the environment and to experiment on people without their knowledge. Through the IRS it has harrassed individuals. Through the war on drugs, it has bypassed the rights of innocent citizens and has seized property, and then when the mistake is brought to light, the government does not own up to it and compensate the victems. The government has also taken away the use of private property without compensating owners. When under the Superfund legislation for cleaning up environmental waste sites, innocent owners who had did not make the mess and had no idea of its existence when they bought the property were made to clean it up out of their own pockets.
That is not justice, but that has been some of the actions of the United States government.

Would NASA hide and cover up information damaging to the department and the space program? Heck yes they would. The decision to do so might not come from on high from the White House or the Congress or even the head of the department. Many times these cover-ups are done by the "middle" management and even by the little guys.

I think the thing that still gives credance to the United States and still makes this country a good place to live is the people of the United States and their sense of fair play. We also have a system of government whereby the people have the tools to change things and get justice. We also have a free press and those other institutions that help keep government accountable. And the other essential in having a good country is that most citizens be honest. That is the key.

Government is a raging bull. Keep it penned up and tame and it can be beneficial to the farm. Let it loose and it can destroy and tear up everything in its path.

Rhoda 2-5-2003 8:50

Tina!

You're as gorgeous as ever. Your pictures came out great! Everyone, I have been lax in giving Tina her proper greeting since she arrived back from 'Zona. She is truly one of the most down to earth (ironic, eh?), warm, gorgeous people I've ever had the pleasure of meeting.
It's a damn shame that you live so far away, Tina, as Kelly and I loved you and your husband instantly (a fair feat). We're still knocking around the idea of a trip to Canada.

Mark, I never knew you cared! :D Blushing over here, and now I'm terrified that the pix will be horrendous. It was a bad hair/haven't had a shower yet day, but I'll probably give the okay anyway. But Tina, I must see them first! And here I thought there wasn't a vain bone in my body.

Jack, You take care of yourself and come back soon.

So how the hell are you all doing? I'm tickled to be back. I've been getting over the depression of the recent events and have been planning a comeback into the land of the living. I wish I didn't retreat inside myself so much; it's lovely to experience things as they happen. Are all writers this neurotic? Anyway, got a lot of reading done, and that's always good food.

Going before I put the heading "Dear Diary". Heh heh.

Good night.

Christi 2-5-2003 0:31

Mark

Smiles to you (okay, maybe I'm not all out of smiles to send around the globe ;o)

Rachel 2-5-2003 0:20

Jack,

I will hold a good thought for you. Meaning, I will wish the very best for you.

Take care Jack, give my regards to Fran.

Jerry,

I’ve sat on the gun desk (meaning I’m a snipers target). I’ve gazed intently at would be bombs asking the person at the door to please hold the door and everyone leave the building as there is an emergency, while my co-workers run for the hills. I’ve been locked in rooms with knife wielding drug cases, while my co-workers double check the locks to keep him out and me in with him. I’ve been set in front of inquirery boards, cost people their jobs walked over the bodies of people who could be dead or alive with my laughing work mates while we sip on coffee or have a smoke. Would that I had been a cop where I would have been trained for this, ready for this, respected in some way instead of spit upon at every turn. Gold lines? How about gold pockets and watches? Don’t sing me this song, I’m not up for the purchase. I know that there are good people, but you know what? Those good people have their own agendas, prejudices, pre-conceptions and stereotyping ways. What makes good good Jerry? You ever think about that? What is happy? What is sad? All that said I feel I live a good life. It took me many years to claw my way out of the pit of sorrow that my years of Govt work earned me. My co-workers still talk about me and remember me with fondness. I didn’t look for silver or gold. All I looked for was a glimmer of freaking humanity. When I saw it, I loved it, encouraged it and assisted it in any way that I could I don’t equate humanity with wealth. Hum, good and bad? What is that? I think it really depends on what side of the fence you sit on. The side of the fence you sit on depends upon your culture, philosophy and religion in a lot of ways. Each of these things can change your position in the blink of the eye. Life isn’t so simple and neither are good and bad. I’m tired of sending kisses and hugs and sweetness around the globe. It gets nothing, but snide remarks and snorts, so here is a bit of what I really think. All that said I love what mankind can be. I love the moments, those little moments, those tiny things that mean so much and cost a person so little. That is what I love, that is where the happy and sad are, the good and bad can be found in the little, tiny everyday things that cost us nothing. No silver, no gold, just a tiny, little thing.

Rachel 2-5-2003 0:18

OH Jack, may the force be with you!

Jerry 2-4-2003 23:45

Rachel - Well police work is also government work, so to is the work of a soldier, and I too have seen the horror's of mankind, but I've also seen the gold that lines the hearts of many good people, those who would gladly give their lives so another's could live, and the silver in those good people who strive from day to day to make the lives of those who would throw their lives away in search of another drink or another hit, many of them fall into the same gutter that those they strived to save live in, but many carry on, from day to day helping those who will not be helped.

Sure there's lots of slime bags out there, but mixed in with them are those with hearts of gold, the trick is caring for the good, and ridding the world of the bad, the real trick is in determining which is which.

Jerry 2-4-2003 23:45

RACHEL -- yup. the system's a killer for anyone with an ounce of creativity.

TINA -- Well Done web pages. Though I will admit some curiosity about CHRISTI, I understand keeping her face off the web.

JACK -- Good Luck, guy. Let us know.

CAROL -- our cats have learned to walk in the house. The dogs only go after the cats when they run. The cats are declawed, so we can't let them out; they couldn't defend themselves out there. The cats know when the dogs are asleep, at those times the cats run and jump on each other with fervor. (Those cats jump on each other with a fur-what?)

Eddie, Rosemary, Randall, Howard, Heather, Americo, Debra, Jerry, Sasquatch, Litter, Pamela . . . who'm i missin? that guy from new england with the lightbulbs, that guy from israel, somebody else, somebody else . . . Well, HELLO ALL.

Mark 2-4-2003 23:02

Hi Jerry,

I worked for the Gov't for years. I worked in what I believe you in the States would call "social welfare office." yeah, I was that nice lady behind the desk who asked all those stupid question. I was so revolted by my work, the system and pretty much humanity, that I walked away from a position that most people call a "life term." You get in and there isn't any way out (the money is good, the benefits rock and you would need to be stupid beyond words to leave). I guess I'm stupid beyond words, but I'm also not on meds, don't need a stress leave ever six weeks, don't have to deal with shit, semen or spit, bombs, assaults and riots unless I want to. I also got to meet all those great folks who will beat the living crap out of the children, leave the for dead and then argue about how unfair life is, while the needles is still hanging out of their arm, or they are on the phone to their office or broker. Yeah, Gov't bites big time, but so to regular folks. I sometimes think that I'm a misanthrope. I guess if you just have it in for the Govt you are one up on me... I have days when I am puked out by the whole world.

Rachel 2-4-2003 22:17

Pammela - Yep, the worst thing ANYONE can hear is

"Hi, I'm from the Government and I'm here to help!"

Cause you just know things are going to go to hell in a handbasket real soon.

I don't have a lot of respect for the Gov. since they took away my house, sold it for 2 grand then sued me for 24 thousand while I was waiting for Social Security and Workers Comp to settle down and begin paying me, then when they attached my tax return, and attached 25 percent of my social security, I had to go through the humilation of bankruptcy, in fact my day in court was September 10'th, the day before the towers fell.

Jerry 2-4-2003 20:53

Tina,

You are welcome to visit me any time. I live in Maple Ridge, quite close to Pitt Meadows, which is a jump zone if I am not mistaken. The view from the sky would be beautiful. I myself live only a few minutes from Golden Ears Provincial Park. It is a pretty area. You could come and check out the doll house that I live in (winks). Its this big old Victorian thing. You can see it from miles away, at least the peaks and turret. I sleep in the turret, it is really very nice. I love to look out all the windows on clear nights. Star gazing from bed rocks!

Pamela,

Let me know what you think of Shadows, and you are welcome. I think that our law system needs a kick in the ass. This week I watched on as two men got away with murder. The terms and conditions of their home jail plan are not enough to deter anyone from reckless endangerment and murder. Heck! I could go out and run down a family of five and get to do more than I do right now. Kinda makes you wonder, doesn't it?

Rachel 2-4-2003 20:47

I don't know why so many people seem to think that they are excempt from the rules others must live by (like speed limits), I just wish they would go live by themselves somewhere in AnarchyLand and not endanger the rest of us. I saw a commedian a few years ago talking about drunk drivers, he said 40% of all accidents are caused by people driving drunk and that brought up a real problem: 60% are caused by sober drivers and we should do something about getting them off the road!

Eddie, you said something about NASA being "open and honest with the general public" and I wondered what planet you were from, then I remembered you are from England, so your innocence is excused. Here in the USA, the words "government" (or any agency thereof) and "open and honest" do not go in the same sentence together (totally oxymoronic). Sorry all you right-wing conservatives, I love ya, but our government is one of the most corrupt and dishonest in the world, our high standard of living not- withstanding. Our anti-terrorism budget PRE 9-ll was 300 BILLION dollars a year and I'm sure that every cent can be somehow accounted for, probably a few $100 screwdrivers in there somewhere. Agencies routinely spend more than they need to just because it is in their budget, never mind that people are starving out there, our tax dollars are used to fund idiotic research, I read about one study investigating how cats landed on their feet, had statistics on how many times they turned over from different heights, 5 stories, 10 stories, etc. (so we're paying for researchers to throw cats out of windows?). Our income tax is unconstitutional, clearly forbidden in our constitution, our representatives are paid for by the highest bidder and the public subsidizes such enterprises as the nuclear power industry without being informed (previously mentioned Price-
Anderson act, which limits the liability of anyone responsible for an ENO, or Extraordinary Nuclear Occurance, to a small percentage of the damage that could be caused, even that caused by faulty construction or operation. If damages go over that, Congress will pass an act to reimburse public losses, in effect, we pay for them ourselves). Don't get me wrong, I love our country and appreciate all of the advantages we have but honesty is not one of the traits of our government (think of the boys like Jerry who were lied to when they were sent into hell in the 60's). Okay, that's it for me and politics, sometimes I'll spout off and now I'll try to go back to ignoring it all.

Best cat name I ever heard of was "Underfoot".

Rachael and Rhoda, thanks for info and loan offer on "Shadows", I'll buy it from Amazon when I get a job.

Pamela 2-4-2003 19:49

Okay the link didn't take. Trying again...

Tina My Arizona vacation 2-4-2003 19:35

Hi all!

What a start to 2003. An awesome holiday, followed by selling - yes SELLING! - our home. I'm all keyed up to write again, and then the news about the Shuttle.

Although it's a few days too late, some thoughts about suggestions made earlier on the page...
This shuttle mission did not include docking on the ISS. According the NASA, there was no way for Columbia to reach the ISS.
The Soyez vessel used as a 'life boat' for the ISS fits 3 people.
I don't believe they new in advance that the crew was doomed. Very worried, perhaps, but not doomed. That e-mail sent by Colonel Ramon is not exceptional; many astronauts have penned similar thoughts on many missions.

I so hope that this doesn't sour the public attitude about space exploration. It is an adventure based on acceptable risks, and the people involved know it. It is basic to our nature to explore, and we must not let the price paid by our astronauts and cosmonauts be wasted, by becoming cynical and cautious.

On another note entirely...
I've finished my website with the pictures from my holiday in Arizona. The link is below. Christi, I left you your privacy and didn't include your pics, although they turned out great. I'll e-mail them to you seperately.

And Hi! to Pamela! Good to meetcha!

Sasquatch, I've been worried about you! I agree, your cousin did a great job, I loved the yellow snow cone scene.

Jack, (((HUGS))) and best wishes through your surgery.

Rachel, I'm on a mission to meet Notebookers now, so next time I'm down that way, we have to meet up!

Time to run. It took me forever to catch up in here. First I'll go check my HTML so I don't turn everything to italic... ;-)

Blue skies!

Tina 2-4-2003 19:34

Carol:
I was standing where I could make a run for it.

Debra 2-4-2003 13:35

Hi All :)

Debra - I'm not sure I want to picture exactly where you were standing! hehehe I'm glad your hubby's okay though.

Howard - I too, am glad you're still here. You brighten up this board a lot!

Viv -- worms huh? Well, these too shall pass. BTW - try to keep puppy from eating cat food. The cat food is too high in something (I always forget what!) for dogs to handle decently. I do have our cat food (and the litter box!) safetly tucked away from doggies. Cats and dogs do get along in the house most of the time. Its when they're both outside that you have to be careful, then everything's fair game! Now, since you gave me SUCH a good idea for my next scene -- I'm off to write!

Have a great day everyone!
(oops, did I go overboard on the !!! ??)

Carol 2-4-2003 13:24

Never give up - through all the rejections, countless hours...it was worth it all. Visit my author website & see!

R Lance Sheridan R. Lance Sheridan's Bits and Pieces to Ponder... 2-4-2003 13:20

Jerry:

Well it sure looked like it hurt from where I was standing.

Debra 2-4-2003 12:04

Speaking of speeders, one day many years ago when I was a young cop working here in my home town this gal driving a brand spanking new pickup truck (still had the dealers tags in the back window) blew through town at 75 MPH, well it just so happened that I was at a stop sign and shot her with my handy dandy radar pistol.

A brief chase led us just out of town where I gave her a massive (at that time) ticket for 75 in a 35 zone the fine was a bit over 100 bucks. She shouted and hollered, screamed and complained that this was the fourth god damn ticket she got today! What was everyone out to get her? Damn hick cops see a new truck and just have to give it a ticket!

Well I gave her the ticket and took her check to cover the bond, and as she drove away to the west, I called the Highway Patrolman on the radio, who was about five miles west of town and told him to look out for her.

She got her fifth ticket before she left our fine state, and the trooper called North Dakota to let them know to watch out for her.

Some days it's best to keep your mouth shut, especially when there's a cop with a ticket book and a radio standing by your drivers side window.

Sorry to hear of your husband's injury, that's gotta hurt Debra.

Howard - damn lucky your still with us, some maniac's think they can do anything they want and have enough bucks to pay the tickets. That's the wonderful thing about the point system on drivers license. I once got a young drivers license in three weeks from the day he got it. Not that I was watching out for him or anything, he was just an idiot and never looked before he did his thing.

Oh and today, he owns his own business and is doing well, guess he was just getting rid of excess energy or something. Before he learned, I had his license several times. His insurance bill has to be horribly high.

Jerry 2-4-2003 11:18

HOward:

That sasme excat thing happened to my husband two weeks ago. The only difference is the speeder hit him and sent him into a cement bridge on the high way and then sliding into a silver lamp, which he sheered and it fell on his roof.

The auto body guy found a speeding ticket in his car for going 95 ,yes, 95mph the same day on the same stretch of road.

I'm lucky to still have a husband. He wasn't wearing his sealbelt, idiot, and his air bags didn't go off. He hit his groin on the steering wheel and as I like to say Mr. Man his brother Dryal and his other brother Dryal were black and blue for over a week. Not pretty.

NOt only that, the other driver's incurance company is trying to blame my husband and they say the ticket has nothing to do with that accident. Imagine!

If the guy died it would have had to do plenty. He would have died if my husband wasn't there to soften his blow. He was going to hit the wall at that speed, but he hit a 60mph, my husband's truck, coushin instead.

Debra 2-4-2003 10:34

Interesting experience time:
Last Tuesday I took the back way home, which involves a stop sign in Lisle. I stopped, checked the traffic, and noted a car just approaching the railroad crossing in town. Given the 30 mph speed limit, I had more than enough time to make the right turn and get up to speed before he got anywhere near me.
I should have taken a closer look!
I had just barely got straightened from my turn when he flew by me at probably 80 or 90, on the double line, at the bridge entrance! He just missed an oncoming car, and continued to accelerate across the bridge. I never got his license number, but saw that he was driving a BMW sedan.
I got across the bridge and saw him passing a truck further on down the road, again on the double line on a blind curve.
A couple of days later we saw in the paper where a guy from Brooklyn, driving a BMW had been stopped and ticketed for speeding about 30 miles north of us on I81 -- they clocked him at 113MPH. Then later the same guy was clocked at 117 on I81 just south of us, and this time he was arrested and was being held in the BC Jail pending bail.
The times matched up, as did the car, so it must have been the same maniac.
Some people are just plain nutz!

howard 2-4-2003 9:39

Hi Jerry,

I know how it can be to get hot headed. I've blow off steam a time or two, venting out thoughts and ideas. I just wanted to clarify and question. Thanks for answering.

Rachel 2-4-2003 9:16

Took the pup in to the vet today. Found out I lied. We do not have a 4 pound pup. We have a 3 pound pup complete with worms. Wonder what he's going to weigh after the worm medicine.
Good news, he's figured out he cannot chase the cat and I've seen that the cat is not going to harm the pup fatally. I can take him out of his cage now. The cat simply taps the pup on the backside with an unsheathed claw. One wack was enough for respect to kick in and stop the cat chasing. Now they are good buddies.

Also wondered how a three pound pup could go through a ten pound bag of dog food. Watched today. Cat eats pup food, dog eats pup food. Pup eats cat and dog food. Seems a fair trade.

Everything in life works out.

We're still waiting to hear if we got the Texas job. I think we're the kind of characters who might actually like it there. I think a couple more dogs and we'd have the crime rate well under control. That and a few target ranges around the house. Always wanted to blast at cans from my upstairs bathroom window.

Viv 2-4-2003 2:40

Hello all: Have not had a lot of time to check out the Notebook, but wanted to let everyone know that I am off to surgery on Wednesday to get rid of my gall bladder. Otherwise, I am trying to tie up the loose ends on some of the contracts that are outstanding. Hopefully, everyobody is doing well, despite the sad news about Columbia. Take care and be in touch with everyone hopefully this coming weekend. The word I hear is that I will be down for about three days including the surgery. We will see. Take care everyone.

Jack Beslanwitch 2-4-2003 1:30

Randall - Don't dispare, there are hundreds, on thousands, probably millions of such tales telling of such treasures that would make a man an instant billionaire. MOst I believe are pure fiction, but I'm sure there are a few that are true. Surely there are enough to keep the best arm chair treasure hunter's Mitty-like mind a'grindin for many a day.

In fact one day, way back when I was but a Spec 4 in the Army, I was doing an arial recon of an area where the Commo Section at the 3rd ACR at Ft. Bliss Tx were to lay an underground cable to service those units in the field with land line commo back to the base when I spotted a mine, only visuable from the air. Later that week, when we were out with the Post Engineers digging in that cable with a dozer and a plow, we took a break and climbed up to that hole in the tank and explore. Well all we found were some old miners tools, a license plate (TEXAS 1934) and an old cable that led down a shaft streatching down deep into the ground, so deep that when one of my fellow soldiers began his decent, he became so tired, he barly made it back up, and he was far from the bottom. Who knows what lay at the bottom of that pit? Maybe it's a lost silver mine? Maybe Al Capone had his vault there and Geraldo was mistaken? Maybe it's just a hole in the ground?

What lay below exists only in the mind of the writer who remembers a day in his distant past. Then again, maybe Jimmy Maze from Overdosa Texas went back there and found his fortune? Could be I haven't heard from Jimmy since I left Texas.

Jerry 2-4-2003 0:16

Randall

Jerry ... I'm not sure about the legalities of whom was born where. As Americans who travel freely within the country, it's not a problem. Thank the Lord for that, eh. Our daughter Sara was born in Utah. I was told one time that any crime commited on the GROUNDS of a Post Office was a federal rap.

BTW and from far left field ... any of you guys ever hear about the Tayopa mine in Mexico? The lost mine Tayopa? Worked by the Jesuits for the King of Spain way back when? Suppose to be the most fabulous hoard of gold and silver and jewels ... ever. As the historical record shows, the Jesuits worked a complex of 17 mines for many, many years in the 15th century. The Jesuits, although loyal to the King of Spain had a higher authority. Consquently they kept back a little more than the King of Spain might allow. Finally the Native slaves revolted, and killed every Spainard they could find. The Jesuits left a storeroom of treasure...

So what Randall?

Well, I'm swaping e-mails with a guy who lives in Mexico and claims that he has filed a claim on the area, some 3500 acres. He even sent me a topo with the mine complex location. He says he is awaiting permission from the Mexican government to remove the metal. WOW!

But the bad thing about this ... some of us guys need dreams and adventure and impossible tales of lost wealth. Even though the chances of Randall ever finding something like that is remote, to hear that, yes, it was found and now rests in a bank vault is depressing.

But ... he said he might need a ghostwriter to tell the whole story ... and I just happen to know a hack writer capable of such a feat. Of course this person would ask for a free tour of the legendary Jesuit storeroom where gold and silver bars are stacked like cordwood and bins overflow with precious and semi-precious jewels. Perhaps no one would notice if he slipped out with a 115 pound bar of gold stuffed in his pants and an emerald in his mouth? You think?

:-)

Randall

Randall 2-3-2003 22:36

Randall - Did I mention that I once lived in Texas, for oh, about five or six years, I forget how long, and our daughter is a born Texan, I think that gives her Texan status. Well she was born in an Army Hospital in Texas, maybe it's like the Embassy rule, any ground under an Army Hospital is considered US territory, and not Texas land. No I don't think that's right but with today's laws who the hell knows.

I passed that along to all my old cop friends and have received it back today no less then seven times. Most of those guys are just lazy and send it to all their cop buddies and forget to not send it back, but it's still fun to read every time, like I say in today's world.

On the Shuttle thing, I've turned off CNN because that's al they've been talking about since it happened at 7:00 AM our time yesterday, or was it the day before, I forget now.

Have RUSH playing on my computer right now since our radio reception is so poor the only way I can get him so I understand what he's saying is to link to a radio station that's broadcasting his show. Today it's WLS, yesterday I tried a station out of California but today all the California stations were overloaded so it looks like a BUNCH of conservatives (Cheap ones like me who don't subscribe to RUSH 24/7) are tuning in to see what Rush has to say about everything from the State of the Union Speech to the Challenger disaster.

I do agree with you Randall - there had to be someone on board who could have put on his EVA suite and do a quick space walk around, hell they had to be able to get out how else to they deploy all the crap they haul up in the cargo bay?

I do believe there's something rotten in Huston.

Jerry 2-3-2003 14:49

Randall

Hey!

Jerry ... Conservative TEXAN's answer? Jeeze, you guys up north must think Texans are a bunch of gun toting, overbearing, big bellied wackos! Well ... okay, I'll give you that one ... but most of us don't have big bellies though! :-) Partner! :-) Which reminds me of a story I heard some time ago. An Israeli soldier was questioned why he shot a bomb carrying terrorists 12 times. He answered. "My magazine was empty."

I have watched enhanced stop frame photos of "insulation" breaking loose and striking the left wing of the shuttle. As the main booster insulation is orange...the loose section striking the wing looks clear. Could it be ice? And if it was ice then we have an object that could weigh hundreds of pounds...if not more.

Secondly...Ron Dittamore, space shuttle director said there were no provisions for EVA (stepping outside) and looking things over. Add to this remarkable declaration an additional statement that there was no provision for repairing broken or loose tiles and furthermore... ANY ATTEMPT MIGHT DAMAGE THE TILES! WHAT!

Well Ron, if there are no provisions for an astronaut to EVA? No means of repairing the outside of the shuttle? But the danger of a weightless person, floating through space, damaging the insulating tiles? This begs the question ... WHAT THE HELL? Holy cow! NASA has been flying the shuttle in excess of 20 years and this contingency has not been thought of? NASA couldn't put someone ... outside ... to do a walk around and look see? How about carrying a bucket of super glue and a tile repair kit? Repairing the insulating tiles couldn't be rocket science! (Uhhhhh, oh boy!) I mean the shuttle crew has load specialists, cargo specialists, pilot, co-pilot etc. Why not a guy in the very back seat with a handyman tool belt who could go outside, fix things up, at least report on damage? Jeeze!

"Ah, you there. Astronaut Randall. Yes, you! Get your helmet on. Take out the twinkies first!!!"

"Huh?"

"Drop the twinkie, put down the fishing magazine and get dressed, you're going for a walk."

"Where?"

"Outside Astronaut Randall! It's about time you earned the six bits an hour we're paying you!"

Sorry for the levity, but good grief.

Did anyone see a brief news clip Saturday morning, supposedly shot from New Mexico? There is a flagpole, a red horizon as the sun breaks, the shuttle streaking overhead. Did anyone see that? There was an object in the short clip that made me sit straight up and shout. "What the hell was that?"

If there was any question about America being in possession of alien UFO's the shuttle disaster should quell that. If we have and have had for the last 30 years the technology to negate gravity and ease reentry, now would be the time to speak up. There has to be an easier way. Entering the Earth's atmosphere at 16,000 miles an hour with wing temps of 3,000 degrees (F) is a recipe for disaster ... and it finally caught up with the program and killed seven fine human explorers.

Randall

Randall 2-3-2003 14:34

Viv:

Puppies are one of life's most fun. Did you ever hear people play the game say a word and the person says what's the first thing that comes to mind?

Well this is how it would go with me.

black white

Cat dog

What would you hate the most about going blind?
Never seeing a puppy again.

I have been able to answer that question the same way all my life, not that I get it much.

Debra 2-3-2003 7:56

Eddie don't worry:

Personnally, my view is simplistic too. I don't care about the loss of equipment at all. I'm only sorry for the loss of life. Not only that, but they were some of the best and brightest. All loss of life is tragic. I just especially hate it when someone scraps the cream off the top.

I don't think NASA knew they were doomed. They would have done something.

What's next stories that some of them made it and are being kept alive in a secret hospital. That is what's next.

Watch!

Debra 2-3-2003 7:51

Randall: Yay! I'll be looking for your package this week. Also watching the mail for a new hard drive. Mine crashed. Thanks to Carol, I didn't loose much. She saved the day by sending me Chapter 12...all the writing I'd done for the last month. I'm really missing my own computer. I have to wait in line at the house or at the library. Frustration. Worst part is sitting in one place to write.

Thank you Carol! I would have been crying, instead I'm simply writing away and waiting for the hard drive to get in.

Been distracted this week by a tiny problem in the form of a pup. I went a bit nuts the last day of work and finally got that Papillion (Continental Toy Spaniel). He's a nutcase. I named him Gizmo. He looks like a Gremlin. Probably not the most imaginative or intellectual thing I've ever named an animal but this one's a Gizmo. Sometimes a name just suggests itself when you look at the animal. I don't especially like this name, but it fits.

Giz is 100% puppy. I've got poka-dots all over the rug to prove it. The cat is traumatized, the main dog is horrified into behaving, and the entire family is waiting on a 4 pound dog like he was the Prince of Wales.

Cheri: I hear you. What an awful way to loose friends. I hate changes such as these. Concentrate on the writing and we'll enjoy having you in the notebook a little more.

Viv 2-3-2003 0:55

Rosemary - I forgot to mention, wireless, that's the up and coming form of internet hook up. We have that here too, a fellow set it up and is offering free set up, but you have to buy the radio receiver for it. It offers speeds up to 512 KBPS (the fastest modem hook up is 56KBPS) I don't know anyone who has hooked up, I do know he has a quite a few subscribers, just none that I know personally. I drop by his shop once in awhile to see how he's doing, and he's all smiles. He has erected new antenna relays now and servers much of the local country folks who aren't close enough to the central office to get DSL (I think they only go out like 5 miles from the switching central, or maybe not even that far, maybe it was three, I forget now). The neat thing about the wireless is that you can use it at home, in the car, camping, whatever so long as you have a wireless modem in your computer.

Jerry 2-3-2003 0:03

Rosemary - No, you don't need cable for DSL, it's a totally different type set up. What it is is a digital subscriber line, or some call it a dedicated subscriber line, which is probably the right thing to call it. The internet comes into your home on your present telephone line but at a much higher signal ratio then normal telephone, then there is a filter that filters out the internet signal and allows the telephone to work at the same time as the internet.

Your probably right though if all you do is a bit of research, some email and the notebook then you probably couldn't justify the setup fee and additional cost for the DSL modem. I think setup around here is like a hundred bucks, we got in on the first go-around and got free setup, in fact since I had two incoming phone lines at the time, the phone company installed the first DSL in town at my home (just in case they had the second line to depend on but they didn't need it).

Rachel - your probably right, I was just sounding off, it was one of those days when the thoughts ran rampage and with the incident with Columbia, it just sort of built up to a high pitch and I let it fly.

I think many in this country must feel the same though from time to time, the political crap that goes on in congress is so idiotic it's amazing we have any freedom, or money for that matter left.

Americo - I too agree, had the Space Center known that the Shuttle would burn up on re-entry, they could have done many things, as Eddie said, the small space station is there, also I'm sure they could have left the shuttle in orbit long enough to send up one of the other shuttles for a rescue mission. I could be done, but may have taken some time. Again I'm sure there was enough O2, food and such for the crew to wait out the rescue.

We Americans are quite good at operating quickly in a pinch and I'm sure something would have been done had there been foreknowledge of the problems with the Shuttle. Tonights news said that the ground crew were aware of the beginnings of the problem while the shuttle was entering over California, but at the speed they were traveling, there was virtually no time to take remedial action.

Jerry 2-2-2003 23:56

I do realise that my last post may have seemed simplistic when viewed in the context of the shuttle mission, but remember, if the ground crew had known from the launch that the craft would not make it back, they would have had sixteen days to get a plan together.
Apollo 13 did not have the luxury of sixteen days. I also realise that they did not have a docking ring mechanism on board. Having said all that, they must have had a few eva suits between the two craft.
Ed

Eddie French 2-2-2003 17:51

Americo,
I just cannot subscribe to that theory. Had officials at NASA known what was going to happen upon re-entry they had options which they could persue.

1 They could have left the shuttle docked at the ISS and brought the crew home on the Russian escape module (which I think can carry seven.

2 They could have left the crew at the ISS until another shuttle could have been launched with a minimal crew compliment in oerder to bring five of the 107 crew back. There are only three residents at the ISS right now so it is well below capacity.

I think that the officials at NASA simply made a bad call after convincing themselves that the initial damage at launch was minimal.
If they learned anything after 1886 it was that it pays to be honest and open with the general public. I believe that they will come clean and lay it all out on the table. That way they will enlist continued support.
To procrastinate over blame and cause is to lose public support forever.

Ed

Eddie French 2-2-2003 14:47

Hello all,

JERRY,
Don't you have to have cable to get DSL hookup? I don't have cable. I'm not even sure it's available here, and the phone has to be a Metro line to be able to call into San Antonio (10 miles East of us) without long distance charges. Since the phone by itself is $42 per month (without extra add-ons) I don't really want more charges than necessary.

I've had dial up for the last seven years and there is really very little inconvience. Copper's time limit is about six hours per day which is at least 4 hours more than I would usually need. I don't download things. I also (so far, knock on wood) haven't had any viruses. Copper charges $9.95 per month or less if you pay by the year, and there are no set-up charges. If I needed the hook-up for all the complicated things you do, I'd probably look into DSL service.
Thanks for the info. anyway.

Two of our geese are living in my back yard right now because they can't get along with the other three in the goose pen. My poor poodle is having a terrible time keeping the yard clear of chickens (that's one of his main jobs) when he's in mortal danger if he gets too close to these geese. What to do? What to do?

Life is one long question.

Rosemary 2-2-2003 13:48

Hi Jerry,

You said “We need leaders who aren't afraid of their party, who are true in-dependants, who will attack the status quo...the original purpose of Congress, protecting and serving the states not dictating policy not taking over all the duties and responsibilities of the state and local governments.” This is a nice thought, an exciting thought, but if somebody tried it I bet they would be shot dead inside a week. Such a leader would likely be viewed as a dictator wannabe. A man who would think he could step up and fly in the face of the rules of the most powerful country in the world without being answerable to anyone? Perhaps I misunderstood you. It seems to me that if there were people such as this, that they wouldn’t give a flying rats ass what anyone in Congress had to say. If Congress made one squeak against their intent, then congress would be disabled, disgraced, invalidated or ignored. The distribution of power and levels of accountability, along with the personal and political agendas of individuals can make for displays of stupidity and futility, but it is a part of how we ensure that each person is heard, no matter how stupid their cranberry notion might be.

Rachel 2-2-2003 13:01

You know I don't think I'd take off for a long trip, say off to the West Coast in a 1981 vehicle. What made NASA think they could take such an old vehicle up into space? I know they do lots of maintenance on them between flights and all that but you have to wonder at the tremendous stress and strain that the vehicle undergoes when it lands and take off into space.

We spend billions of dollars on such things as studies into why cranberries can't be grown in Minnesota, we pay farmers to plant those stupid plants in that state knowing the won't grow in that latitude, money that could be put into new space craft to protect our brave astronauts.

When will we ever learn? How many brave souls must be torn to bits in terrible accidents such as this?

We need a real Mr. Sterling, even if he is an in-dependant who votes with the liberal democrats.

We need leaders who aren't afraid of their party, who are true in-dependants, who will attack the status quo, who will rip apart the wasteful spending, kill pork barrel spending and get back to the original purpose of Congress, protecting and serving the states not dictating policy not taking over all the duties and responsibilities of the state and local governments. (Wow talk about a run on sentence!)

Such things as this disaster make my blood run hot over what our government has become, of where they place their priorities.

Then thinking back at the stupid comments made by some in Congress over the upcoming war, about reinstating the draft so "it's fair to the races when they begin to die in combat?" What a bunch of BS, our military is all volunteer, those who are now serving ASK to serve, they did it for many varied reasons and I'm sure most didn't think when they joined they would be facing death in some sand box in the middle east but you gotta wonder what they were thinking, the purpose of the military is to kill people and wreck things.

I can understand the thinking of many, and it's not all their fault. I was an Army Recruiter in the late 70's after the end of the draft and I know the way Recruiters ply their trade (well the way we did it in the 70's anyhow)

We sold things like training, the Montgomery GI Bill that would pay for your education, travel, excitement and job training. BUT we always let the recruit know what the purpose of an army was, and in Basic Combat Training, they learned how to break things and kill people.

Enough ranting, gotta get ready for church.

Oh a bit of levity:

TEST YOUR POLITICS:

Question: You're walking down a deserted street with your wife and two small children. Suddenly, a dangerous looking man with a huge knife comes around the corner and is running at you while screaming obscenities. In your hand is a Glock .40 and you are an expert shot. You have mere seconds before he reaches you and your family. What do you do? _________________________________________________

Liberal Answer:

Well, that's not enough information to answer the question! Does the man look poor or oppressed? Have I ever done anything to him that is inspiring him to attack?

Could we run away?

What does my wife think?

What about the kids?

Could I possibly swing the gun like a club and knock the knife out of his hand?

What does the law say about this situation?

Is it possible he'd be happy with killing just me?

Does he definitely want to kill me or would he just be content to wound me?

If I were to grab his knees and hold on, could my family get away while he was stabbing me?

This is all so confusing! I need to debate this with some friends for a few days to try to come to a conclusion. __________________________________________________

Conservative Answer:

BANG!

_________________________________________________

Conservative Texan's Answer:

BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! Click! Click!... (sounds of clip being ejected and fresh clip installed.)

Wife: "Sweetheart, he looks like he's still moving, what do you kids think?"

Son: "Mom's right Dad, I saw it too..."

BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG!

Daughter: "Nice grouping, Dad!"

Jerry 2-2-2003 11:34

Americo,

In speaking with family and friends yesterday, I expressed much the same things as you have said here (thought not with such eloquence and fluidity). Had I know of the e-mail to the one astronauts father my conviction would only have been strengthened. These people were explorers, they were courageous, people and when I think of what they gave my heart is filled with patriotic passion (which is no easy thing to do). I can not think of any field of exploration be it land, ocean space, physiology or the mind that has not had its accidents and tragedies. The quest for knowledge must go on. The astronauts would have been the first to say so. I must say that I hesitated to write anything like this on this site. Americo, you have given me courage to speak up. When I talked to my family members they were shocked that I could suggest that they knew the shuttle would likely burn up on entry. They didn't like that I said such a thing. I feel for every person who played a part in this loss. I am sure that the ground support that survived this will suffer in their hearts for the decisions made and not made in reagards to this tragedy.

PS - This is my second post on this. Seb pounded the keyboard on my first effort, causing it to vanish, so, if there is another post here, very much the same as this one, then please excuse my double enter event.

Rachel 2-2-2003 11:02

The space shuttle Columbia was doomed when, on launching, some debris damaged tile(s) near the left wing of the aircraft. At least some members of the Nasa staff knew that the craft could not stand the intense heat of the entry on the Earth atmosfere. It would be useless to inform the aircraft crew, as there was nothing they could do to fix the damage. Tell the family, the world? It was not the first time that the "popcorn effect" caused by the rocket on launching caused damage on the tiles of the shuttle fuselage. Better remain silent and pray for a miracle. Ilian Ramon, the Israeli astronaut, knew that his and his companions fate was already written in heaven, otherwise he would not have emailed his father that he was "so happy that he did not want to return to Earth."

Is this fact or fiction? Only further research to the causes of the tragedy will let us know. For the moment, all we can do is to cry for the victims of the disaster and present our condolences to the family of the crew. Many thousands of the XIVth and XVth discoverers died "to give new worlds to the world", only to be called "colonists" later. But that's the price of human endeavour and courage. Space exploration must go on.

Americo 2-2-2003 8:24

That's intresting, Yahoo has now shut down my ability to link to a photo on my web page, what a bunch of crap! Guess I'll be seeking another free web site that isn't so shitty about their "rules"

Jerry 2-1-2003 23:32

Here's that link I was trying to display, just click the link and it should work

Jerry The Crew 2-1-2003 23:30

Rosemary - I'd look around a bit and see how much more it would cost for a DSL hook-up. Lot less hastle, you only need the one phone line and you can get speeds up to 8 times that of dial up. Plus you can be online and the phone still works, so it makes life so much easier online. As far as cost, our DSL hook up is costing us like ten bucks more then we paid for the extra line and internet service. Also it's a bunch more reliable, in fact when the whole town was without phone service a month ago due to some screwup with the central office, only those of us with DSL had both internet and phone service since we bi-passed the central office where the screw up was.

Had advantages too as you can be online 24/7 if you want, I leave my system online when I go to bed, just tell Kazaa what files I want to download while I sleep, and when I get up they are there waiting for me.

Jerry 2-1-2003 23:29

Howard,

You're right about that one :o)

Rachel 2-1-2003 21:49

Rosemary,

It is a hard day. Each place I have gone has been filled with talk of the loss. I am far from the place the event occured, I can only imagine the shock that the people of the state and country must be feeling.

I don't know anything about the server that you mention. I wish you the best with you connections. I know what a royal pain the butt it can be to change accounts over.

Rachel 2-1-2003 21:43

A sad afternoon to all,

I live in South Central Texas and we seem to be far from the debris path. We never hear the sonic boom as the shuttles go over.

The shuttles do land here on the way home when they have to land in California, and it is always an emotional sight to see the big bird sitting on top of the gigantic cargo carrier that is giving it a ride home to Florida.

I'm pretty sure we still have people in the space station up there, so short of depending on the Russians to bring them home, and that sounds dangerous to me, we'll have to go up at least once more fairly soon.

TO CHANGE THE SUBJECT AND WHINE SOME,
I'm in the process of getting rid of CompuServe and they definitely don't make it easy. I called last week and they said service will be discontinued the day I tell them to do it, so if I don't want to lose time I've already paid for, I have to call on exactly the billing day. This brilliant person said my billing day is Feb. 16, so I have to call before noon on that day. I said OKay. After I hung up, I noticed the 16th is a Sunday and on top of that, he didn't say where he was so who knows the time zone. Well, I'm going to give them two days and cancel on Fri. the 14th. But first I'm going to call again Monday and make sure that PERSON knew what he was talking about. I worked in Accounts Receivable and Accounts Payable for years and that is not the way rational companies work. Sounds fishy to me.

I'm switching to Copper dile-up service. If anyone has heard anything about them,----I'm not sure I want to hear about it, but if it's really bad, please let me know.

It's been a beautiful weekend here and we're all dragging around and sad.

Oh well,

Rosemary 2-1-2003 18:58

My God, What a tragic event. My thoughts are with the families of the crew. All of you who live in Texas be careful......and report in asap.
Ed

Eddie French 2-1-2003 15:12

Yep, I should read my books before I do stuff like that.

Jerry 2-1-2003 13:32

http://www.geocities.com/jerrag2000/Columbia.jpg">
http://www.geocities.com/jerrag2000/Columbia.jpg">

It is indeed a very sad day for the United States, it's friends and allies.

Jerry 2-1-2003 13:31

I've just seen the tragic new of the loss of the Space Shuttle Columbia. Such a loss is always tragic and it is indeed ironic that Columbia carried the first ever Israeli Astronaut. Even more ironic was the report from Palestine, Texas, that debris fell to earth in the vicinity of the town. Reports coming in say that there is no evidence for any terrorist involvement – I hope that this is proved to be true and that was just another 'accident' that can be rectified in future Shuttle missions. That will be cold comfort to relatives, friends, and colleagues of those 7 souls lost, but the conspiracy theorists will probably already be theorising and upsetting those who are grieving.

My heart and my prayers go out to those left behind to grieve.

Litter 2-1-2003 12:49

Randall

Yes Debra there are notebookers here from Texas. And it is a sad day, for America, Israel and the world. My wife and I heard "something" early this morning, but there is so much noise in this neighborhood it could have been anything. Now the news stations are reporting debris in New Mexico, so the shuttle may have been coming apart for as long as a minute before it was over Texas. No, I don't believe the accident was an act of terror.

Randall

Randall 2-1-2003 12:08

Another sad day in the world today, as we sit glued to the television or radio waiting for NASA to tell us what happened, while the talking heads try to make the news by their guesses and their guests who claim to know what happened.

I just heard a guy who sounded exactly like Hank Hill (King of the Hill cartoon character on FOX) tell of his departure from the ranch in Texas via horseback to search for the source of "burning rubber" in the horse pasture.

Now reports of debris in Nacogosious Texas.

What was NASA thinking putting a 1981 shuttle up in space again, hell I wouldn't trust a 1981 Ford or Chevy to take me on a long trip, especially one into space! I guess age isn't the point in such things as space craft but geeze that's old.

One has to wonder in today's world if some terrorist got aboard the craft and sat a bomb to go off on re-entry, especially with an Col. in the Israel Army, one who piloted an aircraft on the strike against our foe Iraq that blew up their nuclear reactor several years ago.

BTW I couldn't post last night, seems Webwitch was down, or at least that's what I figured as I could get most anywhere else, even got into the notebook but when I selected the post I got a 404 error.

Jerry 2-1-2003 10:37

Do we have any folks here from the texas or Lousania area here in the notebook?

In case you didn't hear stay away from anything that even looks like space debrie. You could die in 48hours. We need all our beloved notebookers in tact.

Debra 2-1-2003 10:30

RACHEL -- That's what we dads are for! It's a lifetime thing. It's called love.

:-)

howard 1-31-2003 23:59

Hi all,

I can't believe that I just made a Daddy help! phone call (grins and laughter). I haven't called my Dad for help, in over thirteen years. I have been having a meltdown trying to sort out how to creat charts and graphs on my computer. My poor baby has been abused and mis-used by the children of the house. It has been exposed to malicious intent and accident. In any event, if I can't sort out how to do this, it will be Daddy to the rescue.

I also put out a call to an iMac Magi in hopes that he can help me figure out all that my Mac can do. I however do not know if he will be able to connect with me before I freak out.

It is kind of nice to know that no matter how old I get, or how many children that I have, my Dad will still be there to lend an assist. I've only to ask. Gezz, I'm glowin.

Rachel 1-31-2003 18:08

Hi Randall,

I hope you are better soon.

Rachel 1-31-2003 16:42

Poor, poor RANDALL. I hope you feel better soon. My husband has been down with the flu most of the week, and he hardly ever gets sick.

CHERI,

I am glad you like posting here. I certainly liked your post and hope you continue to participate. The nice thing about being on the Notebook is that you have friends who do not go away even when you move. Having moved 4 times since visiting here, I actually have more continuity with folks here than with many in the non-Internet world. Congratulations on your husband's promotion, and I hope you soon find another job as well.

PAMELA,

I would loan you my copy of SHADOWS IN A DREAM if I could. I think I just followed the link Jack gave and bought it over the Internet.

AMERICO,

You are so right in your post. I don't think I would have stuck around all these years if there were not so many points of views and so many different perspectives on all sorts of subjects.

I have so very few people to have a real discussion with. My husband is intelligent, but he and I agree very closely in our political and world views, so we very rarely argue about such things. Then there are other people I do not feel close enough to to discuss such issues. But where ever I live, I tend to find most of the people around me not disagreeing much. Perhaps I am so adament, no one dares says anything contrary to what I put forward. But the beauty is that folks like AMERICO and MARK and others here are not intimidated by me (isn't that a terribly passive sentence?). So that makes things very interesting.

I think that when people respect one another, many different things can be discussed and everyone gets the opportunity to learn from others. Another thing is that we are all writers here and all of us love the world of ideas, and we are not afraid of other perspectives. In order to create characters, a writer has to be empathetic and willing to enter the head of someone utterly different from himself or herself.

Rhoda 1-31-2003 16:02

RANDALL

Morning!

Home sick ... again!

Good friends ... my mother had a series of cats in her lifetime named Trouble or Troubles. We had a rather prissy neighbor when I was a child, the kind who could not be bothered with living and life and gave new meaning to the term NOSY BUNS. Anyway, one night Mom was standing at the back fence, looking in the alley, calling for "Troubles." Ms Nosy Buns bounded out of her home and asked mom what was all the hollering about. Mom, in all innocence, (I'm sure) said "I'm looking for Trouble." Mom later related the woman turned white and reentered her home quickly!

(Chortle)

I believe you can tell a lot about the names a person gives their pets. My first dog was named Kiser after my grandparents, a swell name for a Doberman. My second Dobie was named Tuco after the character in THE GOOD, THE BAD and THE UGLY played by Eli Wallach. Tuco's son was named Sepp after a WW II German Waffen SS tank commander, General Sepp Dietrich. (Don't ask, it's a long story.)

I worked with a man who called his small, black dog, Tar Baby. (I have no idea why.) He renamed the dog after a brief but terse conversation with a new neighbor, who was black. Oh their families were good friends for many years afterward and laughed over the changed name many times. That might be rare these days. I once had a dog named Ester, cause it nearly drowned in a bucket of water ... Ester Williams. I have a friend who named his corvette Mud Hole, cause he said it didn't have enough power to get out of a mudhole!

Moving along ... in the early 1960's we named our Mexican Burro, Bertha, my grandmothers name. My brother and I once had a pet Red Tail hawk named Hawk-a-Baby, a rabbit named Frank, a 1955 Chevrolet we called @$% *%^ piece of #$^@, a girl was known around town as Old ... well, better leave this one alone. But not to worry ladies, a local mechanic is known as "Greasy Hands" because of what his girlfriend looked like after a noon time interlude. A funeral home operator known as Plant ‘em Deep Smith. Assorted doctors ... Bones; dentists ... Yank ‘em All! My nickname from Hi School was RBD and only at the point of death will I reveal what that stands for! Another hi school friend...to his great chagrin is called Ladder. Was caught with a bunch of others spying on the football cheerleaders locker room.

Like I said, names ... Brownwood once had a police officer we named Back Seat ... because of what he and his girl friend were caught doing in the BACK SEAT of his patrol car! Jerry? Know any stories along this line? Every town has a police officer known affectionately as A** Hole or Ticket Master! A deputy sheriff known as "Wyatt" or "Quick Draw." A traffic judge known as, Hanging John! We once had a mayor known as Back Pockets ... a local attorney known as Jailhouse John. No, he resides there, or did as of recently. A vet was named Wide Body, because of his girth. My dad worked at the old Santa Fe railroad with a man named Derail Jones, cause of the many accidents he was in. A close friend is Crab, his brother Fox, their father Groner (the funniest Mortician in Texas!) My brother's nickname is Turtle or Cooler (once caught stealing, ah borrowing, a case of beer out of a walk in cooler.) A plumber friend is High Water because of a small mistake that flooded the court house basement. A man who runs a road side Bar-b-gue stand was once caught digging up a cow that had been killed on the highway the previous day ... Steaks or Daisy. The Daisy escapes me, but I know what it COULD mean. I know a guy named Drips, because he was once caught stealing "drip gas" from an oil field refinery one night. (Runs fairly well in OLD vehicles, but smells terrible!) Most cafe cooks are called Greasy or Easy Over or Smokes. The entire Highway Department road crew is known as the Dig it Up Boys!

Well ... I sense I'm boring you all sooooooo

Bye Bye

Randall "Over the Edge" Henderson

Randall 1-31-2003 13:51

Hi Cheri,

I hope that all will turn out well. Your post has such an optimistic tone to it. It was a pleasure to read on this rain soaked morning. Yup, you were a ray of sunshine. Thanks.

Rachel

Hi Pamela,

The name that "Shadows in a Dream" can be found under is, John McIntyre. I do not believe that you will find it at your local library. I think that there is a link to the book at the forwriters.com portion of this site. I wish you all the best in and for your writing.

Rachel

Rachel 1-31-2003 11:37

Under the animal names department. We have two birds, Birch and Cedar. I am thinking of calling the mice in our house, breakfast, lunch and dinner. Our cat Polly has turned out to be an excellent mouser. Oh the joys of the life in the country. The rain comes, the water is on the rise, the mice are looking for warm and dry, oh yes :o) I liked the Smith and Wesson, that was good.

Jerry,

I can relate to the famliy thinking writers are weird. I think that weird is good.

Rachel 1-31-2003 11:31

My brother has two dogs. A Bision and a Maltese named Happy and Gilmore.

Debra 1-31-2003 10:28

How about coronial and Sanders

Debra 1-31-2003 10:26

Jerry jerry jerry.......

heeeeheee!

Debra 1-31-2003 9:48

I love to visit this site every day!

Such amusing folk we have. It makes me smile and brightens my day.

Unfortunately, I have some bad news from my life. My department was informed on Tuesday that our jobs are being relocated to Utica, NY. I live in central New Jersey. We don’t have a set departure date; it’s tentatively scheduled for the third quarter. Don’t know if that’s the beginning or the end of the third quarter. The thing that really bugs most of us here is that WE have to TRAIN the people taking our jobs!!!! WHAT A CROCK OF S--- ! Needless to say, most of us are quite pissed off about it.

I’m not too worried about getting another job, heck I might even go back to college and get a degree! The thing that is really upsetting is that these people have become like family to me. I’ve been with the company for almost ten years, seven of which have been in this department. I’m really going to miss these people.

At least now I’ve become more determined to write!

On the good news front, my husband may be getting a sizable raise (cross fingers). We’ll find out today, I think.

Just wanted to let all of you know how much you make me smile and inspire me. Thank you.

Cheri 1-31-2003 8:37

Randall - I'd just name them Smith & Wesson after the tool that will be used if they fail to accomplish the cat's first duty, learning where the litter box is.

Just kidding but that would be a great set of names and think of what the neighbors would think when your wife hollers "SMITH and WESSON" "HERE SMITH & WESSON!"

Jerry 1-31-2003 0:33

TINA -- I just read that you don't really need a parachute in order to skydive! Go figure!
You do, however, need one to make that second jump...

howard 1-30-2003 23:54

Go ahead and laugh -- I was just trying to type this and got about this far () when I realized I was typing on my grandson's keyboard, and there was nothing appearing on the screen.
OK, I'll explain: I'm watching Joel (or is it the other way 'round?) today and tomorrow, and he loves the keyboard. So when I'm sitting at the computer, trying to type, it's a constant battle for the keys.
But then I had a brainstorm! I rummaged through the "whatever" pile, found a spare keyboard, and put it in front of my regular one. I can reach over it, but Joel can't.
But I just forgot it was there, and it took me a few secs to realize it wasn't putting up any words on the screen!

howard 1-30-2003 23:51

Randall - that story made perfect sense to me. Now, why is the naming of cats so much more fun than naming dogs? Miss Briggs is named after Briggs and Straton motors, Dickie is short for Dick H..., and Dash rode on the dash all the way home. Yet, Lyndi, Dixie and Moose simply "look" like a Lyndi, a Dixie and a Moose. Ah, well, I'm sure with all the "weird" thinking writers on this site, we'll come up with some reason!

Carol 1-30-2003 23:15

RANDALL

Good evening all...

I'm sad to say we are having a bit of a problem at the house. It began last weekend, weeeeeeeeell it really began when out cat Suzy, formerly known as Scorch had two kittens, three weeks ago. Suzy is concerned about overpopulation and wants to do her share. We have decided to keep these two, as we gave the last two away. Anyway, I am fed up with the giggles and chuckles emulating from my wife, Debbie and daughter Sara this week.

Friday night we were discussing names for the two kittens. In all innocence I suggested In and Out. From Debbie and Sara's blank looks I decided to explain.

"Well it makes perfect sense to me."

"You're a writer," my wife snickered. "Everything weird makes sense to a writer!"

"What does the Playboy Cyber Bunny site have to do with writing?" Sara added dryly.

"Never mind!" I answered quickly. "Ah, research, for my next story."

"Yeah, right." both my ladies exchanged glances wise beyond their years.

"No. No really, listen as I explain. You see we can put In and Out, outside, together. Then we can call In and Out inside. But, if In wanted to stay out, that would be okay too. I mean if Out wanted to come in, I have no problem with that. But if In was in and Out, out then we would know where they both were at all times."

"I'm mystified?" My daughter commented shaking her head.

"Well, by their names we could keep track of who was in and which one out. In would always be in when Out was out. To save confusion, Out could only come in when In was out. Out would be out, versus In, in. If In was in, we could put Out, out. Get it? Both In and Out could be out at one time but it will be confusing and we'll have to make adjustments. Same thing if In and Out were in at the same time."

I faintly heard Sara whisper to her mother. "Dad's finally gone bye-bye. Still got that shrinks nighttime phone number?"

"Right here." My wife patted her blouse pocket. "Been expecting this."

Disregarding their negative input I added. "So we name one In and the other Out."

Laughing they stood and walked into the kitchen. "Nope. In will be Fireball and Out will be Fluffy."

As I sat fuming on my somewhat tarnished throne of power, Sara brought me both kittens. "Here Dad, do something useful. This is more relaxing than the Playboy site."

Well, you know...naming kittens In and Out might be confusing for less receptive minds I suppose. And, after all, kittens should look like their names? So, Americo, how did your two cats come to be known as Jon and Pussy? Americo...thanks for the kind words...I vote for Jerry's stories, Rhoda's wisdom, Mark's flair and Howard's vintage eastern wit. Tina for first person sky diving, Viv's tales of Japan. (BTW, Viv, I mailed THE package last Monday) Heather's enormous labor of love. There are GREAT writers on this site and I urge ALL newcomers to contribute and learn. Learning from friends is a lot more fun that learning in a dry academic atmosphere. So Jon, how about a GROUP award? We might get together and send you a little catnip...seasoned with just a whiff of kitty-cat Viagra? Hum? For those long, enthusiastic nights in the alley ... dare I say ... surrounded by all that tail?

Randall

(Grin)

Randall 1-30-2003 21:34

Those metaphors were as funny as watching a spider try to run after pulling all its legs off! I laughed so hard I cried like a person having surgery without anesthesia! The people who claim we don't have a good education system are as wrong as someone who has been told over and over again not to do something but then goes ahead and does it anyway.

Can I get "Shadows In A Dream" at my friendly neighborhood library? What was used for the author's name? It's great that you guys did that, I've been seeing postings about the short story collection (didn't realize it was about ghosts, though) and am hoping along with all the contributors that it gets published too.

Does Jon have a problem with ghosts? That's funny because I thought at first that Americo might be one, or be a channel bringing insight from Jon on the other side. Thanks, Jerry, for clueing me in on that.

Pamela 1-30-2003 18:18

Great, enjoy.

Jerry 1-30-2003 17:55

JERRY: Perfick!

Teekay 1-30-2003 17:44

JERRY: Wow! That was quick :-D Thank you so much. I haven't listened to it yet, it's still incoming.

Teekay 1-30-2003 17:22

Teekay - just sent it off to you via Email, hopefully it's the full song, I didn't test it before I sent it, as my computer is furnishing the music right now, playing old country music.

Jerry 1-30-2003 16:59

Teekay- Downloading your request as I type.

Welcome to all the Newbe's stick around this place grows on you like fungus on the wall behind the leaky sewer pipe.

Carol - see, I liked that post in fact there is some great stuff there, just don't know where I'd use it.

Americo - What Eddie said. Stick around we need your liberal European thoughts to awaken our inner selves or something like that. I see your fearless leader is standing beside ours on the war topic. Smart guy you got there.

Jerry Me 1-30-2003 16:50

JERRY: If it's not too much trouble would you be able to send me the song 'once in a lifetime' by talking heads? Thanks in advance.

Teekay 1-30-2003 15:28

Hello Howard :)

See, someone's reading. I just haven't had much to say lately to do a post.

Welcome Angel and Noela. Noela, I especially like that last line you posted. Use the stars as a starting point. Yep, I like that.

Here's a funny I got in the mail and thought you all might enjoy.

<< Ever wonder what our kids are doing in high school? These are actual
analogies and metaphors that were found in high school essays.

1. Her face was a perfect oval, like a circle that had its two sides gently
compressed by a Thigh Master.

2. His thoughts tumbled in his head, making and breaking alliances like
underpants in a dryer without Cling Free.

3. He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy
who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those
boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at
high
schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of
those
boxes with a pinhole in it.

4. She grew on him like she was a colony of E. coli and he was
room-temperature Canadian beef.

5. She had a deep, throaty, genuine laugh, like that sound a dog makes just
before it throws up.

6. Her vocabulary was as bad as, like, whatever.

7. He was as tall as a six-foot-three-inch tree.

8. The revelation that his marriage of 30 years had disintegrated because
of his wife's infidelity came as a rude shock, like a
9. surcharge at a formerly surcharge-free ATM.

10. The little boat gently drifted across the pond exactly the way a
bowling
ball wouldn't.

11. McBride fell 12 stories, hitting the pavement like a Hefty bag filled
with vegetable soup.

12. From the attic came an unearthly howl. The whole scene had an eerie,
surreal quality, like when you're on vacation in another city and Jeopardy
comes on at 7:00 p.m. instead of 7:30.

13. Her hair glistened in the rain like a nose hair after a sneeze.

14. The hailstones leaped from the pavement, just like maggots when you fry
them in hot grease.

15. Long separated by cruel fate, the star-crossed lovers raced across the
grassy field toward each other like two freight trains, one having left
Cleveland at 6:36 p.m. traveling at 55 mph, the other from Topeka at 4:19
p.m. at a speed of 35 mph.

16. They lived in a typical suburban neighborhood with picket fences that
resembled Nancy Kerrigan's teeth.

17. John and Melinda had never met. They were like two hummingbirds who had
also never met.

18. He fell for her like his heart was a mob informant and she was the East
River.

19. Even in his last years, Grandpappy had a mind like a steel trap, only
one that had been left out so long, it had rusted shut.

20. Shots rang out, as shots are wont to do.

21. The plan was simple, like my brother-in-law Phil. But unlike Phil, this
plan just might work.

22. The young fighter had a hungry look, the kind you get from not eating
for a while.

23. "Oh, Jason, take me!", she panted, her breasts heaving like a college
freshman on $1-a-beer night.

24. He was as lame as a duck. Not the metaphorical lame duck, either, but a
real duck that was actually lame. Maybe from stepping on a land mine or
something.

25. The ballerina rose gracefully en pointe and extended one slender leg
behind her, like a dog at a fire hydrant.

26. It was an American tradition, like fathers chasing kids around with
power tools.

27. He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a garbage truck backing up.

28. She was as easy as the TV Guide crossword.

29. Her eyes were like limpid pools, only they had forgotten to put in any
pH cleanser.

30. She walked into my office like a centipede with 98 missing legs.

31. It hurt the way your tongue hurts after you accidentally staple it to
the wall.
>>

Now to see how that posted. Its the first time I copy and pasted from email.

Work is still progressing on my novel.

Later ....

Carol 1-30-2003 12:40

Hello?

howard 1-30-2003 11:25

Hi Angel#911,

Welcome to the N.B.

Rachel

Rachel 1-29-2003 16:01

As a child I was told to make the sky my limit, but now that i am grown i changed my mind and choose it as a starting point

Noela Ebubeze none 1-29-2003 13:57

Just dropping a note to say "Hi". I have been visiting the website a while, but this is my first post in here.

I might have more to add later :-)

Angel #911 1-29-2003 13:34

Of all my wish like a fis fighting freedom filled with wisdom. I know I miss the things I wish. To drop the cross and face the loss.

Noela Ebubeze none 1-29-2003 13:24

Americo,
Good to see you posting. STAY!
Everybody else,
Hi.
I haven't got the strength or the inclination to join in just yet but it's important for me to keep in touch. The NB is so much more than just a forum.
Later,
Ed

Eddie French 1-29-2003 13:21

i live evryday i stop to think that i should leave. even as i stop i live but noit the way that i think. i have the power a choice aright but everyday, i say that i should live the way that i live in a whorld only i know and belong, to take you there and leave you here. yet,i live

Noela Ebubeze none 1-29-2003 13:20

Rhoda,
I liked Mark's post. It's refreshing to hear the voice of democracy in the NB from time to time. America is not only Bush and Clinton but also Martin Luther King and Jimmy Carter. That's why anti-Americanism is a reductionist, irrational attitude as bad as any systematic anti-Something. Everything has its good and bad sides, its good and bad moments. It's up to the analysts (and writers like us should try to be informed and analyse things as best as we can) to state their opinions about what is going on in the world. The NB may distill a little drop of influence on world affairs, Rhoda. At least it reflects an international public opinion, without great analysts but with good -willing people, like you and me.

Pamela,
As Jerry, a bloody Republican but a good man, has said, Jon, a miserable cat, motivated people here to write and conclude a novel which you can buy through Amazon.com or ask Jack, Allein or Rachel to lend you a copy. It's called "Shadows in a Dream" and is simply the best work written in collaboration the world has ever seen. There is a new NB book in the offing: Heather's "Phantasium". It's a ghost stories collection edited by Heather and Mark, two of the good collaborators of this page. It may be worth reading. Let us hope it is published.

Randall,
A hug to you. I think that you deserve the prize for the best short-story teller of 2002. But Jon, the prize giver, has been thinking if the good people that contributed to "Phantasium", against his imperial anti-ghosts campaign, are not worthy of his feline condescendence. That cat is a funny sort of dictator. In the end, he always votes for the best, the most justice, or the best-best. Jerry, a short-story writer of genius (though with ups and downs), is also a good bet. We'd better wait and see if there is not war. In case of war, NO PRIZES! (Hope Barbara is reading this and gives a good motherly call to her naughty son).

Americo 1-29-2003 12:19

Listened to the President last night. I was amazed at the quality and presentation of his speech. Although I hate war, and I hope we get through this without plane loads of coffins returning home, in stead of plane loads of triumphant soldiers. Any time we go to war we must expect casualties, but I hope it goes as well as the first gulf war.

I thought President Bush showed a tremendous amount of leadership in that speech. But I did notice that there was no mention of the Ag industry. All around me I see farmers and ranchers (many now without son's and daughter's that now prepare for war) who are on the edge of loosing everything because of the past few dry years. Many (my brother-in-law included) have taken jobs in town, leaving the farm/ranch work to their wives and children, just to have enough money to feed the family.

Can the terrible years of the mid 80's be far away? Those years that turned our peaceful little State to one of constant auctions of failed farms, of families loosing everything and not knowing where to turn. To the growth of the Posse Cometataus and like armed organizations protesting the actions of our government.

I hope not but the way the Ag world is going it surely could happen again.

I realize that the President has more to think about then the family farm, yet it's those hard working men, women and children who feed America and much of the world and without relief very soon the family farm will be a thing taught only in school and the large corporate farms will be buying up all the land, the price of food will rise and many of the poor will be hungrier then ever.

Jerry 1-29-2003 11:34

Here's my latest poem. I sent this one with who cut the tags off to Library of Congress. So if you like it, pass it around.

Dirt
Sending us a message they take lives including their own, then become a martyr
Wouldn’t just holding a sign up be much more effective, faster and smarter

They killed my mother so I killed their son
Then they killed my sister so I had to take from them another one

A month a go a bomb went off and made a building fall
Everyone in it was lost they got them all

After the smoke cleared there was nothing but a shell
To have died that way, must have been living hell

So must be our turn to cause them some grief
They say they hate us because of our belief

To satisfy our spirits with faith will be forever our fate
Our hearts rise up for our beliefs but for them only deflate

They call us infidels because we don’t look to the same one
They want to make us believe looking down the barrel of a gun

Infidel just means one who doesn’t share your same view
So of course we can say the same thing right back at you

That would mean every one of us is an infidel to some degree
To have faith for our chosen one is our right in which we should all be free

They refuse to be our neighbors yet they are not asking us to move
Instead they want us dead another option we must behoove

The longer our allegiance continues so does their resolve
This ongoing problem between us I fear we’ll never solve

Go travel the world to chronicle our differences you’ll find only similarities
You’ll meet people like you who love their heritage, their life and their families.

I’ve often found with life’s toughest problems they often have a simple solution
With the oldest one called hate I have come to the same conclusion

Through the years how many people will have to die during someone’s last stand
before we realize the problem can be solved just by sharing the land

© Debra J. Palardy 2002

Debra 1-29-2003 11:26

Pamela, your entire post made me smile. :o)

Inhaler, steam, Vic's vaporub and my very own masseuse, and I am feeling on the rosy side of ....recovery.
Nastiest whatever-you-curse-it illness I've had in a while. With headcolds at least I could whine a little.

Beware the over-editor! Oh....all right. I'll giddyap.

Heather 1-29-2003 3:34

Pamela - Don't think you've ever been introduced to Americo - He and his two cats, Jon and Pussy are long time residents in the notebook he hails from Portugal, and is a great writer of novels there. He once had a round robin going here that produced a ton of creativity. Sadly we lost the workbook when the Notebook was moved to a different server, many miss it and look forward to the day when our gracious host is again able to get it up and running.

The round robins were great fun and actually produced a published novel, one that I dropped out of, something that I greatly regret.

Americo and his alter ego Jon the cat once ruled the notebook, handing out awards for best post, best short story best whatever, but of late he's been busy with other endeavors elsewhere.

Jerry 1-29-2003 0:18

Randall

Must go watch President Bush on TV, but, how about a quote.

"Attitude is more important than the past, than education, than money, than circumstances, than what people do or say. It is more important than appearance, giftedness, or skill."

W. C. Fields

Randall

Randall 1-28-2003 20:57

From I-Don't-Know-What-The-Temp-Is-I'm-Just-Cold Pamela:

Some of you guys are so politically aware, I get most of my news from Jon Stewart on the Daily Show. Ignorance is bliss. And sometimes ignoring is blissful. (I mean politics itself, not your lively and entertaining discussions.)

MEL, I empathize again with you on editing beginnings, after all, they are extremely important, bearing the responsibility for catching the readers' initial interest. I think I'm finally about done with my prologue (editing it, that is, I've gone on to write about 15 chapters lately, I think), maybe I'll post it and see what you guys think. RANDALL, sounds like you've been feeling a little frisky for such an old fart! I can say that because I'm just one year younger than you, but luckily we gals don't have to worry about Viagra ("I Enjoy Being A Girl" -- pretend I sang that). Regarding the too-big hat, I'm surprised that, as a Texan, you didn't arrive at the obvious solution immediately: make your hair bigger! We southerners are known for the biggest hair ever, perhaps in response to the very hat problem you have. Come on, pouff it up! JERRY, I really liked the "Bad Day" news, funny but also ironic, the terrorist opening his own bomb was something to think about. I'm glad you are getting back into your writing lately, this group sure is stimulating. I'd still check out acupuncture for your back, a friend of mine had a mangled lip from an accident which the surgeons couldn't do much with, whe was going to look about like an unfortunate harelip, then she went to an acupuncturist (??) and her lip healed up, you can barely see a scar. I'm sure WC won't cover it but maybe you could purchase a session with your next creative writing paycheck. AMERICO, where have you been besides France during the revolution? American Indian? Atlantean? You sound like one who can appreciate the truth in HOWARD's statement that this life is not a permanent assignment. LITTER, funny book-pushing scenario. I read recently that some schools are eliminating libraries now as being too space-consuming, ain't that a shame? Will the computer make books obsolete, I wonder? I hope not, the screen gets on my nerves and I like to hold printed paper in my hands. LAURA, I'm also juggling job-hunting with writing, not an easy thing to do. It hasn't been that long since you sent your story off, it may still be lying in a big pile of mail. Just waiting to be read, discovered, exulted over... Meanwhile, for your jitters, do you drink? If not, this would be a good time to start (ha ha). HOWARD, glad to hear your pasta turned out as well as your finger.

Pamela 1-28-2003 15:17

Howard,

You are a sweetheart. I send you hugs.

Rachel

Rachel 1-28-2003 12:53

With all this crap going on I'm just glad this life isn't a permanent assignment...

howard 1-28-2003 8:24

Wow, the mercury climbed 55 degrees in the last 24 hours, from below zero to 48 degrees today. It was like a touch of spring but it was just the chinook winds that visit us from time to time, the weatherman said it will be below freezing by midnight and probably below zero by tommorow night.

Look around at all that's happening and ask yourself who's to blame?

Is it Clinton? Bush? Reagan? Mark? Me?

Well Kris Kerstofferson knew who to blame:

Mister Marvin Middle Class is really in a stew
Wond'rin' what the younger generation's coming to
And the taste of his martini doesn't please his bitter tongue
Blame it on the Rolling Stones.
Blame it on the Stones; blame it on the Stones
You'll feel so much better, knowing you don't stand alone
Join the accusation; save the bleeding nation
Get it off your shoulders; blame it on the Stones

Mother tells the ladies at the bridge club every day
Of the rising price of tranquilizers she must pay
And she wonders why the children never seem to stay at home
Blame it on the Rolling Stones.

Blame it on the Stones; Blame it on the Stones
You'll feel so much better, knowing you don't stand alone
Join the accusation; save the bleeding nation
Get it off your shoulders; blame it on the Stones

Father's at the office, nightly working all the time
Trying to make the secretary change her little mind
And it bothers him to read about so many broken homes
Blame it on those Rolling Stones.

Blame it on the Stones; Blame it on the Stones
You'll feel so much better knowing you don't stand alone
Join the accusation; same the bleeding nation
Get it off your shoulders; blame it on the Stones

Blame it on the stones, blame it on the stones.

Jerry 1-27-2003 23:55

FYI Clinton lovers...

"Attempts were made by Communist China to funnel money to the Clinton campaign and influence elections in 1996. Charlie Trie, one of Bills trusted DNC fundraisers, attempted to funnel this money. When faced with indictment he fled to China for refuge. Another money funneler for the communists and Clinton campaign, Johnny Chung, is now in jail. The funds came from divisions of the Chinese army, one of which had been caught only months earlier while attempting to smuggle AK-47's to LA street gangs. (NORINCO) This is the government of RED CHINA - definitely a serious matter. If any scandals do catch up with him, which probably will happen, this is by far the worst. Amidst the sex scandals another DNC fundraiser scandal, Johnny Chung, openly admitted to knowingly taking funds from the Chinese government. Chung also testified that the DNC knew the source of this money was communist China. They accepted it anyway. The money is said to have been funneled through Chinese government official Liu Chao-ying then Chung and then to the DNC. Even more revealing was that Liu Chao-ying, daughter of Liu Hauqing (recent head of the Chinese military and top official of the Chinese communist party) and a Peoples Liberation Army and Chinese space agency official, attended a DNC fundraiser. Here she was photographed with Clinton. Chung also visited the White House over 45 times. Chung took several thousand dollars from commies and contributed them to a partisan candidate for President of the United States and leader of the free world. Chung was only a powerful campaign contributer/supporter with ties to the DNC and White House. Johnny Chung testified under oath to Congress on his admitted relations with the Chinese Commies and the ties to the President. Ironically Chung is one of a very small number of people who had greater White House access than Monica Lewinsky! Chung is said to have made over 50 visits compared to Monica's 39! Even better, only a week later Charlie Trie entered a guilty plea for his fundraising crimes and agreed to talk with investigators! Who next? Well it happened to be John Huang! Huang, another Clinton cronie, pled guilty to funneling Chinese funds less than a week after Trie!

http://members.tripod.com/~GOPcapitalist/clintonpage.html#sc

1-27-2003 22:46

Randall

Bill Clinton is a traitor...so what else is new?

CHINA ARMY ROUTED MONEY TO FUND CLINTON'S CAMPAIGN: NYT

T V Parasuram

Sunday May 17, 1998

WASHINGTON, May 16: The Republican Party in the United States has announced today it will hold hearings on the disclosure of a Chinese businessman that a large part of the donation he gave to the Democratic Party in 1996 when US President Bill Clinton was campaigning for presidency once again came from the Chinese army.

The money was routed to Johnny Chung, a southern California businessman and a Democratic fund raiser, through a Chinese woman lieutenant colonel Liu Chao-Ying, an aerospace executive, The New York Times reported quoting officials and lawyers.

Chung said Liu told him the source of the money was the Chinese People's Liberation Army. At one fund-raiser to which Chung gained admission for her, she was photographed along with US President Clinton.

A special adviser to the White House counsel, Jim Kennedy, said "we had no knowledge about the source of Chung's money or the background of his guest. In hindsight, it was clearly not appropriate for Chung to bring her to see the President. "Chung's disclosure comes at a very embarrassing time when Clinton is making preparations to go to China in June to establish a "strategic relationship" with the country and lift most or all of the Tiananmen Square sanctions and pave the way for high tech exports to China.

Under the American law, foreign governments are prohibited from contributing to political campaigns. The hunt for the Chinese connection by federal investigators began after US intelligence intercepted telephone conversations suggesting that Beijing considered covertly funding the campaign of President Clinton, who they felt would be more friendly to China than his opponent, Republican Bob Dole.

At the time the People's Liberation Army gave money to the Clinton campaign, President Clinton was making it easier for American civilian communication satellites to be launched by Chinese rockets, a key issue for the Chinese army and for Liu's company, which sells missiles to the military, The New York Times said. Meanwhile, the US senate has passed an amendment barring entry of goods made from forced child labour into the country.

The senate passed an amendment to the defence authorisation bill yesterday making permanent the current temporary provision authorising customs to ban any goods made with forced child labour from entering the country.

Copyright © 1998 Indian Express Newspapers (Bombay) Ltd.

All things considered, I would accept that Ken Lay gave money to both political parties seeking favors. But for a politican, the very President of the United States to accept money from the army that "assisted" North Korea in killing American and soldiers from many nations during the Korean war is appalling to this old boy.

The paragraph regarding transfer of missile technology to the Red Army stands as a monument to Bill Clintons treason.

Randall

Randall 1-27-2003 20:49

Mark - What ever.

Had a dream last night, probably the result of new meds, but I was standing on a hill (I dream in technicolor now) overlooking a desert, hundreds of tanks were assulting what appeared to be a city in the midst of the desert when a massive explosion took place in the middle of the tanks. Then there was nothing, just sand. No tanks, no people, nothing.

I hope it was the pills.

Jerry 1-27-2003 20:37

The Yaqui Kid

"I'm going to speak my mind because I have nothing to lose."

S. I. Hayakawa

1-27-2003 20:10

MARK,

The Ken Lay went no where because the Democrats took more from him and did more for him than the Republicans. Bill Clinton gave Mr. Lay all those concessions over in India. When the Democrats realized the things coming out about their own involvement and how bad it made them look, they backed off. By the way, Bill Clinton obstucted justice and lied to a grand jury. I realize that is only a small thing in the scheme of things.

Your vile is so strong. What is worse all your arguments are lifted right out of the media lexicon and are full of stereotypes, but then most people think and operate out of preconceived ideas. You don't hate George W. Bush nearly as much as you hate what you believe he stands for and no one will ever change your mind. So I won't even try.

AMERICO,

I have heard nothing new and insightful from you on the international side of things. Think what you like. Believe what you like. No argument I set forth will ever change you or what you think. As wrong as you are, I adore you anyway.

The United States is going to war or not going to war, and whichever it will be, it will not be on the basis of the silly war protests or on what is said here.

Rhoda 1-27-2003 20:05

RANDALL

Hi!

Well ... I have to laugh gang. It feels so good to laugh. Jerry, Mark, Americo and I are having heated, well, at least warm conversations over politics. In the meantime Debra, Laura and The Yaqui Kid are on another level. And then Evenlyn Haines weighs in with a difficult post to read regarding Rex Rabbits?

HA! Ha! HA!

What a great site, huh?

Randall

Randall 1-27-2003 20:02

Hi my name is miss Evelyn Haines I breeder Dwarf & Rex's Rabbits I get 7 body's rabbits to sell on 8/2/2003 $15 each please E-Mail evelyn1973@xtra.co.nz and I'm looking for Rex's male if every one can help me please & all so looking for shows Rabbits and Giunea pigs Please help me. Yes I love Rabbits & all so Giunea pigs is will as one cat so this why I love my pets very much I take to them every day and I had them in my hands for 1/2 hour.

Thank you
Evelyn Haines

Evelyn Haines Rabbits 1-27-2003 19:53

Hi my name is Evelyn Haines I breeder Dwarf & rex's Rabbits I say get 7 body rabbits to sell on8/2/2003 $15 each so if every one out there please E-Mail me at evelyn1973@xtra.co.nz and I'm looking for rex's male if every one can help me please.

Thank you
Evelyn Haines

Evelyn Haines Rabbits 1-27-2003 19:41

Laura

It's 9 outside at my house and 60 inside.

Debra 1-27-2003 16:35

It's probably worse with a short story because you are being more specific with subject matter. I'm still checking the mail two and three times a day, hoping for anything, even a rejection at this point would be a releif since at least it means the thing got there and was read, It is just nerve wracking.

I've been juggling trying to get a job and trying to write for the past two weeks and I'm in a holding pattern on both. ARRRRRRRGH, and the annoying thing is its 85 outside and 60 in my house.

Laura 1-27-2003 15:03

JERRY -- Imperialism takes many forms. Ultimately, it means to exert such pressure on a place that some social change takes hold.

We pat ourselves on the back for bringing democracy to countries (or regions) that only knew dictatorship. But let's face it, we do that selectively. Covert ops by the CIA helped bring democracy to Chile. The Chilean people elected a man we didn't back. Wow! Democracy is a mistake in that country! So when Pinochet decided to take over, we gave a little help and moved a dictator back in.

Hong Kong, Beijing, Tokyo and Moscow are not known for ground beef patties. They all have McDonalds now. The intrusion of fast-food restaurants into Asian and European cities is but one sign of how American business interests have gotten a foothold in other cultures. Along with the business ethic comes the social ethic. We think it odd that Cuban businessmen in Miami can sit over demi-tasse of expresso for two hours but think nothing of moving the ten-minute meal offshore.

About 15 years ago I needed a fresh example to use in English Composition classes. I picked up on some ideas from a water-use study done by LandSat satellites. Turns out there are underground rivers (not streams, rivers) beneath portions of the Sahara. Some of the water is close enough to the surface to be visible to satellites. Holy Cow! We can irrigate enough parts of the Sahara desert to grow food for the whole region! This was at a time when every night on TV we saw images of starving kids and reports of civil war. War, of course, for control of resources. Starvation because of a drought. We could end that.

I found that humanitarian and charitable groups had already made effort to extract the water from one region and met local resistance. The reason: I won't dig further than six feet because my father did not dig further than six feet and his father did not dig further than six feet and no-one back to Mohammed has dug further than six feet in the desert for water. To dig those wells in those places was considered an affront to the religious continuity of the community.

We have our own stereotypical guy who says, "I voted Democratic and my daddy voted Democratic and his daddy voted Democratic a'fore him." Sometimes you can reason with him, sometimes you can't. So it was in the desert. Some wouldn't change because the tradition was so strong as to have religious overtones, and some wouldn't change because they reasoned that drought and war were the forces of nature working on them and "we live with nature."

Whoever brings the ways of change is an Imperialist. Osama's war on change didn't start with us. He actually began revolting against his own people, against those who had lost the old way, the old values, the old rituals. After a while, he began looking for the causes of why people dropped away from the original path. The American influence is everywhere.

-- As an aside, I'll go further out and say that I *don't* trust George W. His tax breaks for the rich and his industry-over-environment policies have had an easy slide since 9-1-1. You were all excited about Bill Clinton getting blowjobs from Monica, why is there no fervor over the favors GWB got from Ken Lay? And Ken Lay is only the most famous of the Bush vasoline artists. Were it not for the convenient War on Terror, we'd see a lot more discussion on presidential economic folly.

Mark 1-27-2003 14:37

Mark:

Good one. It's not an imitation. It's different. I do like Weird Al. I'll consider him stop number two. Thanks.

It's copyrighted. I can post it if you want to see it.

Debra 1-27-2003 13:30

DEBRA -- Shouldn't an imitation song go to Weird Al?

Mark 1-27-2003 13:26

I just sent out my letter to the Baha Men with the song who Cut The Tags Off enclosed.

Wish me luck!

Debra 1-27-2003 12:46

Americo - I sit here wondering why those in Europe call America an Imperialist nation?

TO answer that question I did a bit of research (a very little bit but a bit none-the-less) and found something that amazed me.

It seems the word Imperialism or rather the meaning of the word has changed.

When I went to school, imperialism meant invading a nation and sitting it up as a part of, or a slave of the invading nation.

Today from what I have read at several web pages (one is linked below) the world seems to define the word imperialism to mean, an industrialized nation (the U.S. for example) not invading, or overthrowing the rightful ruler, but allowing it's industries to expand into that country, giving jobs to it's workers and producing goods for sale to both it's people and for export.

Now to me this appears to be improving the lives of those people, and not taking over the nation.

It appears that such action is not by the so called imperialist nation, for no national action takes place, but the expansion of our industries into other markets.

I guess if one were a communist this could be considered a bad thing, since the ruler of the nation isn't controlling it's people, but to one who is, as are most American's a lover of freedom, this seems to be aiding the people of that nation.

As has been said, give a man a fish and he is no longer hungry for a day, teach a man to fish and he is no longer for ever.

Just look at some of the poor nations that have been "imperialized" by the U.S. There's South Korea who now produce not only their own vehicles, firearms, electronic devices, televisions, radios, computers and so forth, but export them at a great profit to other nations.

There is Taiwan, once an island nation made up of freedom loving Chinese who retreated the communist take over of their great nation, now a major producer of electronic gear for the world.

There is Japan, itself a major imperialist power in the first half of the twentieth century, now a major producer of electronic devices, vehicles and so forth to the world.

Now there's your great nation, that was once an imperialist nation with colonies in Africa and Asia, what of those nations that your country invaded, the people who they enslaved, what do they produce now? Babies?

Europe was the center of Imperialism with nearly every "civilized" nation in Western Europe ruling many colonies, look at France, who was once a major colonial power, what of their former colonies? Well part of the United States was once a colony of France, as was a part of our wonderful neighbor Canada.

Then there was Spain who once owned a large slash of North America, including much of the west and central U.S. as well as Mexico, and the central American nations.

Germany also had it's colonies, although not so many as the rest, and of course there was England where "the Sun Never Sets over the British Empire" one of the earliest colonizers who did, of course, first rule our east coast before the great Revolutionary War here in the 1770's.

Does any of this make any sense or am I just taking up a large blot on Jack's wonderful web site?

Jerry Imperialism101 1-27-2003 10:53

Litter:

You know regarding your story about the books and all, if the terrorists win that will be a true story. Scary huh?

Debra 1-27-2003 9:25

Americo - I gotta be honest here - I had my doubt about GW, but since 911 they stand behind, no make that beside him.

I do fear what is to happen next, and the suffering here has already begun with so many men gone, so many women worried, there were plenty of tears yesterday as they left us. What worries me is this small fact. The President has activated nearly all the Guard and Reserve. What happens if we need them????

The purpose of the National Guard used to be to protect the home front but their gone now. For a year for sure, maybe longer.

What of their jobs, their families. What of those who joined to go to college, they had to give up that college now and ship over to stop a mad man who many in the world would rather shelter then confront.

I think those who say Iraq is just a little country who couldn't harm a flea are those who feel that if the particapate in our little stop proceedure will face the rath of Sadam, they fear a 911 in their country.

It's time for those in Europe to get a pair of balls, get up off their asses put out that camel and join the crusade for the freedom of the people of Iraq who suffer under the tyranical fist of a mad man who makes Hitler looke like a paper hanger.

Oh I forgot those in Europe today don't think Hitler was all bad either do they? I mean look at the arostical French sitting back on their buitiful country that was paid for by the lives of thousands of American and British soldiers, now telling us that we are wrong, stop picking on those little nations who have nothing but oil and would be some of the richest desert dwellers in the world if not for that little pimple on the ass of the Middle East sitting in Bagdad, sleeping every night in a different bed, not only hiding from the US but from those who would kill him to free their nation from the bondage of his will.

Looks like I'm getting a bit carried away so I'll shut up now before I piss anyone off.

Jerry 1-27-2003 0:02

The Yaqui Kid

"It is a pleasure to stand upon the shore, and to see ships tost upon the sea: a pleasure to stand in the window of a castle, and to see a battle and the adventures thereof below: but no pleasure is comparable to standing upon the vantage ground of truth... and to see the errors, and wanderings, and mists, and tempests, in the vale below."

Francis Bacon

1-26-2003 23:11

RANDALL

Litter...

Very good! I loved it ... perhaps a writer insight into the publishing world?

Randall

1-26-2003 19:32

Randall

Hey!

Once again ... Americo has raised the bar on this site. Humor to slip a point home. :-) I am the least qualified person to write the definitive novel of the French Revolution. Although, I WAS there. A bearded guy wearing a ten-gallon hat dung splattered boots, my most quotable remark that night? "Say there buckaroo them tharas pratty good cakes! I'm not from these parts. What's a Bastille?"

I read my post of last week and found glaring omissions. Yes, America received help from a remarkable French gentleman, Lafayette, during her revolution. And when America sent troops to Europe in 1917 (?) to battle the Huns, they stepped from the troopship saying "Lafayette, we are here." I also failed to mention Australia, many south Pacific and European nations in war against tyranny. Most regretful Teekay. Is England considered European? A question...

Americo, there is so much going on behind the scenes in this Iraqi confrontation. My stance is this. I trust President George Bush to do the right thing. He is a good man, our leader, coincidentally a fellow Texan. Besides that, his mother Barbara wouldn't let him!!! I believe George W has intelligence on Iraq that we don't. There are reasons for the coming war that will soon be known. America is not an imperialistic country. We have never invaded a country for conquest, nor sought to impose our way of living on conquered people. My God, the countries we fought in WW II, we rebuilt! The taxpayers of America! No country had or has ever done that!!! Though some Americans politicians have tried to IMPOSE their beliefs through underhanded actions ... we liberate oppressed lands not conquer.

It's funny that you mention chewing gum as an American import. Chewing gum ... was introduced to the "civilized world" by an old enemy of Texas. The conqueror of the Alamo, General Lopez de Santa Anna. Believe it or not.

Times change Americo. Preventive war as a defense may be the only way to prevent additional war. However offensive it seems, killing for peace is becoming more and more an option. Why? I don't know what is happening to the human race. Why do dictators feel the need to starve their own people and mass huge armies? North Korea. Why does Saddam need weapons of mass destruction when treaties and commerce with neighboring countries would work just as well? Is there some kind of a self-destruction epidemic developing in the world? Yes, I'm inclined to think so. I see self-destructive people ALL the time in my hometown of only 19,000 people. That one or two or a dozen dictators rise to power and create such havoc in the world. Human nature...basic.

And yes, America has many times over weapons like these. But we do not threaten our neighbors or use poison gas on our own people. America reacts, does not initiate war, we never have. Vietnam? We had a treaty with South Vietnam. Korea ... was a United Nations war, not initiated by America. Panama, reacting to a drug king pin. Cuba ... a communistic influence 90 miles from home. Who we have left alone for 30 years!

Oh, and Americo ... if you intend to clean up Texas, you had better bring a sack lunch, a BIG shovel and plan on staying awhile. :-) And Viagra? (BIG GRIN!) Hey, it works, though I really don't need to use the product either ... there are certain aspects that, ah, oh boy, well should not be defined here. Costs ... well we have a prescription card so it's not cost prohibitive...And yes I would recommend it to my friends... only as a backup, of course. (Grin)

Goodbye my friend

Randall

A joke ... Jay Leno said his wife bought him Viagra. He accidentally dropped a tablet in the toilet bowl and couldn't get the lid to stay down.

Randall 1-26-2003 19:28

Heard an unusual slip of the tongue during an interview on UK tv, a few nights back. The interviewer was an English comedian called Frank Skinner but I can't recall who the Interviewee was. They were talking about a book the woman had written, and Frank asked: "Have you already found a pusher for the book?" (Instead of publisher)

Picture the scene: It's nighttime in a shady part of town. Small huddles of shady looking characters wearing fur trimmed coats, and talking idly about literary minutia, can be found on street corners. A slow procession of cars drive around the streets and back around again. One of the characters steps towards a car that has come to a halt, just a few feet away from him.

Car man – "I'm looking for some stuff and I was told I could get it down here."

Shady man – "Wha choo wan' man, a little light reading, huh? Something soft and easy, huh? Noooo, I know wha choo you wan' – a nice sci-fi story to blow your mind. That's wha choo wan'!"

Car man – "Have you anything stronger?"

Shady man – "Shit, homes, you sure you can handle anythin' stronger?" He continues without waiting for an answer, "Okay, man, sure thing. I got some murder-mystery, but its powerful strong shit, man, you sure you can handle it?"

Car man – "No, no, I mean the really strong stuff…"

Shady man – "Wha choo talking 'bout man?"

Car man – "You know, the good stuff," looks around him and moves closer to 'Shady', "Horror, man, h o r r o r."

Shady man – turns to his fellows a few feet away and gesticulates. "Hey, homies, we got a real party animal here… Ay Chihuahua!" Looks back at Car man, "You mean Stephen King, huh homes? You sure you can handle it, man? I don't sell this shit to just anyone, you know what I'm saying?"

Car man – Looking crestfallen and embarrassed, "Yes, yes I'm sure I can handle it."

Shady man – "Choo got to bee more than sure, man. I can' have anybody O-D-ing on me man, bad for business.

Car man – Look, I'm sure I can. We going to do business or what?"

Shady man – "Hey, hey, man, slow down. We'll do business. Just needed to know tha choo appreeeeciate wha choo gettin' into…"

Car man – "Look I can handle anything you got."

Shady man – Pulling closer to Car man. "Hey homes, I'm goin' to do you a real favour, but if anyone asks you didn' get this shit from me. Okay?"

Car man -- "Okay, I understand!"

Shady man – "Coooool, man. Wha' I got for choo tonight is somethin' you won' find anywhere else on the streets, only in libraries man, only in libraries... But it's gonna cos choo – I got a genuiiiine Russian Classic, homes, a real Tolstoy – War and Peace, homes, in hardback. Strongest shit I ever had. Bu choo don' tell any bro where it came from, okay man?" Pulls package wrapped in brown paper from inside his coat. "50 bucks, homes, no returns…"

The deal is done and Car man speeds away. Shady swaggers back to his friends – "I say, chaps, just shifted a Tolstoy…"

Hi 5's all round.

This little whimsy is 'obviously' set in Wales.

Litter 1-26-2003 19:03

Randall,

Yours is a nice Texan hat... How's our novel about the French Revolution going? Remember that I was then the 15-year old boy selling cakes at the Bastille. You were the ferocious revolutionaire...

On your two posts about the reasons for a war in Iraq: you said that the English helped Europe in the second world war?! But England is one of the most beautiful European countries... And one of the most civilized too. And you forgot to mention the Brazilians among our saviours. In my opinion, it were the Brazilians, with their Samba and their joy of living, that saved us. The Americans were also quite helpful. They brought here the chewing gum and the blue jeans. What would have become of old Europe without chiclets Adams? And we are also grateful for Gershwin, Hemingway, Marilyn Monroe and the Macintosh computer (let alone Sasquatch and the Notebook...) .

Sorry we don't like W. Bush, but that does not mean we are anti-American. On the contrary: in my opinion, Bush is doing a lot of harm to America. But, being an optimist, I believe that he will eventually understand that war is not the best way to solve the problem of terrorism. On that day, the Europeans will be the first to kiss America on her pretty mouth.

A second point is that you mentioned horrible things that ocurred BEFORE the Gulf War. For those crimes 100,000 Iraqi soldiers (and I don't know how many Iraqi women and children) were already killed and with the help of the bloody Europeans. We don't need any more victims, do we? The notion of preventive war is one of those Bushy things that the civilized International community cannot accept.

Please go on doing research on more horrible things done by the Iraqis AFTER the Gulf War. If you find evidence of weapons of mass destruction or any other things harmful to one's health, please report, and we promise to help America clean up the world of those nasty things. I already have a good list of countries to clean up: they are some twenty countries and... oh, our sweet France, the country that helped sweet America to become independent from the bad English boys, is among them, and, wait, your Texas too. Good Lord, we'd better start conversations about universal disarmament immediatelly!

Those were the points on which I cannot agree entirely with you. But I am entirely in agreement with you on one point: yes, the Europeans are rather incompetent! And you should pay a visit to Portugal (my country). That's the most incompetent country I have ever seen. Even sardines, our most traditional product, and the only reason of pride in our rotten History, cannot speak English properly!

A last issue, Randall. Hmm... it's about that Viagra thing. Are you sure it works? Can you recomend it to an old European? Not that I need it, oh, no, but, for a bad night (and in a preemptive way...). Is it too expensive?

Ok, boys and girls, if you behave yourselves, I may convince Jon to give the traditional prizes for the best notebookers of the year 2002. But for that most wonderful occasion to happen, we need peace on the planet.

Americo 1-26-2003 15:38

RANDALL

Howdy Buckaroos! You too Jackaroo!!!!

A great day to be alive and on the planet!!!

Rosemary, my wife threw a half-empty bottle of pills at me and ordered me out of the bedroom. (Ever done that to your spouse?)

"Act your age!" Debbie laughed, settling in for an extended Sunday morning nap.

Holding up the bottle of Viagra I asked, "Which one?"

"Try being fifty-five for a while. Leave the fifteen-year old behind."

(Sigh) Americo ... it is hard being Randall. (I know I couldn't be Jon or Pussy.) Even harder to be fifty-five with a fifteen-year old mentality. Mel, I guess it was the hat that got me in trouble this morning. No ... not the Viagra, Howard. I have a couple of felt cowboy hats. One is a Resistol 5X Beaver, a Jim Dandy of a hat, Viv. The problem is, the hat, purchased used from a guy needing money is way too large. About the size Hoss Cartwright would wear Tina ... suffering a terrific hangover ... with a dozen bee stings ‘round about his ample head. Heather, I stuffed newspaper behind the sweat band, a trick my granddad taught me. After installing most of the Dallas Morning News, Sunday edition, it still settles on my ears making me look like Papa Smurf goes west. Interesting mental image, huh, Rhoda?

Annnnnnd, Jerry, it absolutely drives our Chihuahua dog, Scooter, into a barking frenzy. Heather, I arose early, cleaned up the kitchen after a night of eating and snacking debauchery. My Saturday nights have evolved into this Mark, a far cry from drinking Lone Star beer, "Hey, another round here!" Dancing the Cotton Eye Joe, "Yee Haaaaa!" and dodging cowboy fights I so used to enjoy. "You son of a bitch, I catch you looking at my wife and touching my hat again...!"

"You call that a hat?"

"NOBODY TALKS ABOUT MY HAT!!!" POW!

Anyway, Carol, I made a pot of coffee this morning, put in a washing machine load of my clothes, and eyed the 5X Resistol hanging on the wall. Nope, still too large Pamela, but I decided to wear it around the house for a while. Casually and with no malicious intent, (You all know me!) I slowly strolled by the open bedroom door. Scooter, never missing an opportunity to indulge in a barking marathon leaped (leaped I say!) to his Mexican feet and sounded off. And as he happened to be curled up next to my wife, the effect was twofold. Rachel, I'll have you know that Scooter barks with a machine gun like staccato. My wife jumped straight up, looked wild-eyed around the bedroom, spotted me leering through the doorway. "Will you behave?"

"Okay! Okay!"

Laura, I was worried that something might be wrong in there I slowwwly peeked around the corner. Scooter was now on high alert Mary, and spotted the felt hat edging around the door and went ballistic. I retreated as threats arrowed my way. Unsure if there COULD be anything wrong in there, Sasquatch, I eased down to my knees and looked again into the room from a lower position. Scooter was ensconced under my wife's arm Teekay, but his beady black eyes were on the door. Again the frantic barking, thus ensued the bottle throwing incident, a round of curses and threats against my person. Women, huh?

Perhaps I should reflect upon my maturity Debra? Make an adjustment. But first ... another trip to see if everything is okay in the bedroom. One never knows, even Papa Smurf should check on his family. Ain't that right Sunny?

:-)

Randall

Randall 1-26-2003 13:29

Carol,

Thanks for your post. It made me realize something. I do think of my dads new wife as a friend. I never acknowledged that before. You're post opened my eyes.

Jack,

Your project sounds so wonderful. The beauty in the area that we live is hard to share with others who have never seen it. Better to show them. I am not doing much in a creative way. I try to give my papers for school a creative edge, but, you can only take that so far (grins). At the end of a school term I tend to dive into some writing and reading.

Rachel

Rachel 1-26-2003 13:14

A quick hello to all (HELLO!!!) before I head to church...

JERRY: I greatly enjoyed the bad day jokes - and they worked! :-) I found a smile again after wrestling my muse all night, sleeping fitfully, choking a new beginning for my novel out of her before dawn arrived...! Now have to get it all on paper... hope this one does the trick. I'm so weary of editing beginnings... and so glad YOUR stories are getting dusted off and SENT IN! :-] Keep up the great work, Jerry!

And everyone, happy writing today!

I'm outta here...

Mel 1-26-2003 10:18

Carol - I have a TENS unit and use it regularly, guess we haven't talked an internal, but there has been mention of the pain pump, although I'm a ways from using that I think, but it's getting more popular, it's a pump that's implanted in the abdomen then a thin cathator is run to the area of the pain, and morphine or another pain killer is delivered directly to the site so much less is needed and there's a lot less side effects.

Problem is I don't tolerate morphine very well, it works great while I'm laying down but the second I raise my head I begin to loose lunch and keep at it till I am flat on my back again. This has been a problem since my first hospitalization and I've had to rely on demerol in hospital which didn't work half as well as morphine for me as far as pain killing that is. I just saw a documentry on pain seems they've discovered a super pain med that they can use in the pump that's derived from the venom of a poisones snail. Supposed to be like a hundred times more powerful then morphine with zero side effects, now if they can just get it out of testing, it's shown to work so well many who have been bedridden by pain are back to work.

If they could fix me up with something like that, I'd jump at it and going back to work would be wonderful, one can only sit at home so long before it starts getting to you, and I've been doing it for nearly ten years now (well scratch two years I spent in college). Actually it's helped a bunch to have the wife home with me most of the time, I had thought we would get on each other's nerves but that hasn't been the case. I guess we just love each other so much that it's been a treat to have this time together.

Jerry 1-26-2003 1:03

Sad day here in Lemmon, as eighty of our residents leave for Fort Carson Co. after being activated for the Iraq thing. Tonight as we drove to Church the lights were burning in City Hall as the City Fathers debate what to do with half our police force leaving, the lights were burning at the Fire Hall as the Firemen debated how to replace over half the Fire Department. In houses all over town wives and daughters, sons and fathers worry at what is to come.

War is not healthy for children and other living things.

I recall that from a poster that hung in the day room of our hooch in 1970 in Vietnam. It still rings true today.

I fear that Sadam won't be so easy to defeat this time, but I hope that isn't true.

I think one must wonder what would have happened in the 30's had George W. Bush been the Commander In Chief. Would the rest of the world stood aside as our troops entered Poland to protect it's borders from a German lightning attack? Would France have told us to wait? How many lives would have been saved had the US premptivly attacked Germany and forced Hitler from power?

Many now sound like Lloyd George, (it was Lloyd George wasn't it?) we will have piece in our time.

Yet I do have to wonder, if some, perhaps many of my neighbors are killed will it have been for peace?

Will it be, like the protesters said, for oil? If it is for oil, what's wrong with that, we need the oil don't we? I would surely be cold here without oil, it would be a long walk to church, to the grocery store, to mom's tomorrow for dinner and cards.

I guess we could go back to coal for heat, there's plenty of that in this country in fact in 73 when I first joined the PD, we lived in an old farm house about a mile out of town and we heated with coal. It was fine to heat with but that smell got into your cloths, you hair, your very skin and everyone you were near knew you heated with coal. That and the constant trips down to the basement to throw another lump on the fire. (We didn't have a stoker).

When I was a kid we lived in the house that my grand dad built in 1910. Back then they didn't have insulation so dad's sister tacked old newspapers to the walls before they put the wall board over it. We kids slept upstairs, and they had never finished the walls or ceiling up there, so at night we could look through the cracks and see the stars overhead. When it rained we put out pots and pans to catch the leaks and when it snowed at night while we slept, the snow landed on our quilts but we kept warm as we had plenty of blankets and old quilts that mom made at Lady's Aide meetings. We heated with coal, and it was cheap, dad would haul it from a coal mine north of our place. He also hauled for the neighbors to make enough money to pay for ours. It was hard work, I remember going with him on his coal runs, he had to shovel all the coal onto the truck and then shovel it back off when we delivered but it was very cheap and I guess that's why nobody seemed to mind not having insulation, and the frost on the windows fascinated my young mind. Tales of Jack Frost floated in my head as I saw the beauty of the frost, shapes of pine trees and diamonds abound in the heavy thick frost, so thick light barely penetrated when the sun shined. We didn't have any storm windows or plastic as we do now days so when you walked near the windows you could feel that cold air, the curtains moved day and night as the winds assaulted our home.

It was such a change when we finally abandoned the old farm house, dad sold the land and we moved to town where we had electricity, running water and gas heat. No more coal to carry in, or ashes to carry out to the ash pile. The houses we rented came with storm windows and Jack Frost was a thing of the past it. It was warm when we went to bed, warm when we got up, and no more quick (real quick in weather like this) to that little old shack out back, where be breeze tickled your rear while you did your business and looked at that Sears and Roebuck catalog that did double duty as entertainment and toilet paper (Don't use the shiny pages!)

Someone mentioned being three and not remembering much. Strangely a couple of weeks ago at mom's my sister brought over some copies of old letters that she and our other sister wrote to our cousin who was at that time in the TB sanatorium at Dunseth ND. The date on the letter show that I was but three at the time, but I do recall a trip we made up there to visit her. I remember the drive, the motel that we stayed in on the way, and sitting in the parking lot while the folks and her dad who rode along went up to visit. She was my favorite cousin and I understand, I was hers so when she learned I was out in the car, she opened her window on the third floor of the sanatorium and sat in the window so she could wave to me. I wasn't allowed up, of course being only three.

I guess since it was probably my first road trip and the nature of the mission is the reason I recall the trip, but I hadn't thought about it in years till those letters showed up. Our cousin saved all the letters she got while there and mailed copies back here (She lives out in Jack's neck of the woods).

Write ON!

Jerry 1-26-2003 0:47

Hi again!

Well, it looks like my end of the internet is finally working again. Emails went through tonight and I'm accessing this site again. Hope it stays that way.

Jerry - have any of your doctor's discussed an electronic inmplant to deaden the pain? The external ones are TENS units and there is an internal one called a PISCES unit. My husband had the PISCES installed back in '82 and had 13 years of being able to walk comfortably without his cane and only small doses of pain killers. I don't know for sure if they're still in use, or have been substituted with something else, but it could be an option. BTW - great jokes!!

Jack - I'm still working on my first fantasy novel. Actually this is the first novel I've been able to move along and stick with. I'm enjoying myself I know that much! I've also been painting some yards birds. Don't know how creative that actually is since I'm just following the patterns, but they do look nice sitting on posts all around the garden. I'll say a few prayers for you the day of your surgery that all goes well.

Rachel - I'm glad to hear about your friend Carol. That is indeed good news!

Hubby had his stitches removed from his skin grafting yesterday. Doctor reported everything looking very good and that the graft is taking nicely. Thank goodness! Now to just wait out the time till he gets his teeth. My arm is getting sore from making jello and pudding almost every day. hehehehe

Now, since the internet seems to be working for the time being, I'm going see what other mischief I can get into ..... Take care everyone!

Carol 1-25-2003 22:53

Viv - I'm having a bit of trouble with sending email. I'll keep trying to send Chap 12 to you though. Over, and over, and over .... hehhehe

Carol 1-25-2003 22:14

That was -22 Celcius!
I think that would be -378990 degrees Farenheit.... Chortle...

Anyone have any energy to spare? The flu ate all mine today. I'll see how I am in the morning. If I am beyond the scope of normal functioning, I will be back Monday.
Still, managed to get one last edit job done between throwing up from coughing too hard, and sleeping. The only cough syrup in the house is kids Buckley's. It is frightening how it knocks you on your bum! There should be a warning label on it!

Beware: Taking this medication and assuming it is not going to do anything but sooth your throat is an affliction known as 'stupidity'. Just because this is a kid's product does not mean it is incapable of inducing sleep in even the most hyper and/or stubborn individual. Do not drive Tonkas while taking this syrup, and for God's sake, don't lick the inside of the lid!

Heather 1-25-2003 21:55

Heather - Is that C or F? I guess when it gets down to -32 they are both the same, or I think that was what the old bank thermometer said, it used to flash both.

The Dr. said that he thought it a total waste of time and energy to put me through more testing etc. We've been working at pain control now for the past few months, trying different drugs and such, so he added another drug to my regime, it's an anti-depressive but works at blocking neurological pain too. Not that I'm depressed or anything but I take it to work on the pain receptors. Seems to be helping a bit.

He said the next step is the pain patch, sort of like the nicotine patch but it puts a narcotic pain killer straight into the blood stream through the skin. I go back in two weeks for another evaluation.

If the Dr. could give me a drug, or a new surgery, or anything for that matter and get me back to what I was in 1992, I'd be so happy but from what they tell me, I simply have to learn to live with it, and I guess that's what I've been doing for the last ten years.

The good thing is, though, I've begun to write in earnest again, it's like the new stuff has lifted a cloud that's been hanging over my creative side for the past year of so, I guess it was a side effect of the last stuff he had me on, so I'm glad of that.

I went over some of my old stuff, and the editor in me came to life. I ridded it of a couple of bucket full of comma's and sent it off to a magazine. Hope they like it.

Here's a bit that I got in my Email today and thought it was good for a chuckle:

Okay so maybe things aren't so bad. .

Subject: bad day's

There was a case in one hospital's Intensive Care ward where patients

always died in the same bed, on Sunday morning, at about 11 a.m, regardless of their medical condition.

This puzzled the doctors and some even thought that it had something to do with the supernatural. No one could solve the mystery... as to why the deaths occurred around 11 a.m. on Sundays.

So a World-Wide team of experts was assembled to investigate the cause of the incidents.

The next Sunday morning, a few minutes before 11 a.m., all
doctors and nurses nervously wait outside the ward to see for themselves what the terrible phenomenon was all about.

Some were holding wooden crosses, prayer books and other holy objects to ward off the evil spirits.

Just when the clock struck 11... Pookie Johnson, The part-time Sunday sweeper, entered the ward and unplugged the life support system so that he could use the vacuum cleaner.

Having a Bad Day?

The average cost of rehabilitating a seal after the Exxon
Valdez oil spill in Alaska was $80,000. At a special ceremony, two of the most expensively saved animals were being released back into the wild amid cheers and applause from onlookers. A minute later, in full view, a killer
whale ate them both.

Still think you are having a bad day?

A woman came home to find her husband in the kitchen shaking frantically, almost in a dancing frenzy, with some kind of wire running from his waist towards the electric kettle.

Intending to jolt him away from the deadly current, she whacked him with a handy plank of wood, breaking his arm in two places. Up to that moment, he had been happily listening to his Walkman.

STILL think you're having a bad day?

Two animal rights protesters were protesting at the cruelty of sending pigs to a slaughterhouse in Bonn, Germany. Suddenly, all two thousand pigs broke loose and escaped through a broken fence, stampeding madly. The two hopeless protesters were trampled to death.

What?! STILL having a bad day?

Iraqi terrorist Khay Rahnajet didn't pay enough postage on a letter bomb.

It came back with "return to sender" stamped on it. Forgetting it was the bomb; he opened it and was blown to bits.

There now, feeling better ?

Jerry 1-25-2003 18:58

p.s. I will likely think about archiving sometime soon so I can clean up the html snafus and the long semi out of place posting about the other forums. Oh, well. Talk with everyone soon. Off to hopefully doing the first dive in about two and a half weeks.

1-25-2003 16:36

Rachel: Thanks for the kind words. Heard on the radio that the entire internet got swamped by a usage attack that may explain what was going on. I will keep everyone posted as I am able to handle things here. Take care everyone.

Also, was wondering what everyone was working on creatively. I am currently working on a DVD that will include video from approximately 15 sites in the western Washington area, mainly Puget Sound. This includes doing the writing about each of the site, the pictures, the video and editing it all together and then learning the skills to burn a usable DVD copy, well, actually DVD-R. I also have hopes to actually get back to some fiction writing, but we will see. Hope others are having a creative new year as well.

Jack 1-25-2003 16:34

Hi Jack,

Hope that all goes well for you. You'll be back at everything in not time. Congrats on the Lbs. You mentioned server issues. That seems to be the name of the game. I am taking three courses on-line this semester. I haven't been able to get into the system since last night. It is tickin me off (grrrrr)! With on-line work you need to keep on top of it or you are lost. At least that is my experience.

Hugs to you and Fran.

All,

Carol is doing well. She is an amazing woman. I hope that this will be her last bout of cancer.

Rachel

Rachel 1-25-2003 11:46

Not sure what happened to forwriters.com. Server seems to be down, so this explains why the drop down menus are creating error messages. Well, saw the surgeon yesterday. I go in February 5th for a one day surgery. In and out in probably four to five hours and then home for pain meds and waiting to heal. Crossed fingers that everything goes well and they do not have to do anything beyond the laproscopic (sp?) technique. As it happens, the surgeon is a diver and was sympathetic with my worrying about how long I would be down. He left it up to me, saying as little as two weeks or up to four weeks after surgery. Main thing being how well the abdominal muscles can handle the weight of the scuba gear. We will see. Actually, one item about all of this. Since the gall bladder attack I have lost seven pounds. Seem to be plateauing again. But that is somewhat on the positive side :-). Of course, my rapid weight loss is probably what caused the gall bladder problems in the first place. At any rate, hope all are well. I have been somewhat busy of late. Talk with you soon.

Jack 1-25-2003 2:13

RHODA -- I liked Texas as well. Houston for two years, mostly on the North Shore of the Ship Channel. Beaumont for two years, North, South and Center of town. Almost bought a house in Old Town.

Took a pickup and a sleeping bag on a trip from Beaumont to the Grand Canyon. Slept in quite a few parks along I-10 and I-20

Dumas. How do they pronounce it there? More than one Houstonian pronounced "dumb-ass." But then, they had an "-ass" word for Cajuns, too.

Born and mostly grew up in Lockport, NY. Spent my tenth year in Phoenix. Left for Malibu at 19. Was an itinerant hippy typewriter mechanic for four years in little towns outside of Cleveland, Atlanta, Buffalo, Albany, Detroit and New Orleans. The Air Force had me in Biloxi and Indianapolis. (I just missed 'opportunities' to serve in Guam, Minot, and Thule).

Thule (pronounced TOO-lee) is an ancient word that means "the end of the earth" in Greenland.

Seems like I've left out someplace. Hmm. Maybe the current abode in Binghamton, NY.

Travel is broadening, but not like french fries.

Mark 1-24-2003 23:09

PAMELA -- I didn't ruin it -- just postponed it until Thursday. The chunk of finger stuck to the side of the knife, so I was able to get rid of it. I had just started to chop the first green pepper, and nothing got messed up except for my finger and my pride. I finished the dish yesterday evening and we had it for supper. It was yummy, if I do say so!

I just spent an interesting couple of hours trying to reload WIN98 on this beast of a computer. I went through all the fun stuff -- fdisk, format, load WIN98, etc etc, and could not for the life of me load the drivers for my new LCD monitor or the SONY CD-RW drive I've been using for the last year+. Finally got tired of it, shut down, swapped the old drive back in and here I am. It's a pain right in the whatever! I hate computers!

SASQUATCH -- what do you use for a computer out there in the big woods? :-)

howard 1-24-2003 22:54

How can you tell when it's winter in southern California? The "Marlboro Man" on the billboards is wearing a heavy coat. Oops, guess that joke may be out of date, do they even allow ciggie ads there now? I still don't understand how they can ban a product that is legal, seems there's a violation of someone's rights in there somewhere (I know it was a huge blow to the restaurant industry). Don't mean to get political, I notice Rhoda has sworn off getting involved in politics, which IS easier on the mind and mental well-being. RHODA, I'm sure you know more about the Tulsa area than I do, having left when I was three. I was born at a hospital in Tulsa but we actually lived in Skaitook (am I spelling that right?), I guess it's a smaller town nearby. Thanks for liking my character's names, CAROL, I did know a boy named Nova, which I always thought was a cool name. My moving around, and lots of unusual experiences, certainly help with my writing, as I'm sure it does with all of you creative people. Even when we don't write directly about our lives, I guess everything has an influence on us. I mentioned being in jail in Brownsville, well, I did go on to prison (for less than an ounce of pot but hey, it was the 60's) and while there I went crazy, which was a really interesting thing. Now my hapless heroine Sunny will be having some experiences which she cannot tell whether they are real or if she is going nuts, so my own trip into psycho-land will be a big help. Maybe you guys can keep an eye on me and be sure I don't get too far into the craziness (ha ha, ho ho, hee hee hee.....!) LAURA, good luck on your story, we are all rooting for you! HEATHER, I meant to mention that I looked at your miniature paintings and really liked them a lot, sorry I can't afford to buy anything but I'm financially challenged at the moment. RANDALL, I've been back through some old postings and have enjoyed two more stories of yours, Red Britches and the supernatural Christmas and Catalina the longhorn steer, you are quite the storyteller (I especially liked your metaphor that your explanations to your wife went over like a screen door on a submarine -- good one!).

Pamela 1-24-2003 21:56

Hi All :)

Just a quick hello to all despite the shivering. My little office was originally a front porch before someone walled it in. Unfortunely, they neglected insulation and heaters and my feet are freezing! Oh, well, a heat wave of high 20's is forecasted for Tues.

Hubby had his bandage removed from his thumb today and the skin grafting seems to have taken. Howard - I'll make sure hubby don't order those knives. One round of ER and blood is enough!

Viv -- I'll send on what I have of Pommes. Oh, what a mess a computer crash can do to one! I don't have anything to send you this week of my own writing. I'm still trying to make the decisions on some of those questions we discussed. I got a partial scene written in long-hand the other night, but haven't added it to the computer yet.

Laura - yes, it is always that nerve-wracking and that's what you get for living in such warm, sunny weather and teasing all the rest of us! hehehehe If I remember right - the longer it takes, the more likely you are to receive an acceptance, if that helps ease the nerves a little. {{hug}}

Pamela - cool names! And I'm guessing all your moving around is helping that story of yours move along too!

Heather -- did you get Grandma Rose ok? I'll keep checking email for any notes you have on revisions.

Carol 1-24-2003 19:34

Laura, you can take your 70 degrees and do you know what with it. ;-) New Jersey is up to 9 now.
And yes, it's always that nerve-wracking. I think I had over 50 rejections for my first book, and it wound up being a Book-Of-The-Month Club alternate main selection. And I went through it again with my second (which I'm writing now). I used to tell myself that I had to go through *x* number of rejections before I would get an acceptance, and it helped. A little. But the process is what it is. Anyway, we're rooting for you, and it does help having support. Keep us posted!

Sunny 1-24-2003 19:30

Well, I can tell I have a story out, I keep checking the mail for a reply, even a rejection would tell me someone has seen it. Arrrrgh, is it always this nerve wracking? And just a little neener neener to those of you in snow states, I'm from CA, and it is seventy degrees and sunny.

Laura 1-24-2003 18:21

PAMELA,

I just moved from the Tulsa area over six months ago. I lived in Owasso for two years. Before that I lived two years in Perryton, Texas. When I arrived on the Notebook back in 1996, I was living in Farmington, New Mexico (that was the 2nd time I lived there). I have lived several places in Texas. Lets see, there was Waco, then Houston, and then Dumas. I was born in Kentucky, grew up in Indiana and from ages 3 to 7 lived in Monroe, Louisiana. Now I am back in Louisiana. It seems you and I have been in some of the same places. Actually I liked Texas.

So where am I from? People down here ask me that all the time and it takes a long time to answer the question.

The weather here has been unseasonably cold. We have freeze warnings for the second night in a row. Actually it was nice today when the sun came out and the wind stopped blowing. It got up to a balmy 41 degrees. It supposed to be a bit warmer tomorrow.

Have a great week-end, everyone.

Rhoda 1-24-2003 17:42

Howdy from Pamela,
Apologies for the long double-posting, guess I didn't read far enough in the Dummies book, thanks for assurances others have done same. SUNNY, I am originally from Tulsa, Oklahoma but only lived there until I was 3, then on to Chicago up to age 8, then down to Texas (there was quite a language barrier moving from up there to down there, I talked so fast they could hardly understand me and they used words I'd never heard of). One of the characters in the book I'm working on now is named Sunny, short for Sunshine, her parents were hippies, siblings named Stone, Rainbow and Nova. JERRY, I wasn't offended by your not answering my notes right away or even at all, this site is so busy there's a lot going on. Thanks much for all your info on police dept. heirarchies, I can see that they are different for different size forces. I glean a lot from books, many of which are written by former cops (is that word offensive?) so I assume they're correct but they are different from each other; sometimes the lieutenants stay in the office and runs things, other times they are out doing the detecting, etc. My fictional town is imaginary but about the size of my own so I will probably call my local dept. and ask for help there. Sounds like you've had quite an interesting career. I had a feeling you would like the old country singers too. Good luck with the doc tomorrow, I hope he decides you are rehabilitable! Have you thought about acupuncture for your back? HOWARD, shame on you for ruining a good pasta primavera. No really, I hope your finger is okay, I only laugh because your wife and the people at the ER did too. Those things on TV really look handy, I want that pot with a colander top. It was minus 2 degrees here too and my sympathies lie with those of you dealing with 20 below but hey, this is the SOUTH already! I guess I can handle it, it's supposed to be back into our normal winter 40's in a few days. JACK, how is your gall bladder doing? RANDALL, you are so right that we need to stop these maniacs and JERRY you are right that we don't know everything the president knows but it is all just very sad and it's too bad the world couldn't listen to a bunch of kids chanting "make love not war" thirty years ago. I question whether we are really the most highly developed animals since no others have such a propensity for destruction. When the dolphins are talking, maybe they are laughing at us stupid humans and think they have taught us tricks like feeding them.

Pamela 1-24-2003 15:51

Negative 2? Whoa, it's -22 here! Yeah, I'm complaining!
At least there's some sunshine! (Perfect for shining into your eyes so you can't see with a frozen windshield....but it is nice our car's actually starting now.)
Oooops! So easy to be pessimistic.

How about, "It's so lovely out in the sunshine, with all the ice on the trees glittering....even though with the frigid weather my undies stay bunched much longer..."

Heather 1-24-2003 11:15

SASQUATCH! -- It's good to see you here again as well! It's cold here today, too, around -2. Too cold for me. How do you stand it?

JERRY -- Maybe the kids in your town should use Tony Blair's Pepsodent -- "You'll wonder where the yellow went..."

howard 1-24-2003 8:03

Thanks, Jerry!
Got another one in the manila envelope!

...and she's off!

Heather 1-24-2003 1:46

Jerry - don't have your email on hand, can you send me an email and I'll have it from there? I have 'Stubborn' in final copy status and will send it for your approval! It is now printed and in with the other final copies of stories for P*. It feels really good to have an envelope started, though it is still on the thin side tonight.
Will fatten it up tomorrow and Saturday, and want to have it ready for Monday morning. I think I've got a touch of the flu that my husband's had all week (though it's not a serious flu, it's annoying to have a scratchy throat and a dry cough and headache! But I will press onward with Phantasium because I've got Ron waiting for the manuscript. Nothing like a little expectation to get a fire lit under my butt!
Good thing I have lots of printer ink...knock on plastic.
LOL

T.O.M., I missed your post somehow as well - good to see you, Americo, and sasquatch all back posting again!

Pamela - there's no method for deleting the second of a double post once it's up (unless Jack erases it), but don't worry, we all double post on occasion! I'll probably do it with this one...:oP

Heather 1-24-2003 0:30

Debra - I have that one posted on my first web page, the link is below. It is a very old page and about 99 percent of the data is wrong the links to other pages are all dead but the story is still there, well both that were published in Shorelines are still there if you want to read them again.

Teekay - sorry to hear of the deaths, the fires look terrible on TV. At least when we have them here the population is so spares that it's usually just grass, fences and a few jack rabbits that get burned, the prairie fires anyhow.

Glad your safe anyway. Droughts are bad, we've been in one now for the past four years, my lawn looked nearly bare when the snow fell this winter and we haven't had enough snow yet to do much good next spring. I only hope we get enough to fill my well so I can water this spring, it was running out after only an hour or so last year. The city water here is of such poor quality that those who water with it usually get a sort of yellow lawn even in good years. Makes one wonder what our innards look like after a lifetime of drinking the stuff.

The new water lines will be in this summer (well they're supposed to be) bringing us wonderful clear water pumped from Lake Sakakawea. Many of the nearby towns have it already and that water tastes so much better, they say that it grows great lawns too if you can afford to use it, it is a bit more expensive then what we have now but much more pure.

You can tell the kids who grow up here as their teeth are all yellow, the result of too much fluoride in the water, no need to add any here in fact they could make some bucks just distilling this water and selling the crap.

But I ramble on about things that nobody needs to know about anyhow, is this part of aging??? Could be.

Tomorrow is the day I see my Dr for testing to see if I can be rehabed again, I'll be glad to get that over for another year (I hope).

Jerry My Old Page 1-23-2003 23:54

greetings from the cold places humans persons. i sasquatch have returned from Yeti gathering to honor cousin who worked in movie monsters inc and is now a very big pain but is still cousin. he asks if want his name written for keepsake. ha! has no pen. can not write as well. then wants 3 or 4 zanggar for! dumb! zanggar like all tibet moneys not even safe to have! was funny in movie although.

i sasquatch have very much sorrow for many things in humans persons world this day. too much beating of drum, and many heart hurtings. donkey man in babylon is no nebuchadnezzar! must go away or be made to go away before hurting many more humans persons. Yeti see evil in him. see others sleep. see others who do not care. see others point at ones who want to make better, but only hope they will do that for good and not selfish. i must go.

sasquatch 1-23-2003 21:59

Howard,

I was an impressionable one-year old at the time. ;-)
But I loved the Fifties, and thanks so much for bringing them back again in that site!

Sunny 1-23-2003 19:59

All this political discussion! But I am not taking the bait! No way. My PMS is over and past for the month. I feel loving, gentle, magnanimous, blessed, and at peace with the whole world. I am not going to spoil my lovely mood by thinking about that mess overseas.

I heard the Louisiana Symphony practice today and had the pleasure of hearing a very special soloist--a fourteen year old boy by the name of Julian Bliss. He played his clarinet so beautifully, it almost made me cry. He is my daughter's age, and he plays perfectly. I had not been to the Symphony for seventeen or eighteen years. I forgot what I was missing. I must go back often and drag the children with me.

AMERICO,

Nice to hear from you again. Enjoyed your post, especially the part about Tony Blair's Pepsodent smile. The description seems to fit him.

Rhoda 1-23-2003 19:40

That 50s site is back up -- neat one! The song is "Sleepwalk" by Santo and Johnny. I'll never forget the first time I heard that one. It was instant captivation. Okay, so I was an impressionable teen, driving a '52 Nash Ambassador down Valley street. Butch liked it too.
Oh well...

howard 1-23-2003 18:12

Oooops, sorry Tina! Missed your post there. So far I don't need anything, but did you get my last revision of 'Daniel', and did you approve of what I edited out?
Just need to know if you approve of the changes and that will take care of it; Sandra and Lily is fine as is I am pretty certain. If there are any changes once I get to it again, I'll email you!
Thanks, Tina - it's been a pleasure working with you, (and everyone who worked with me on Phantasium!)
Still have work to do......
but getting there slowly.

SIGH!

EDDIE: My heart still goes out to you. May you and Anita get closer so that you don't feel so alone. Although, I'm certain from how you have spoken of your wife that you two are already very close. That is what will be saving grace for the both of you - having each other.

Heather 1-23-2003 17:05

Oh, that is awful, Teek - no, not the order you mentioned things in! The burned houses and the four who died. Seems like droughts are hitting all over the world, wherever it's summer. Not good.

Progress is progress: I have the first three Phantasium stories printed with pagenumbering in the envelope to mail to Ronsdale Press! I will also put in our publishing credits, with the list of where we are all from, etc., after my very short 'query' letter - I won't need much of one considering Mr. Hatch has already requested the manuscript. Actually, more than a query letter it will be a bit of an intro to us, the collection and a thank you for reading. Then will follow either my intro from the project, or Mark's - haven't decided which to place first. They are both going to be in there. Then, of course, the title page and then, page one begins with Teek's 'One Red Shoe'.
The second mss is Howard's 'Aunt Aggie' and third is Jerry's 'Stubborn'. Next is my 'Waiting Room' and fifth is Christi's 'Stranger Than Fiction' or 'Death is a Redhead'.
The preliminary list I posted a while back is still what I'm working from, but on occasion I may switch which story I present first by a particular author. I'd like to move Tina's first story up a bit closer to the beginning of the collection, and Mary's as well.
Of course, can't have them all in the first ten slots!
Most of the stories simply need pagenumbering and then a quick check-printing to make sure there aren't any typos/etc., but this is slow going because I'm bloody picky!
Jerry, I will have to send you back 'Stubborn' to approve of the changes I made - not too many, but I filled in two characters a tad more for you. :oD
I'll get that to you tonight, but want to give it one more reading to make sure I don't need to do one more change.
So...that is where we stand as of today on Phantasium.
I'm nervous!!!!

Back later!

Heather 1-23-2003 16:56

Randall

Hey!

Home sick ... again!

FYI ... least some of us forget

IRAQI-ACKNOWLEDGED OPEN-AIR TESTING OF BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS

At Muhammadiyat - Mar 1988, BACILLUS SUBTILIS tested with a 250-gauge bomb (cap. 65 liters)
Al Muhammadiyat - Mar 1988, BOTULINUM TOXIN tested with a 250-gauge bomb (cap. 65 liters)
Al Muhammadiyat – Nov 1989, BACILLUS SUBTILIS tested with a 122mm rocket (cap. 8 liters)
Al Muhammadiyat – Nov 1989, BOTULINUM TOXIN tested with a 122mm rocket (cap. 8 liters)
Al Muhammadiyat – Nov 1989, AFLATOXIN TESTED with a122mm rocket (cap. 8 liters)
Khan Bani Saad – Aug 1988, BACILLUS SUBTILIS aerosol generator tested by a Mi-2 helicopter with modified agricultural spray equipment.
Al Muhammadiyat – Dec 1989, BACILLUS SUBTILIS tested with a R-400 bomb (cap. 85 liters)
Al Muhammadiyat – Nov 1989, BOTULINUM TOXIN tested with a R-400 bomb (cap. 85 liters)
Al Muhammadiyat – Nov 1989, AFLATOXIN tested with a R-400 bomb (cap. 85 liters)
Jurf al-Sakr Firing Range – Sep 1989, RICIN tested with a 155mm artillery shell (cap. 3 liters)
Abu Obeydi Airfield – Dec 1990, WATERMODIFIED (sic?) tested by a Mirage F1 drop-tank (cap. 2,200 liters)
Abu Obeydi Airfield – Dec 1990, WATER/POTASSIUM PERMANGANATE tested with a modified Mirage F1 drop-tank (cap. 2,200 liters)
Abu Obeydi Airfield – Jan 1991, WATER/GLYCERINE tested with a modified Mirage F1 drop-tank (cap. 2,200 liters)
Abu Obeydi Airfield – Jan 1991, BACILLUS SUBTILIS/GLYCERINE tested with a modified Mirage F1 drop-tank (cap. 2,200 liters)

"Iraq admitted producing thousands of liters of the BW agents anthrax, botulinum toxin, (which paralyzes respiratory muscles and can be fatal within 24 to 36 hours), and aflatoxin, (a potent carcinogen that can attack the liver, killing years after ingestion),and preparing BW-filled Scud-variant missile warheads, aerial bombs, and aircraft spray tanks before the Gulf war."

DOCUMENTED IRAQI USE OF CHEMICAL WEAPONS

About Aug 1983 at Hajj Umran, Mustard gas killed "fewer than 100" Iranians/Kurds
About Oct/Nov1983 at Panjwin, Mustard gas killed 3,000 Iranian/Kurds
About Feb/Mar1984 at Majnoon Island, Mustard gas killed 2,500 Iranians
About Mar 1984 at al-Basrah, Tabun killed 50 to 100 Iranians
About Mar 1985 at Hawizah Marsh, Mustard/Tabun killed 3,000 Iranians
About Feb 1986 at al-Faw, Mustard/Tabun killed 8,000 to 10,000 Iranians
About Dec 1986 at Umm ar Rasas, Mustard gas killed "Thousands" Iranians
About Apr 1987 at al-Basrah, Mustard/Tabun killed 5,000 Iranians
About Oct 1987 at Sumar/Mehran, Mustard/nerve agents killed 3,000 Iranians
About Mar 1988 at Halabjah, Mustard/nerve agents killed "Hundreds" Iranians/Kurds

http://www.odci.gov/cia/publications/iraq_wmd/Iraq_Oct_2002.htm#04

So ... do we really need more time to see if this guy is dangerous?

Randall

1-23-2003 16:49

Would you believe it, I corrected the spelling of also in my last post. It didn't look quite right the first time. :-D

Teekay - yes, again. 1-23-2003 16:04

JERRY: 4 people aslo died. I feel a bit horrible, mentioning the houses and not them.

Teekay 1-23-2003 16:03

JERRY: There are fires dotted all round N.S.W, but I'm thinking the ones you might be speaking of are the Canberra fires. Canberra is about 3, maybe 4 hours drive away (depends who's driving and if you take the highway or the dirt roads) from here.
They have lost a little over 400 houses!!! What a shocker.
The weather has been totally foul. I can't remember when we last had a hotter summer, and the drought hasn't helped any either.

HOWARD: ~shudder~ & (((((((((((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))))
I also noticed how you minimised answering the question :-D

Teekay 1-23-2003 15:49

HEAR HEAR RANDALL!!

I'm as much for peace as the next guy, but I think, like anything precious, it's something which we may be called upon to to fight for.

Lucky the ones who can indulge the limited thinking of their hearts, but must they burden others who think also with their minds.

Teekay 1-23-2003 15:19

Shucks! THey ran out of bandwidth! O well, try it again in a few days.

howard 1-23-2003 14:11

Anyone doing research into the 50s might want to check this page:

Check out http://rememberthe50s.homestead.com/

(it's a tad slow, and there's music )

howard 1-23-2003 14:10

jerry:

Didn't you post The Wall here once? I think I remember that one. Wasn't it about a soldier remembering what happened while looking at the wall?

I liked it if that was it. Please post it again sometime.

Debra 1-23-2003 13:36

Heather - Here's the dates:

Here is my brief published history:

Just a Bottle of Tiger Piss - Wilmington Blues (Short Story Fiction) Nov/Dec 2002

The Wall - Shorelines (Essay) 1995 (this magazine is published once a year)

The First Call - Shorelines (Short Story Non-Fiction) 1995 (this magazine is published once a year)

The Tree - Writers Coffee House (Poem) May 2000

Jerry 1-23-2003 13:18

Got this from my sister, thought it might lighten things up a bit.

Speeding?

Woman: Is there a problem, Officer?
Officer: Ma'am, you were speeding.
Woman: Oh, I see.
Officer: Can I see your license please?
Woman: I'd give it to you but I don't have one.
Officer: Don't have one?
Woman: Lost it 4 times for drunk driving.
Officer: I see...Can I see your vehicle registration papers please.
Woman: I can't do that.
Officer: Why not?
Woman: I stole this car.
Officer: Stole it?
Woman: Yes, and I killed and hacked up the owner.
Officer: You what?
Woman: His body parts are in plastic bags in the trunk if you want to see. The Officer looks at the woman and slowly backs away to his car and calls for back up. Within minutes 5 police cars circle the car. A senior officer slowly approaches the car, clasping his half drawn gun.
Officer 2: Ma'am, could you step out of your vehicle please! The woman steps out of her vehicle.
Woman: Is there a problem sir?
Officer 2: One of my officers told me that you have stolen this car and murdered the owner.
Woman: Murdered the owner?
Officer 2: Yes, could you please open the trunk of your car. The woman opens the trunk, revealing nothing but an empty trunk.
Officer 2: Is this your car, ma'am?
Woman: Yes, here are the registration papers. The officer is quite stunned.
Officer 2: One of my officers claims that you do not have a driving license. The woman digs into her handbag and pulls out a clutch purse and hands it to the officer. The officer snaps opens the clutch purse and examines the license. He looks quite puzzled.
Officer 2: Thank you ma'am, one of my officers told me you didn't have a license, that you stole this car, and that you murdered and hacked up the owner.
Woman: 'Betcha the lying bastard told you I was speeding, too.

Howard - I went to that comedy site too, got a good chuckle thanks.

Jerry 1-23-2003 13:06

HOWARD: I went to that computer humor site you linked to, and even someone who has never taken a single screw off the back of their hard drive could find humor in those shots. My favorite one is the duct-tape repair special, and the two Visa cards in the floppy drive. Very rich. Thanks for posting that! ;-)

Mary 1-23-2003 9:51

Does anyone know how I would get an address for the Baha Men. They sang Who Let the Dogs Out. I would like to send it to them. It doesn't have anything to do with dogs, but still is a sequel.

It's called "Who Cut The Tags Off"

I just sent all my poems including this one to the Library of Congress.

It's really liberating to be able to send them to anyone who might be able to do something with it without worring about crooks.

Debra 1-23-2003 9:11

Pamela - I'm not being unfriendly, just didn't get that far down reading till now.

Ya, driving on ice is an experience, I've done it so long while I was working that it comes second nature to me, but I still get a thrill once in awhile when I'm not paying good enough attention.

The trick to driving on ice is the judicious use of the shifting lever. When you need to stop on ice slip the shift lever into neutral, then light on the brake does the job, if you have an automatic. It's easier with a standard transmission, simply use the clutch first then light on the brake.

Oh and I do love the old classic country Hank Williams and that bunch, also Marty Robbins and his El Paso. My daughter was born in El Paso so she is crazy about that song even though she can't remember the city at all as we moved when she was three years old. Also Hank Thompson, Little Jimmy Dickens (Got to see him live at a 4th of July concert in Faith SD when I was young) Hank Snow, Tex Ritter and of course Johnny Cash. Kazaa has been so good at letting me find all my old favorites, and I've a ton of CD's that I've burned from the downloads.

My eldest sister married a truck driver when I was young so I got into Truck Driving songs too, the marriage didn't last as is the case with many truckers, but the music stayed with me anyhow.

When I went to Vietnam I picked up on Rock, (Country was rare indeed). When I got home my music taste moved to CCR, 3 Dog Night, Eric Burton and the Animals (WE GOTTA GET OUT OF THIS PLACE!), Crosby Stills Nash and Young, and of course the Beetles were always on the top of my list from the first time I heard "I wanna hold your hand" on my sister's Deca record player. I also listened to Barry Sadler even before I joined the army, and when in training, "The Wichita Lineman" was the top of all our lists as we trained as Field Wiremen and pole climbing was one part of our training.

Now when I want to relax, I still enjoy a bit of classical music and I have a few CD's (that I actually bought) filled with the wonderful music by the masters.

Jerry 1-23-2003 1:00

Oh got so wrapped up in conversation, I forgot to mention that it is COLD here tonight. The mercury is down to -20F with a wind, the TV says the wind chill is around -60 right now so it's a good time to remain indoors.

The gas man was here today and fill our tank. Funny how gas prices work, the fill we got this fall was .65 a gallon today's fill was 1.00 a gallon so the bill was a bit higher then I expected. I was glad he showed anyhow tonight would be a hell of a time to run out of propane.

Teekay - how close are you to the big fires we've been seeing reported on TV of late?

Jerry 1-23-2003 0:37

Americo - good to see you amongst us again, I knew you were lurking. As far as our President - what Randall said.

I trust the man, he knows a whole lot more then I do about what Sadam is doing, and to release that information to the world would put some very good very brave men's lives in danger. One has to understand that Mr. Bush had revived the CIA, he's reinvented covert action and to broadcast all he knows would simply be stupid, and dangerous.

I don't like to see a war, but it will come and very soon if the activation of all the Reserves and National Guard is any sign. Even here in the buffalo commons our men are marching off to war, our little Guard unit, one I was once a member of has been activated, many of my friends and relatives are on their way to a quick training on how to live in the "sand box" then off to the mid-east.

Police Departments are all a bit different and they each have their own hierarchy structure. One can be a Sergeant and never be a detective, and one can be a detective and never a sergeant, depending on where you are assigned in the Department. You see there is a hierarchy in the patrol division that begins with the inspector to the captain the lieutenant, then the sergeant, and the officer. It is the same in the detective division, there can be a detective second grade, first grade, Sgt. and so forth. It is much like the military in that aspect.

The small department's I worked on had a very small hierarchy, I served as an officer, then moved to a different town where I was hired as the Sgt. of the force, then when the Chief (my immediate supervisor) was fired, I got his job. The whole department consisted of A Chief of Police, A sergeant (assistant Chief in many departments) and two more full time officers as well as four part time officers.

Another Department I worked in consisted of the Sheriff (acting as the Chief of Police for the city, elected as the Sheriff of the County) and three full time officers of which I was one, and a couple of part time officers. When that Sheriff lost his office in an election, I was promoted to Chief of Police, and the police department and the Sheriffs office separated. When I left that Department, it again went under the Sheriffs department as the City didn't feel any of the officers left were qualified to be Chief and the new Sheriff had been in office long enough to get things going well for the County and felt comfortable supervising the Police Department again. A while later, the Sheriff's department completely absorbed the PD, and now the Sheriff and his six deputies patrol both the two cities in the county and the rest of the county as well. This is a much more efficient method of law enforcement in my opinion, but many feel that the city has lost much of it's control over what goes on in their community.

In my departments, (the ones I ran) all officers served as both patrol officers as well as investigators. I had a rule that when a major crime was committed, either I or my assistant were to be notified immediately and usually we came in to supervise the investigation. When a crime looked to be something we were not prepared to investigate we could call in the State Criminal Investigation Division and they would send one of their detective's to assist us with the investigation.

The first Department that I was the Chief of was in the South West corner of North Dakota in the middle of the Oil Fields of North Dakota during it's boom so we saw nearly every crime there is on the books on a regular basis. We were a small town but the largest for nearly a hundred miles around so I served as a Special Deputy for two counties, the one where our city was as well as a neighboring county since their Sheriff had to come twenty miles south then fifteen miles west to get to the largest small town in his county. I would get calls from him regularly requesting that I respond to that small town and assist their only police officer (who also served as the Street Department, Water Department and dog catcher) with major crimes that occurred there (it was a strange little town filled with strange people who did some very unusual things, a very interesting place where police radio's failed to work at all due to mineral deposits in the buttes that circled the small village.)

I have considered writing some police related stories, in fact I have several that I posted in our old workbook when it was up and running and had a good start on a terrorist/militia book but most of it is now history. Just as well it wasn't going where I wanted it to go anyhow.

Jerry 1-23-2003 0:27

RANDALL,
You are my hero!!!! Wonderful speech. Americo usually tends to make me feel patriotic and I haven't even gotten down to his entry yet.

Rosemary 1-22-2003 22:46

RANDALL -- Hear! Hear! Well said!

I'm not in a good mood tonight. Embarassed, sore, a bit ticked at Chef Tony, even though it's not really his fault.
I posted this to Teekay a few minutes ago, but will share it here as well, because I really think it's funny, even if it does hurt...
She asked about the writing...

"...Well, the writing is going okay, albeit slow, but the typing just suffered a setback. This evening I was fixing supper, and trying out the new set of Miracle Knives that I ordered from Chef Tony on the TV. They are the sharpest, toughest, handiest knives on the planet, and as I was needing a new set anyway, and the "Rock'n'Chop" heavy duty chopping blade looked to be just what I needed for cutting up meat and veggies for the yummie dishes I make, I ordered a set. Only $39.95! Plus medical costs accrued when spoiling a perfectly good (vegetarian) Pasta PrimaVera by adding a sizeable chunk (removed by said Rock'n'Chop) of one's left index finger.
It just would not stop bleeding! So after my wife got home (and stopped laughing) she took me to the ER and (after more chuckles -- even outright guffaws) they fixed me up and sent me packing.
The PA gave me a tetanus booster and dressed the finger, and asked if it hurt. When I said yes, she snorted again, and said "Wait ''til morning!"
I think I'll write an essay on the care and compassion one finds in our houses of healing...

AMERICO -- Welcome back! It's good to see you here again.

howard 1-22-2003 22:18

Randall

Hello everyone...

(Sigh)

Well ... BTW ... welcome back Americo, and Jon and Pussy ... the problem with being critical of America and Americans in general, their presidents in particular, administration, military officers, et al. It all comes down to trust and the learning curve. Whom should you trust? Are lessons learned? To what degree? Disregarded? A world leader who invaded other nations, tortured and kill their people? Who jailed and executed many innocent people, his own included, without due process ... a maniac by all accounts? A godless man who controlled his own people by torture, execution, propaganda, exploited technological advances in war and weaponry for conquest? Looted captured museums for art, banks for gold, rounded up citizens at random, forcing them into slave labor camps for gross medical experimentation by "respectable doctors?" This despot initiated war, invaded neighbors on two fronts? Fought one war for conquest, one war for oil, thumbed his nose at the world, indeed taunted world governments who pleaded for peace? Disregarded peace treaties signed in his name, in the name of his country, never intending to honor anything he ever agreed too?

Wow! Americo ... thank God the European nations had America, British and Canadian boys on their side. What a relief, eh? No telling what Adolph Hitler would have done to Europe had American and English boys not fought and died to save their inept ass. Good job boys, you say! As you lay in bed tonight ... listen for the sound of German SS soldiers marching through Europe rounding up Jews for local neighborhood crematoriums. (No waiting. Line forms here. Women and children first.) Hear any? It's not because of what the Europeans accomplished. You see, American and British and Canadian men and women, fighting, dying, were not on their own homeland, fighting terror ... oh, no. But within the land of Europe ... to pull their fat out of the fire because they couldn't.

God Bless President Bush ... I hope he captures that Iraqi fruitcake ... exiles him to Europe with a division of his Republican guards ... That way the learning curve on murderous dictators who sponsor world wide terror will surely be evident to everybody ... even incompetent Europeans who choose to spend their life with heads in the sand.

Randall

Randall 1-22-2003 21:42

Pamela, the double posting got me too, until i realized that sometimes what I write gets posted immediately, and sometimes it takes a little awhile. In other words, if you don't see it right away, it will still get there. Question for you: where are you from, originally? Just curious. :-)

Sunny 1-22-2003 20:36

Sorry I posted that twice, don't know how to undo it, someone knowledgeable please delete one or tell me how to do it from here.

Pamela 1-22-2003 17:28

Greetings from Pamela,
Boy, this sure is a busy site, I see the return of some folks I hadn't met yet, The Old Man and Americo. EDDIE, I'm so glad you felt like talking about Michael, what a wonderful relationship you had with him. I know it makes you miss him all the more but also remember how blessed you were to be so close, how many kids will kiss their folks in front of their friends? So many parents and kids find they don't really like each other or have much in common as the kids grow into adults and they often become estranged, not necessarily as in angry estranged, just lack of interest. There will always be a hole in your heart, I say I have a pile of bones where I toss all the bad things, and it never goes away but it does get easier eventually. Good for you for preventing future accidents with your quick action on the barrier. JERRY, no wonder you are sometimes short-tempered if you have been dealing with WC for 10 years! I have been on partial disability recently and dealing with the insurance company for just a year has about driven me batty. A computer crashing, and losing stories, would be enough to get anyone upset, hope your wife has a good place to run and hide when you feel like throwing things! VIV, are you moving to Texas? It isn't like the wild west, there are civilized people there (look at Randall!) and I don't think you need to be so fearful that you must drive 4-5 hours back and forth to work. There are good and bad people everywhere and as long as we take reasonable precautions (like T.O.M. said, use the deadbolt), most of us will escape the craziness of the few. Seventy-six percent of all serial killers come from the U.S. but most of us never see one. The scariest thing about Texas is the humongous cockroaches, bring heavy boots for stomping. MEL, I meant to reply to your comment a while ago about dusting off your manuscript and deciding it had to be re-written -- join the club, me too. I had been hoping I could edit and partially rewrite the rough draft of my novel but I have developed it so much more, have so many new characters and plot twists to add, that I actually think it will be easier to just start all over. Many writers DO rewrite their books, not just once but several times, so I have the attitude that nothing is wasted, even if it isn't used, we are honing our craft and perfecting our story. JERRY, with your background and paralegal training, you seem to be perfectly positioned to write a police procedural/legal thriller, how about it? That reminds me, may I ask you a quick police question? Does one become a sergeant before becoming a detective? Then detective, (3 grades, 1st being highest?) then lieutenant, the guy who runs the investigation? HEATHER, you do seem to have a lot of energy, good luck to you all on your joint book of stories. Speaking of energy, there is a lot of it on this site and it is sure helping me with my own creativity. We artistic types are probably aware of the energies around us, and how they can be contagious, and I'm glad to see that positive creative energy can be transmitted through the Netwaves. Thanks for the boost!

Pamela 1-22-2003 17:22

Back later with some PRODUCTIVE news.... :oD

Heather 1-22-2003 15:58

Good news, Jon and Americo! The Phantasium project is very near ready to send off, and be out of my livingroom for a while! Jon is angry with me? Well no doubt I have procrastinationitis on occasion, plus I overload myself with too many creative projects and find myself burning out on one or more of them. If I do creative things in fits and starts, it is my fault alone if things do not get finished in good time. Jon will have to get used to my terrible curse of being an artist. Is it the curse of being terrible with self-discipline in disguise?
Well, should I use a word less bound up with superstition, perhaps? Cursed is such a thick word.
I do finish things, but I do know that many things are not completed by any deadlines I set personally.
I throw my hands up at myself and sigh heavily.
Handcuffs for this chair might work....

Heather 1-22-2003 15:57

Eddie,
I knew of Michael ever since you told us about the accident. I wanted to find words to reassure you, but I could not. So I remained silent. Allow me to hug you without words, my friend.

Howard,
I was delighted to know that your lungs are clean. I confess that I was a bit worried about your health. Glad the nightmare is over. How about a big Havana to celebrate the great news?...

Heather,
Time to put an end to the Phantasium thing and go back to your personal projects. You have till the summer to conclude one of your two quite promising novels. In the summer you'll write your second novel. And by Christmas you will give us a present: the news that a good Canadian traditional publisher is interested in publishing at least one of your books. Do not procrastinate your talent any longer. Jon is really furious with you. He is your guardian angel, i.e., the most severe of your ghosts.

Jerry,
What is making you nervous is not any medicine you are taking. It's your bloody Present and his crazy notions about how to fight terrorism. The way this campaign against Iraque has been led is really incredible. No good arguments, no proofs of anything, just threats and arrogance. Time to ask any old, good American to reestablish peace and good will among all nations.

Eddie,
Tony Blair is nuts or what? We used to call him here "Mr Pepsodent smile". But now the man is becoming a serious clinical case. Hope he changes his mind as to the Iraque affair and listens to what the good Europeans have been telling him: stay away from cheap oil!

Rhoda,
Rhoda? Rhoda!

Americo 1-22-2003 14:23

After 27 phone calls to WC, after a conversation with the Governor's aide my case worker called me today!

Her explanation "I clicked when I should have double clicked releasing your check!" She even apologized. To sooth my anger she even added two weeks to my check, of course it is two weeks late so it's no bonus.

Now if she could just replace all the damn sleep I lost last night worrying about it all.

The cold has arrived. This morning when I sat down at my machine the weather bug said -20 but it's warmed up to -10 now, a virtual heat wave.

The basement repair guy came upstairs yesterday and told me that my house is now stable, he isn't done but the sinking has been stopped and the floors are almost level, some of the doors are now shutting, some of them aren't (the bathroom door won't lock now).

In another hour or two my nerves may settle down. My wife tells me that I've been a son-of-a-bitch these last few weeks and want's me to check with the Dr. to see which new drug he put me on has that side effect.

I guess I can agree with her, my temper has been razor edged the smallest thing sets me off of late. I've never been like that before so it must be something I'm taking. I know Demorol will do that to you but I'm not on that right now. Who knows maybe I'm just getting old. I wish I could control that a bit more like I used to.

Jerry 1-22-2003 12:38

Eddie, glad to hear you are making something positive out of your loss. I can imagine what your going through, I stood with my good neighbor Jon when he lost his son a couple of years ago. Parents aren't supposed to have to bury their young.

TOM glad to see you here abouts again, it's been quite some time.

Has anyone heard From Eric? With all that's happening in his neighborhood, I worry of his safety.

I would vote to hear from Americo again, and Pussy et al.

He's probably been lurking for some time just waiting to jump in.

And what of shortie night????

Had to call Workers Comp again today, seems for some reason they have put a hold on my damn check. The lady I spoke with had NO IDEA why and had me leave voice mail for my handler who was going to call me right back. Right, I've heard that before. When five o'clock came around I shot off another complaint to the Governor. Last time I e-mailed his office I got nearly instant satisfaction but then that was under a different administration, I just hope this guy kept the same staff as the old guy, they're both Republicans so he may have.

And life goes on...

Jerry 1-22-2003 0:36

Carol, warn me if I'm overloading you right now. I know your husband is going to need special care and cooking. I hope all went well during the operation and he's back with an uncomfortable but whole thumb.

I revised chapter 12-13. Now I have two different versions of chapter 13. Wouldn't you know! There's something bad about 13 no matter how you do it. I wonder if I should just skip that number! Also started chapter 14.

Now, back to grading. Will send the mess Friday if it's not too much for you right now. Can wait as well and just keep adding to 14. Thank you. Wow, I can't even get out of my pajamas it's going so well.

There's nothing like the stimulus of having a deadline that you are supposed to be meeting to make the writing flow.

Everyone: Who has a cat? I have a crazed animal who keeps tearing through all the papers I have carefully placed into piles on the ground. He comes bounding in like a kid jumping into a pile of leaves.

Eddie: Sounds like you turned a terrible thing into a creative way to make others safe. That's how you can really tell a super person, No matter what awful things happen they turn them to good. I'm so sorry you lost your son. I have a twenty-one year old daughter. I'm not sure I'd have your creativity or grace in a similar situation. Thank you for making the world a little safer.

Viv 1-21-2003 23:40

Anyone (JERRY and MARK, for example) who is familiar with the innards of a computer will enjoy this series of real computer repait shop photos:

http://www.shelleyphoto.com/stupid/index.html

It's to chunder!

howard 1-21-2003 22:25

Eddie:

I am truly sorry for your loss, in case you thought I was rambling.

You want to hear something weird? I as just looking at my son's picture today. It was the first time in three years, just today.

The problem I have with loss is I can't process GONE. I just can't get it. Where are they, how are they, who's with them? We were going to do this, we were going to do that. I don't let myself think gone. I still haven't. I'm trying to find a spot for this FACT and there isn't one. I have a spot for the fact my hair is brown and one and one is two, but GONE, nothing. That's truly painful. I think it's part of being human.

Debra 1-21-2003 21:19

Eddie:

I'm so sorry for your loss. I can't imagine how many times you've heard that now. When you have to say it to people and then hear it, you realize it only helps the person who are saying it. I lost a son too. No two losses are the same. The one thing that people kept telling me is time heals all wounds.

That's crap.

I'm sorry but don't belive them when they tell you. The wound is forever, but you will learn to live again. You will learn to laugh again. Belive me that first real laugh you get, will feel so good. It will bring tears to your eyes. The good kind. It will happen. But grief is like a theif in the night. It comes and goes. You'll be doing something so ordinary and it will come crashing back. Sometimes it will come at the worst moment when you need your wits about you.

It's been fifteen years for me and it's still like yesterday. You know why? Love is forever. You loved him.

You will always love him.

Hang in there, you'll get back what you need.

Debra 1-21-2003 20:54

EDDIE,

Your words are no downer for me. They are heartfelt, sad, but very sweet. Michael was a special man indeed as I had known by your previous descriptions of him. I read the article and applaud you and ANITA for going out and fighting to correct a problem area in your community, and I am so glad that you two encountered no opposition. I am very relieved to hear from you actually because you and your family have been very much in my prayers, and I wanted to know how you were doing.

ROSEMARY,

Congratulations on selling your short stories.

JERRY and PAMELA,

Glad to know there is some political discussion left on the Notebook. This is going to surprise the socks off you, JERRY, and those of you all who know me, but I am not going to comment on any of it. In light of EDDIE'S and JACK's concerns, plus HOWARD's heath concerns and your own, JERRY, LITTER's and ROSEMARY's successes plus some of the issues going on in my own life right now, such things just don't seem very important right now.

It is so, so good to see THE OLD MAN again.

There is nothing more fun than meeting another NOTEBOOK member. I once had the pleasure of meeting GOODWEED OF THE NORTH, and we had a wonderful time. Boy, I miss him. I wish I could meet all of you. And if anyone is coming to New Orleans, let me know.

I got to see LOTR for the second time today. I understood it and liked it much better. It was also special because I am reading the books at the moment.

Rhoda 1-21-2003 19:53

Sunny,
Thank you for your kind words.
I would like to tell you a little bit about Michael and how much he meant to me, to Anita and me, but especially to me.
Michael and I had so much in common. We played guitar together, we drank beer together on Friday nights. We even had the same video collection, we would roll about laughing at Red Dwarf or HHGTTG. We shared the same sense of humour. Michael would hug and kiss me in front of his friends. He was not only my son but my best friend. That is the way that I always thought of him before. Now I realise that not only was he my best friend but he was my only friend. There just wasn't the room for any other male companion. Every day I wake to the whole thing over and over again. I don't know when I will be able to shed the nightmare and just get on with life. I am of course, in a small way now, but not as it was, not ever.
There is a huge hole in my heart that will never be filled.
Don't think that I'm trying to put everyone on a downer, I'm not. I love Mike and I always will. I sometimes have to let people know how he was. This is not sentiment through rose coloured specs or anything like that. I know how that goes, this is plain fact, the kind of fact I have had to come to terms with this last month. I know I will survive, I just wish he was here to see me do so.
Excuse me for this brief lapse into self indulgence, but I know that the people here on the notebook are understanding folk and the act of writing this down has been good for me.
Thanks for listening.
Ed

Eddie French 1-21-2003 19:23

Me again. I couldn't resist scanning down a ways, so..

Hi Rosemary! Congrats!
Jack, take care of yourself.
Heather, where do find all your energy? The last 2 months are a blur right now. Do you need anything from me still?

Okay, now I am going to go. My dog - who we deserted at Troy's parents while we were gone - is working on me for a walk and I can't say no.

C-ya.

Tina 1-21-2003 16:01

Hi all!

I'm not even gonna TRY to catch up in here. I just returned from my vacation in Arizona, so I'm dreadfully behind.

Eddie, my belated but sincere condolences. I heard about what happened from Christi last week, and this is the first I've been on the internet since then. I'm at a loss for words, except to send you the strongest (((HUGS))) I can. You are in my thoughts and prayers every day.

As for Christi, I have news that will be no surprise to anyone. SHE ROCKS! Last Wednesday Troy and I had the supreme pleasure of meeting her in person. We had dinner, went to LOTR, we met her family and THEY ROCK too. Her hubby and mine hit it off great - they even look alike! We spent the night, did the touristy thing the next day, and she drove us back to the skydiving resort that night. She is a gorgeous person in every possible way. Thank you Christi!

Our vacation was almost perfect, marred only by a cold virus that made the rounds through the ranks. (Sorry Christi if we gave it to you :o[ Didn't mean to it's all Reid from Alaska's fault) I made 39 skydives from big planes, in the gorgeously warm and sunny Arizona weather (they call that winter?) from 13,000 feet. What a view! We met Christi, ate great Mexican food, and got suntans. Now we are tired but very very satisfied.

I have to go and clean up everything and get ready to go back to work tomorrow, so I'm outta here now. I'll post pics soon as they get developed.
Blue skies.

Tina 1-21-2003 15:48

Greetings and Felicitations,

Randall (and anyone else who cares about their personal security)
As a security professional for many, many years, you can take me at my word that the best you can do to protect yourself is to entice the bad guys away from your property.
"What do you mean, Old Man?"
I mean to say that if they want your particular house, for whatever reason, they will have it. The best you can do is to make your house the one house on the block that a bad guy, randomly choosing a target, will re-think his choice.
It sounds stupid, but what I have and what I recommend is a non-locking door knob.
"What?!"
In addition to the non-locking passage knob or lever you need a DEADBOLT.
"But why not have a locking doorknob AND a deadbolt? Wouldn't that be more secure?"
No...I told you that it sounds stupid, when in reality, a passage knob is more secure. You see, most of us are pretty lazy when it comes to home security and if we have both a deadbolt and a locking knob, on our way out of the house, we just push the button on the knob and leave. Having a passage knob FORCES us to use the deadbolt.
Not only are we using the REAL security of the deadbolt as compared to a cheap hardware-store knob, we also have our keys in hand as we leave...no more lock-outs. Also, you can see from the inside that your bolt is thrown by the position of the thumbturn, you can't typically see if the button on the knob is pushed.
I care about you people, so please make your house just too much trouble for an opportunistic miscreant. When he sees how much time and effort will be needed to break into your house, he will just go next door.

Take care,
T.O.M.

The Old Man 1-21-2003 13:28

Eddie,

I read the article and was deeply touched by what you and Anita did. That's all we can do at times like these -- reach back and help the people that follow. I admire your courage and your heart, and I'm glad to "know" you.

Sunny 1-21-2003 11:42

I meant to include this link earlier
Ed

Eddie French Barrier 1-21-2003 10:59

See what I mean!

Eddie French 1-21-2003 5:58

Excuse the speeling mistakes in my last post.
The head is not up to scratch just now
Ed

Eddie French 1-21-2003 5:57

Hello All,
We just won our fight to have o safety barrier errected at the place where Michael's car left the road on Christmas Day.
To be honest the fight was to easy, I thought it would take a lot longer. Anita and I are trying to get through this thing but it it so hard at times.
I read the notebook every few days and the grand children are a blessing. Cassius is watching intently as I type this message. He is saying I am reading my 'puter,.
I will drop in later.
Ps,
I recieved a copy of 'Debuts' a few days ago. Good to see some more of my work in print.
Ed

Eddie French 1-21-2003 5:55

GENO -- I'll bet you're happy about the Super Bowl.

Mark 1-20-2003 23:07

Howdy-doodly-doo, assembled throng.

Well, it's official – I hate editing. Just finished the final edits (4) for 'The Watchers' – they wanted 1, but I couldn't stop… It's gone back to the publisher for the proofing stage. I sent off my suggestions for the cover as well. Hope they like it, coz I spent ages on it and I was really pleased with the result.

Whilst editing, I came across a few bits that I'd forgotten that I had written. Here is one of my most favourite bits:

'The Texas Militia chose this time of uncertainty to insert a 'Lone Star' suppository in the back passage of the US government…'

Thanks to all who 'booked' a flyer when the book comes out, and my apologies for not replying yet to your e-mails. I've been a tad preoccupied.

Back when I catch up.

Litter 1-20-2003 16:41

GENO -- From the Writers Digest site - (FAQ)www.writersdigest.com :
A query letter or query is a one-page letter to an editor intended to raise interest in an article you propose to write.
Basically, with a query you are attempting to interest an editor in buying your manuscript. In the case of a larger work like a book or screenplay, a query interests an editor in asking for your full book proposal or manuscript. Most editors prefer to be queried instead of receiving the complete manuscript or proposal.

A query should always be one page, single-spaced. It should grab the editor's attention and give the editor some idea of the work's structure and content by quickly explaining your lead and how you intend to develop your article or book. Mention any expertise that qualifies you to write the article or book. End with a direct request to write the article or submit your full proposal or manuscript.

There are hundreds of books that describe query letters and provide examples. You might be interested in the sample queries available in Formatting & Submitting Your Manuscript (Writer's Digest Books).
--Jerry Jackson Jr., assistant editor, Writer's Digest

howard 1-20-2003 16:26

A publisher has asked me to send a "query letter" along with my manuscript. Can someone tell me what that is and what it should contain?
Thanks.
Geno

Geno 1-20-2003 15:56

Jerry - honestly, your spelling is fine when you don't use the spell-check - at least it was in your most recent post (the one about the HP system restore)!
Practice makes perfect, I say. :oD

Viv, I'm going to be as excited as you, setting off fireworks and the whole bit, too!
Look to the West at the same time I'm looking East, and we just might see a little whooooomp! LOL

Randall - thank you! I needed that story so I can save it to disk. I now remember what happened - I ran out of disk space and was planning to save the remaining two or so stories that wouldn't fit as soon as I bought a new pack of diskettes.... and then kabllllooooey. Hard drive goes berzerk. I just may have The Patron on CDRom anyway, but this saves me looking through 50 of them for it. Thank you!

Carol - email me a copy of Grandma Rose if you can! Thanks!
(Same reason as above):oP

Well, back into the grind I go, friends; with all this grinding going on you'd think a decent cup of coffee would be in the works! Do I hear the gurgle and drip of my coffee maker, or is that someone's stomach?

The snow just keeps falling, and I just keep trudging out to shovel it. Now I am wondering if perhaps the reason my driveway-side garden isn't doing as well as it should might be because of the salt I scatter onto the drive, and then surruptitiously shovel right onto the garden. There's nowhere else to put the snow from the top portion of the driveway - our driveway is right next to the neighbour's on the left side of us, and in front is the deck, which also gets shovelled (ha ha ha...sometimes) so onto the garden next to the house it goes.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. No wonder my irises and tulips and roses look so bedraggled come growing season!
Anyone know of anything I can use on the soil to treat it for salt invasion?
I'm not sure I've got the energy to drag the snow down to the bottom of the driveway every time I shovel. (Pant pant)
Ooooooh, a snowblower for Valentine's Day would be great! Hinty hint...LOL

Ooooops, yes, the grind. I remember.

P.S. Americo! Where art thou, Americo?

Heather 1-20-2003 9:50

Heather: I'm one of the new writers who is going to be jumping up and down at a first story published. I will be shooting off fireworks so please look toward the East at dawn your time the day you say this book is published. W