Archived Messages from September 19, 1999 to October 2, 1999

Rachel Sat Oct 2 21:18:20 PDT 1999

Hi all

Allein - Wonderful little cakes! They are so yummy I could melt when I even look at them. I only pick them up a couple of times a year. I like to keep them for a very special sort of treat. Truth be told I had some just a couple of months ago, my girlfriends treat. She knows how much I love them and made a trip into town to get them for me. I thought that was soooooo sweet of her. I did get your e-mail and will write back to yah this weekend. I have some more writing I really want to get done. I have been doing so much writing lately! Hockey season is great! It gets me a couple of evening hours when nobody minds if I go to work on my writing! I welcome hockey season with open arms!

Take care all

Allein Sat Oct 2 19:51:31 PDT 1999

Rachel - Coolness. What kind of treats do they sell? I sent you an e-mail.

Shelley Sat Oct 2 17:18:04 PDT 1999

Thanks to all for the warm welcome! I think I'm going to enjoy my time here!!!

Do any of you know anything about online writing courses? (preferably free) :-)

Rachel Sat Oct 2 16:31:47 PDT 1999

Hi all

Wow! My server has been messed up in a big way for the last couple of days and I have not been able to get into anything, well aside from my e-mail.

Toster - Welcome.

Americo, I like that "I think every day" Yup, that is good.

Allein - It is going to be so nice to meet up with you. I will be sure to bring lots of fun treats from that bakery. I hope you like the stuff. It's not your everyday sort of goodies, but it is very nice (smiles).

Take care all

Allein Sat Oct 2 15:04:47 PDT 1999

Hey people. I haven't been feeling so good lately, so, I haven't posted any funnies here lately, but here's one I just got in an e-mail. :)

Top 10 Signs Your Not In College Anymore
10. Beers at lunch get you reprimanded.
9. College sweatshirts are 'casual' instead of dress-up.
8. The 4 food groups are no longer beer, pizza, ramen and cereal.
7. Three Words: School Loan Payments.
6. Sneakers are now 'weekend shoes'.
5. Jack and Cokes become Dewers on the Rocks.
4. You empathize with the characters from 'Friends'.
3. Wine appreciation expands beyond Boone's and Mad Dog.
2. You actually eat breakfast foods at breakfast time.
And the Number 1 Sign Your Not In College Anymore
At 6am you're waking up instead of going to bed.

Allein Sat Oct 2 13:28:51 PDT 1999

Toaster - Welcome. I hope you stick around. :)

Rachel - One more week till you come to see me. :D YAY!!! I can hardly wait.


Toster Sat Oct 2 11:40:05 PDT 1999

Hello all. I"m new here so if someone will be kind to help me, I'd like to meet yo all :-)

Americo Sat Oct 2 04:52:19 PDT 1999

Good morning everybody!

Jon, mind your language, will you? The word is not nisep but lingam. The feminine correspondent is not nina, as you have in your dictionary, but yony. Consult The Kama Sutra if you do not believe.

On writing times: When people asked the great Vergílio Ferreira if he wrote every day he used to answer: "No, but I think everyday."

Jon (just a cat) Sat Oct 2 04:46:50 PDT 1999

I am sort of like rather busy but wanted to post a good morning from Americo, just to keep the notebook in motion again.

I am writing my Dictionary of CatsEnglish and Americo promised to write a preface for it. I am so happy! He is called the man with the golden heart in Europe and Asia (here he is just the man with the iron nisep).

Kisses from Pussy

Jerry Lee Fri Oct 1 17:17:00 PDT 1999

Yo, all.

Kat, try this site, it has lots of quotes arranged in catagories.

Take Care, all!
Jerry Lee

The Old Man Fri Oct 1 15:33:34 PDT 1999

Greetings and felicitations,

I imagine every new name that I read on these pages is, in fact, a new name. My sin is not having been around long enough to have learned all that someone of more experience knows as a matter of fact. Forgive my ignorance of thinking that Philip was a new name here. I guess I should have said, "Welcome back."
I am honestly impressed by the publishing of your books. I recognise experience when I see it.
I must say that I appreciate the respect you have shown in pointing this out to me and making my resolve to be published all the stronger. I am grateful for the words of wisdom.

Time is an interesting thing, you only have enough when you don't need it. But then, we can all try, can't we?


Martin Fri Oct 1 13:20:39 PDT 1999

Die Blechtrommel

Günter Grass

Jack Beslanwitch Thu Sep 30 23:20:02 PDT 1999

Spent a good chuck of the day at my local computer outfitter. Still no joy, but we think we have narrowed things down to the multiple processor mother board. Grumbble. Oh, well, hopefully I'll have my screaming machine before this week is out.

Philip: Glad to see you are making appearances on the Notebook again. I truly enjoyed the stay and hope you get the books I sent you today.

Hayden: If I did not say so before, sorry I missed you at Worldcon and sorry we did not link up while Fran and I were there. Rest assurred, finances permitting, we will be back to Australia again sometime in the future.

I am discovering that my swimming skills leave something to be desired. This is troubling given that I want to be able to present the minimum skills for starting scuba lessons by January. Perseverence I guess and realizing that it has been all of 30 years since I swam regularly. Maybe playing the didge will improve that as well.

And I am beginning to write daily. Not what I originally had in mind, but beginning. Australia seems to dominate my thoughts and reflections these days and some ideas for an Aboriginal based story have surfaced and are thumping around in my unconscious. I think I will let those thoughts simmer and see where they pop out. Take care everyone.

Rhoda Thu Sep 30 19:30:04 PDT 1999


I got your e-mail. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to properly open the attachment. You could try Rich Text Format. Either way, it did come with the e-mail and I can work with it.

Incidently, I will drop the name of Zoe. I will take a name akin to my real one.


My cat Buttons read your last couple of posts. He thinks you are not a nice cat (then again Buttons never met another cat he liked). Buttons does not understand how anyone can be so cruel to Americo. Buttons asked me to tell you next time I posted to "hiss off."

I didn't say this, Jon. My cat did.


philip Thu Sep 30 18:59:49 PDT 1999


Thank you for your welcome Old man. I've actually posted here hundreds of times over the years.

(cut - paste)

"Few of us are full-time writers. There may be exceptions, but we are, by and large, akin to the Hollywood waitresses; "I'm really an actress, I just do this to pay the bills." I do what I do to pay the bills ... etc


I see this as a tired, hackneyed apology for not being successful. We can all make time to write ... if we really want to. There are so many posers who claim to be writers because it impresses people (they usually produce nothing). To me they are even worse than writers with great potential who procrastinate.

The key is ... be truthful and honest to yourself.

I don't think you have to starve in order to produce your art but you can make a little time to write ... if you're honest.

Most people are able to produce 500 words every day (about one or two hours). If we say 80,000 words is what publishers require as a full length work then in 320 hours (maximum) you'll produce the work. Let's be honest with ourselves first. You don't have to waste a lifetime waiting on tables to find out if you are any good as a writer. And you don't have to feebly apologise that you have to earn a living and can't find time to write.

I simply don't believe it.


Americo Thu Sep 30 18:38:14 PDT 1999

Oops, so many misprints. Too many to be corrected. Sorry folks.

Good night, all!

Americo Thu Sep 30 18:36:18 PDT 1999

Rhoda: I have sent you your first chapter for your expert considerations and very very final version. Leu us know you got it.

Rachel: I am glad your dog was rescued from the devilih charm of that awful cat. Cats are terrible beings. SOME of them are even worse than some humans. I know at least a cat who is worse than... well, this is a decent place, I will shut up. And goodnight, Jon. I wish you sleep terribly. No, not really. I almost love you. You will have another change some time in the near future. Finish your Dictionary of CatsEnglish before you can even dream of becoming a S*man, I mean a S*cat.

Jon Thu Sep 30 18:29:23 PDT 1999

But, Allein, he has given Xavier and Avatar and Jack an opportunity to collaborate in the final version of S* — beyond all deadlines, something I would never do if I were what he has also pilfered from me: the position of general in chief editor of the book — and he is praying every day that those real friends of his send him their texts ... And he did not do the same for me! He hates me. I love him. But he hates me. Everybody hates me. I am so hated.

Allein Thu Sep 30 18:21:15 PDT 1999

Jon - Come here kitty. *gives Jon a nice scratch behind the ears* You know you don't hate Americo - no one can hate him, it's just not possible. He's so sweet. Good kitty.

Rosemary Thu Sep 30 18:07:29 PDT 1999

Greetings Everyone,
Big day for me. I have a friends manuscript that had been entered on an old wordprocessor. It must be made pc compatible and I have been typing it for her. Recently I purchased a new 3 in 1 printer. I have so far used the print, copy and fax facilities. After typing 160 grinding pages, I realized that my machine scans. It has been fun learning how to scan the pages in, have them wind up in Wordperfect, and edit the notations. Especially since I seem to have misplaced the book that tells me how to do this stuff and the help section never answers my questions.

Parts of San Antonio got rain a few days ago, but not my side of town. We are beginning to be crispy and it will be a mean fall if we don't get rain soon. S. A. is also on an aquafer (sp?) and we often have problems with the water supply. The environmental people went to court and pumping is not allowed to go below a certain level because of a minnow and a rice plant.

It's good to hear from you again. Things are always more lively with you around. (more informative too.)


Jon Thu Sep 30 14:42:50 PDT 1999

Americo : this is the first time I address my meows to you on this notebook. Just to say how I hate you. I...I... well, good night.

Pussy sends kisses to everybody. She also hates Americo. Everybody in town hates Americo. You should also hate (well, now I am crying!)

Your faithful servant

Americo Thu Sep 30 14:39:20 PDT 1999

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen!

A quick note to inform you (in case you do not know yet) that the German writer Gunter Grass was awarded the Nobel Prize, thus succeeding in the thorone to the Portuguese José Saramago (who otherwise had proposed the German for the Prize).

I wonder whether Grass will propose me (or Jon) for the Nobel Prize of the coming year. Yikes!

I do not think I would find the time now to go to Stocholm and get it. Not with this pink eye who hardly lets me read your beautiful words on the notebook.

By Gunter Grass I read "Die Trommel" and two or three other novels. Powerful writer (a bit boring too).

Jon : I refuse to answer your latest post.

Arik Thu Sep 30 13:20:46 PDT 1999

what wrong with you guys... moo!

avatar... are you ok???

Arik Thu Sep 30 13:00:45 PDT 1999

Moo everyone!

Rhoda Thu Sep 30 07:24:30 PDT 1999


Please, don't leave. I have been trying feverishly for five years to be published. Writing is great, and I would do it whether or not I was published, but what fun is it without an audience?

If there is not any room for a published author on this board, then it is certainly not the place for me.

But I know that there are many here like myself who wish to be something more than they are and who wish to learn. The published authors such as yourself, Hayden and Americo and others who have come and gone are indispensable to the Notebook.


Welcome to the Notebook.


I usually write my books without substantial editing initially. The problem is that when you finally finish the book, there are things you wish to change and then you are forced to rewrite certain parts of the book anyway. If I try to perfect chapters as I go along, I find I can never make them perfect enough and then I get stuck. Also knowing that I have the option at the end to remove scenes that don't work or are not needed gives me the freedom to experiment as I write that first draft.

The first draft is only the beginning. The book is not really finished until you go through several times to tweak the writing and the details. Actually I find this rewriting and editing process just as creative and enjoyable as writing the original draft. After about three or four rewrites do I find that I have a book worth marketing. That might not be every writer's experience, but I have talked to other published writers who basically say the same. You can never polish enough, espacially if you are unpublished.

For the first time in a week, I sent all three of my kids to school on the same day. Between the viral thing and the throat infections, I thought I would go crazy. I wish they could wear space suits to school.

Happy Writing!


Katarina Thu Sep 30 05:58:47 PDT 1999

Hey, T.O.M. - Isn't that what being able to write is all about? We don't have the ability to have personal contact, but we certainly have the ability to make each other feel, through our words.

Philip - Please don't disappear into Cyberspace...we need learned folks like you to teach us more about writing!

Hi, Shelly. Nice to meet you. Hope you enjoy the Notebook. These are some of the nicest, most creative and intellectual folks you will converse with on the Net.



P.S. I am still looking for quotes, etc. about people who take advantage of others, for a project that I am working on :) Thanks

P.S.S. Rosemary...are you out there? We finally got rain yesterday after being parched for months! The poor flora here is brown and crunchy. How are things in Texas?

Dan Wed Sep 29 23:30:51 PDT 1999

Hi all!

First to Shelley, as a new addition myself, I'd like to say ‘hi'! Next to Philip, yes I believe you are the one I was referring to, and to have a published one among us is great! I only hope you don't mind if I reach out for help sometime in the future. To everyone else a big ‘hello'. I hope everything is fine. I need to get to writing before I hit the couch, it's 2am. Well night all, or morning.


The Old Man Wed Sep 29 19:07:19 PDT 1999

Ladies and gentlemen,

A grand welcome to Philip, I just re-read my last post in which I mentioned the possibility of a published author hiding among us wanna-bes. There was nothing volitile meant by my meager words. I only meant to express to Dan that the advise he recieves here in this forum is not necessarily only from unread writers like myself. There may well be a true voice of experience among the voices here.
Again I curse the lack of personal contact on this electronic frontier. The lack of which leads to misunderstanding.


Rachel Wed Sep 29 18:15:36 PDT 1999

Hi Shelley - Welcome.

Allein Wed Sep 29 18:09:59 PDT 1999

Hi Shelley, my name is Allein and I'm a write-a-holic. The last thing I wrote was this afternoon - a sonnet entitled "Death to Pikachu".
Anyway...hi and welcome. I'm the person who gives out hugs and funnies. I can't really help you with what you want help with, but I'm always looking to make new friends. :) I mainly write poetry and fantasy stories, which you can check out on my webpage if you like, but I warn thee - if you enter my domain and there is no message in my guestbook, I shall send a rampant sqrlmunk after you...what! No! Don't send me back! I don't want to go to that padded room again!
I hate it there, the only people I have to talk to are the voices in my head - Fred, gets kinda lonely.
I hope you realize I'm joking. I'm not really too crazy. :) I am a nice person though, and you seem nice too, so, if you want to chat or something, my e-mail address is up above.
Bye for now,

Shelley Wed Sep 29 17:13:23 PDT 1999

Hello to all,
My name is Shelley and this is my first time posting on this site. I came to this site in hopes that I could get advice from more experienced writers and publishers on writing my own newsletter and e-book (eventually). I have always loved to write and have now decided to follow my dream! Can anybody offer any advice on where to start? Thanks in advance. :-)

S.K.S. Perry Wed Sep 29 16:55:00 PDT 1999

Hey all,

Philip, it's great to have a pro here. I can't imagine why any aspiring writer would object. I only dream of the day when I can make my living writing.

To that end I'm going to a SF Writer's Convention in Columbus, Ohio on the 8th of October. According to other published authors I've talked with, there's nothing like meeting writers, editors and publishers face to face (and making a good impression) to help get your foot in the door.

Be Well, Live Well.

Rachel Wed Sep 29 16:06:35 PDT 1999

Hi Philip - Gezz, I hope you don't vanish. It's nice to have lots of different people around, besides (grins) I think I would miss yah. I'm sure that Jack would. I say stick around, or at least lurk.
I think its great that your published. I figure that is the goal of pretty much everyone here. I don't want to see you cut down. I hope that you flourish. I really do. I of course also hope that I fourish (more grins).
Oh, and you are not the only published writer, they could have been talking to one of several people.
I say don't sweat it and stick around (a big hug to you)
Take care you

Americo - I found my dog! She was at the pound. Apparently my pup almost drowned while chasing a cat! The kittiy in question seemed to be quite smart, ran towards a pool and then used her kitty reflexes to stop, my poor pup shot right on into the pool and got caught up under the pool cover! The people inside their house saw it all happen and rushed to my poor pups aide, but were not able to get her out before she was pretty much drowned. She spent the night in the pound and I went and got her about lunch time. Now my pup is going to be under house arrest until I find the hole in the fence!

Take care all

philip Wed Sep 29 15:46:53 PDT 1999


I believe I'm the published author Dan and The Old Man are referring to who visits these pages. You know it's strange isn't it? Some people want to learn how others have achieved their goals with a view to improving their lot. Presumably, as writers, we all want to be published and published again and hopefully make a living from our art. I can tell you as soon as that happens, as soon as you rise above a certain level in your corner of society, there are those that want to haul you down. In Australia we call this phenomena the 'tall poppy syndrome'.

I don't care. I won't hide. You know who I am. I have no nickname or pen name. This is me and I write what I want to write and I'm not sorry.

Hey, there is nothing wrong with being a published writer or writing full time. Most full time authors are not 'rich and famous' but there is that satisfaction that you are working at something you really enjoy (and used to do for nothing). You get invited to international literary festivals and meet other authors some of whom are extremely rich and famous and you become friends and offer each other advice. You're followed by your own groupies (yes - more on that later) and the media want to know what you think about, from famine to war, racism to law and more.

So I'm here for now, but if that makes some of you uncomfortable, I'll simply vanish. Cyberspace is an agreeable place in which to be exiled.


Katarina Wed Sep 29 11:08:07 PDT 1999

Hi everyone:

Strange request time:

Does anyone have any good quotes regarding people who use other people, or people that take advantage of friendships, etc.? I need this for a project.



Dan Wed Sep 29 11:05:20 PDT 1999

S.K.S. Perry,

I totally agree with the ‘stories surprising me' part. At times it's eerie how well the pieces of my ideas fit together. For example: My project right now started as only one novel back in high school. Good vs. evil with several ‘grey' areas and in the end the good guys win...sorta. Bla, bla. Well it was the original plan to make a trilogy out of it, and my second book was jumping ahead about 20 or so of my world's years. All the little nuances seemed to flow together so nicely, it scarred me! Often I doubt my skills as a writer, but I have never doubted my creation as a whole, the world and its peoples. I just wanted to say how true it is. I've been fond of saying to people that I'm just a explorer there, discovering as I go.

I too write sequentially, but with my new style I've adopted I could see myself jumping ahead. See my first draft was a one book project I've decided to expand to several. The reason this is possible is due to the fat I lacked so much description in the first it felt like reading a 400 page summery! I've taken a cue from Jordan and others to take time and describe the little things that make a world so alive. It is a challenge, and where the previous draft was mainly dialog driven, I'm leaning heavily towards internal thought, individual points of view, and heavy description with some minor narration to propel the story and pull the reader in. I suppose if you count the fact that I'm constantly sketching designs for everything from clothes to cities and creating my world's history, which spans back well over 20,000 of its years, I do work on several projects at a time. I find my old way of creating several stories at once in my head and on paper coming back.

Like I said in my post, I find it easier to edit as I go. I guess others do to, I tried the all-inclusive final draft, and have inserted notes when needed, but if I don;t write it then, I will forget. It really feels like a homework assignment at times when I have to spend ten minutes just searching through piles of my notes and descriptions for the spelling of a particular mountain range, or the date a event happened. I think that more then any other reason forces me to simultaneously edit and write. My world has evolved so much that I could probably just put out a compendium now and sell the books as a afterthought!

Well thanks a bunch, it does help! And again I'm beyond thrilled to be getting feedback from fellow writers! I'm in such a inspiration now, I'm scarred it might just leave me at any moment, but I don't think it will. I work today, in about a hour and a half, and wont be back till tomorrow morning at 2:30am at the earliest, but I suppose this counts towards my 500+ per day. (Besides I count ‘today' as being the 29th until I go to bed tomorrow, force of habit from work!) Ok, ok, I gotta split. S.S.K. Perry, thanks again, have a great day all!!


Jon Wed Sep 29 09:09:31 PDT 1999

People! Did you know that Americo is known is all Lisbon as "the iron heart man"?

And I suspect he is a catibal (kind of canibal but even worse). At least Pussy, my wife, told me one day that the neighbor looked at her as if he wanted to eat her.

Pussy is a beautiful animal and a bit sort of like, well you know. I am not quite sure about what she meant with the neighbor looking at her as if he wanted to eat her. I only know I did not like it at all. And I told him that. That's why, in my opinion, he kicked me out of "S".

I hate him.

Americo Wed Sep 29 09:03:52 PDT 1999

I am sort of like a little busy and just wanted to say

good morning, everybody!

PS. I am of the opinion that Jon is not the cat of Mephistopheles but Mephistopheles himself! That cat has no soul. Absolutely!

S.K.S. Perry Wed Sep 29 06:25:01 PDT 1999

Oops, sorry. That last post was from me.

Wed Sep 29 06:23:51 PDT 1999

Hey all,

Dan, I pretty much write on the fly, with only the skimpiest outline. I usually have only a basic idea of where the story is going, or even who the charactes are until I write them. I'm as surprised by my stories as anyone. I think it was Robert E. Howard who said that it felt like someone was dictating his stories to him. I have that same feeling. (No, I don't hear voices--well, at least not useful ones :-))

I usually write my chapters sequentially. I know there are writers who, when they get stuck at a certain point, jump ahead and come back to the sticking point later, but I don't seem to be able to do that. I do a rough edit as I write, mostly for clarity, spelling, grammar--that sort of thing. If in a later chapter I think of something or include something that I think should be set up earlier, I'll go back to an earlier chapter where the information fits naturally and include it. I found the best way to actually complete a story was to just keep writing, and save the major edits for when after the first draft was finished. I usually just leave myself little notes like: "You have to explain why Josh treats Leanne this way earlier on," or "It might be a good idea to go back and foreshadow this event." If I constantly edited and re-edited, as many people do, I would never get anything finished.

Once finished, I do the major edit. I'm also lucky enough to have a few good friends whose opinion I trust that read over my stuff and help me out.

Finally, I used to only work on one project at a time, but lately have taken to working on mulitiple works. That way when a storyline is giving me writer's block, I can move on to another story until the block clears.

Hope this helps.

Be Well, Live Well.

Dan Tue Sep 28 21:37:52 PDT 1999

The Old Man,

I didn't mean to say there was anything other then real people...sorry if it came off that way. I just noticed that at least ONE person in the bio section has his work in print and was refering to that.

As for myself, I too have a job to pay bills. It's 3pm to 3am and leaves me the quiet of night to write, and three days off a week. Thank you for your insights, it's just nice to know how my fellow artist 'work it'. Thanks!


The Old Man Tue Sep 28 20:37:34 PDT 1999

Good evening to you all,

Few of us are full-time writers. There may be exceptions, but we are, by and large, akin to the Hollywood waitresses; "I'm really an actress, I just do this to pay the bills."
I do what I do to pay the bills, and it leaves precious little time for writing (my true avocation).
As far as writing habits, I play a game of catch-as-catch-can. There are no hours in my day devoted to art. But there is scarcely a minute that goes by that I don't have a character point or plot twist nibbling away on my concentration. In point of fact, it is the mundane chores that busy my hands that allow my mind to race free.
I write when I can, I think when I shouldn't and somehow, they come together with a strength of will that allow me time at the keyboard to pass along the things that drift to me from the ether.
It may well be that some famous, rich and full-time writer inhabits the Notebook under an assumed name, but I believe most of us are regular people with a passion to teach in the slowest and least likely way possible.


Dan Tue Sep 28 19:48:43 PDT 1999

I have a request...

I'd like to know what everyone's 'writing habits' are. When tackling a epic project how do you attack? I have discarded my old regiment in favor of a section by section plan. I write each chapter or scene and then go over it again and again till I'm satisfied. This seems to work for me since my old way left me with over 150,000 words and NO editing! A true nightmare. Now I have a, I would like to believe, well fleshed out prologue and first chapter with two scenes in it all totaling around 7000 words. Anyhow I would love to hear how everyone else goes about this and your opinions on my new approach! I'm especial curious about everyone who has been kind enough to respond to me (Allein, Rhoda, Americo, The Old Man...and everyone else.) Thanks, I await your replies and ideas.

-Allein: Just wanted to say how much I have enjoyed your funnies! I plan on going into the archive to sample the missed ones.

-To everyone: Just wanted to say, I know I've been posting a lot, but you all need to understand how much this means to me, to write again! Yes I still get hit with strong doubts in my work, but I think it stems from the fact I've never really sought others opinions. (I'm not to hot with rejection, and I know, I need to get over it to be in this business!) Anyway, I'm trying to say thanks again in a long fashion so...



Americo Tue Sep 28 19:18:05 PDT 1999

Gary: I read your post again and I have this unpleasant feeling that I misinterpreted it somehow. Sorry, friend. Do not give my own post after yours a second thought, please.

Rhoda: I knew you would not let us down. I have just finished chapter 3 and the novel is going to be great. I will contact you when it will be your turn to have a look at your texts on the light of the final version. Rachel has been a wonderful co-editor and she is a great writer and a splendid source of inspiration for all of us. You will see that the magnificent four will make a great team.

I said four because how could we do without Allein? No way. Do not worry about the 25,000 words. We will help one another!

Xavier. I did not get your e-mail. Did you get mine, sent three or four days ago? No bad feelings of course.

Avatar: I have the impression that you have resigned. I will read your e-mail (just arrived) after this post. If you resign, never mind. You will give us the pleasure of your collaboration in the next project. A kiss to you.

Allein Tue Sep 28 18:41:28 PDT 1999

More of Allein's unoriginal funnies:

Adam was walking around the garden of Eden feeling very lonely, so God asked him, "What is wrong with you?"
Adam said he didn't have anyone to talk to.
God said that He was going to make Adam a companion and thatit would be a woman.
He said, "This person will gather food for you, cook for you, and when you discover clothing she'll wash it for you.
She will always agree with every decision you make.
She will bear your children and never ask you to get up
in the middle of the night to take care of them.
She will not nag you and will always be the first to admit
she was wrong when you've had a disagreement.
She will never have a headache and will freely give you
love and passion whenever you need it.
Adam asked God, "What will a woman like this cost?"
God replied, "An arm and a leg."Then Adam asked, "What can I get for a rib?"
The rest is history....

Okay, just one funnie today. :)

Allein Tue Sep 28 18:35:22 PDT 1999

Americo - YIKES!! 25,000 words. I'm not sure I can do that. My current novel is 30,000 something and that's 60 pages. As I said before, all of my funnies come through e-mail, none are original. I will try my best, but unfortunately, with school and everything (this does include my social life - that's very important to me), I'm not sure I'll be able to do it. I can't cut back on school - wish I could, but unfortunately, that's not an option - but I will try to cut back on "everything" - that's TV, social life, etc.. and then, there's my limited computer time, I get 2 hours on weekends, but weekends are the only time I get a break from school to do chores and then fun things (this weekend for instance, I'm getting Rachel a birthday card - a real one, not like the digital ones I sent her and the weekend after that, I prepare for her arrival YAY!!!!) So, like I said, I will try, but I can't make any gurantees.
(((BIG HUGS)))

Rachel Tue Sep 28 18:28:16 PDT 1999

Hi Avatar - Thanks for the birthday greetings :) I wish you all the best with your ongoing writing projects.
Take care you

michelle Tue Sep 28 16:31:48 PDT 1999

I am currently re-reading Oedipus Rex (also known as Oedipus the King) and came to a new conclusion that Tieresias, the blind prophet, is part of the archtype for innocence. In 20th century literature the innocent is someone who has access to the truth, who is missing a mental filter that would normally do away with essential knowledge that everyday people ignore, are often children. In Oedipus Rex, Tieresias' blindness represents his lack of a visual filter, he is able to see the past and future because of his limitation, and is somewhat of the innocent. He lacks sight and is not exposed to many things that obscure the beliefs or lives of the sighted.

Does anyone agree or have insight on this? I am thinking of possibly expanding into an essay comparing Tieresias to the arctypical innocent in literature and modern movies. Please E mail me with your thoughts/opinions!

Avatar Tue Sep 28 15:57:29 PDT 1999

Jack- MZB is dead?! (I'm going to cry now)


Philip- I am an off and on writer who is currently working on two projects with the same characters, one with two friends and one by myself. I struggle to write a page a day due to my own current laziness, but know that I can if ever given the prodding.

Americo- I sent forth a reply to being cut from S' in an e-mail. I hope you get it and I hope you'll read it. For now, know that it was only my own unfortunate struggle to get time in throughout that led to my withdrawal. For now, know that I bear you no ill feelings and hope to see the Son of Shadows up and running sometime soon.

Xavier- My sister was in an almost fatal car crash one year and one month ago. I'm glad you're still here and living. Way to go bro'.

Tim- It's good work for a good cause. Don't ever let anyone talk you out of writing that book.

Arik and Dan- Thank you both for coming and adding yourselves to the notebook. You both create something good with it.

Rachel- Happy belated birthday (did that come out right?). Be secure in the knowledge that you will always write more than me. And that I did not stop shadows without good cause.

Sorry everyone. I am just a tad bit depressed right now. Life has not been going too good lately. I wish I could write another letter to all of you, as I did Americo, saying how much you have meant to me. I can't, so I will say this- You all have been like a second family to me. And I hope will be in the future.

Later all

The Old Man Tue Sep 28 15:06:18 PDT 1999

Greetings and felicitations,

On the subject of research; Please ask an old person.
The old people in your sphere may not have sailed ships, but they may well have sat at their Grandfather's knee listening to stories from the one who did.
You must trust me when I tell you that almost any old person is more than willing to tell you or anyone the stories and experiences they learned in long lifetimes.
Do not overlook the value of the aged. They learned things in their lifetimes that we can scarce imagine.
Ask a relative or friend you already know. If they don't have answers to your queries, there is a good chance that they know someone in THEIR sphere that knows all about it.


Dan Tue Sep 28 13:11:59 PDT 1999

Hi all,

I just remembered something I've been meaning to ask, and since we have published writers who frequent the board...well here goes.

Should you copywrite your material prior to sending it in for submision? This is bypassing the question fo exactly HOW to send your manuscript off (I'll wait till it's finished for that one) but I've recived varying opinions on this matter. I'm sure I'm not alone in the 'Someone will steal my ideads' paranoia that affects soemtimes and I would also like to know that my work is safeguarded.

As always any responces are welcome. Thanks!

-Dan (Aphro says "meow" to everyone)

Tue Sep 28 12:35:55 PDT 1999


Thanks for the info! I'll try my best to act on it. Great news all, my loved cat, Aphro, was just returned to me! It was his running away that got me back in front of the computer and I'm glad I didn't have to loose him in trade for a awakening of my art. Anyhow I'm going to stick to the advice I've been given, 500 words a least. So far in two days I've writen 6500 words of new material, revamped old shit. My work was begun in high school and looking back on it I see several flaws, no offence Allein ;). I've been so inspired by the works of Robert Jordan that I hope to one day come close to his great tallent with the written word.

Again thanks everyone, I love this little place of kindered spirts where I can come and draw insperation. I feel so welcomed and happy to be among you all. I hope your day has a wonderful suprise in it like mine has.


Rhoda Tue Sep 28 12:00:07 PDT 1999


As Philip said, your local library is the best place to start for research. I do have a few ideas. For technology and life-style issues such as food, clothing, housing, etc. a great source is the juvenile section. Children's books use more pictures and tend to concentrate on that stuff more than adult books do. Another trick I often do is I search internet bookstores such as and Barnes and Noble. Each of these stores has a subject search. I go through the searches and jot down anything that strikes my fancy and then I try to get the book on Interlibrary loan. Unfortunately the library where I live does not like to search outside of the local North Texas network, but when I lived in New Mexico I could get about any book I wanted.

Writer's Digest has a group of books out called THE WRITER'S GUIDE TO EVERYDAY LIFE IN---, the 1800's, the middle ages, Victorian and Regency England, etc. These are helpful to some extent. Also if you find some Internet sites dealing with a particular subject, there might be a bibliography. I have done Internet research on Viking Ships, and there is much information about them, so I have no doubt you can find out what you need about sailing. After finding your sources, be sure to confirm them espacially if your information comes from the Internet. There is a lot of WRONG information on the web. Don't forget anyone can put up a web page and essentially say anything on it true or false.

Another great source I have recently discovered is museums. Even if you do not live in a community that has a museum dealing with your subject matter, many museums have web-sites. Some of these web-sites lists books found in the museum bookstores. These are espacially helpful if you are setting your book in a community far away from your own. These bookstores are treasure troves of local history. Many of the books are self-published by local historians and experts. Also the curators of these museums are very knowledgable and are almost always willing to help. I wanted to find out information on Stockton, so I found the site of the local museum and ended up ordering four books. I also found the site of the San Francisco Museum and found loads of information on the history of California complete with Internet links and an extensive bibliography.


Yes! Yes! Yes! I am still with Shadows. Ask what you will. I will do it. I am in this project through the duration. By the way, I type 80 words per minute, not as fact as Rachel, but not bad really.


As you probably know, I have written two Dark Age novels dealing with the world of Arthur. I haven't been able to sell my second one, though I am still working on it. My current project is a historical western. It is a romance between a Californian Ranchero and the the widow of the squatter who stole some of his land. It takes place during the California Gold Rush. I am still trying to figure out exactly where in California to set the story.


Glad to know your spirits are better. I am grateful for all the work you have done on Shadows, and I am glad you are firmly committed to the project. It is truely a pleasure working with you.

Happy Writing, All


Rachel Tue Sep 28 11:44:20 PDT 1999


Hi you (smiles) 25,000 words is no problem. I am ready, willing and able to pounce on this project. I'll get to work on it at once, well not quite at once. My friend is going to show up any minute to take me out for lunch (yum, yum, yummy)!

Larry - Are you still out there?

Rhoda - Hey you, how's it going. How are the kiddies?

Take care all

Americo (with Jon surrepticiously) Tue Sep 28 10:45:50 PDT 1999

Good morning, everybody!

I see that this notebook is again alive and kicking in all directions, as befits writers of different genres and backgrounds. I am all for difference and I salute all the good-willing and intelligent people of this football called Earth.

Gary: I had a quick look at one of your posts. Do not be silly about the maternal thing, please, and try to avoid messages such as the one you addressed to me about chocolates, cars and the rest. I like you too much to answer it adequately. Well, a hug for you, this time, but try to do better justice to yourself. Have you ever read Eça de Queiroz? Read him, and try to find the meaning of "Gouvarinhadas". I repeat the hug and I can even add an emoticon. Just as a proof of good will and wish for peace.

Now, how can I make the promised emoticon? Here you are: : —) (Three keys when a simple ... or — convey the same meaning? Na, Internetese is not good, a waste of time, I guess)

Allein: now that we are just four (I hope Rhoda sticks to our "S" project) we are going to need to write more than the 6,000 words. We need something like an average of 25,000 words each. Considering that you are the youngest writer among us, I thought that perhaps you could make a selection of your best ORIGINAL funnies and MAYBE one of us could make something out of them for the novel. They must be original (never mind if they were already published here: no one reads the notebook except me :—)

I laughed a lot with that one of the young priest who had to drink vodka to preach his sermon. I told that joke to many people here but I always forgot some of the bishop's recommendations. So usually people would finish laughing at my attempt to tell the story.

I hope the idea of having to write around c. 25,000 words does not frighten any of the final co-authors. If it does, just tell me...
(People: mind the three dots and its terrible meaning in Americo's last sentence! That man has no soul. He is a cousin once removed of Mephistopheles— JON, the cat, surrepticiously)

Rachel Tue Sep 28 09:47:40 PDT 1999

Thanks SKS

S.K.S. Perry Tue Sep 28 07:20:13 PDT 1999

Hey all,

Philip, Unfortunately, I haven't been published yet, but I'm working on it. I workshop some of my stuff at the Del Rey online Workshop, and a sample chapter from the military space opera won runners up for the Del Rey Editor's Choice, while a sample chapter from the urban fantasy actually won editor's choice. They're dubious honours, but it does tell me that professionl editors and publishers think I have talent. My biggest problem is learning the business end of writing - the query letters, synopsis, agents etc. Writing is easy (relatively), getting my stuff read is another story.

Allein, I very much enjoy your "funnies." Thanks for brightening my day with them.

Jack, sorry to hear about MZB. I thoroughly enjoyed Mists of Avalon. As I understand it, her guidelines for publishing stories in her magazine were very strict. On the other hand, as long as you stuck to those guidelines, she didn't care whether you were an established writer or not, she'd publish you if your writing was good. I hope there is someone to carry on her work.

Rachel, No one knows more than I what a horrible place this world can often be. Sometimes the atrocities are unfathomable. I sometimes think that if I could have one wish, it would be that everyone would have the same respect for life that people like you do.

Be Well, Live Well.

philip Mon Sep 27 23:19:43 PDT 1999

GARY: vive la seasonal difference - I've lived in the northern hemisphere for years so the seasonal difference was interesting from your side for me as well (Canada for six years, two years in England, one and a half in The Bahamas, travelled the US and Mexico for about nine months). I don't know how we might describe the opposite locations... maybe hemispherically opposite.

But Spring is in the air down here and blossoms have well and truly sprung.

DAN: your own local library is a great place to start - or the internet search engines Yahoo, Lycos, Excite etc. You should easily find the stuff your looking for. And nice ramble by the way .......

ALLIEN: good ideas ... keep plugging.

Back soon - PHILIP

Allein Mon Sep 27 22:51:19 PDT 1999

Rachel - Yeah, I have it now in my mailbox but have not read it yet - I'm still on my jokes e-mail. :) Hotmail was doing an update or something so no one could send or receive e-mail for a couple of hours.


...Arnold Schwartzenegger has a big one,
Michael J. Fox has a small one,
Madonna doesn't have one,
The Pope has one but doesn't use it,
Clinton uses his all the time,
Mickey Mouse has an unusual one,
Liberace didn't use his with women,
Jerry Seinfeld is very proud of his,
We never saw Lucy use Desi's
What is it? .............. A last name

Constipated People Don't Give A Crap.
My Kid Got Your Honor Roll Student Pregnant.
If At First You Don't Succeed...blame Someone Else And Seek Counseling.
You're Just Jealous Because The Voices Are Talking To Me
This Would Be Really Funny If It Weren't Happening To Me
Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult
If We Quit Voting Will They All Go Away?
The Face Is Familiar But I Can't Quite Remember My Name
Illiterate? Write For Help
I Refuse To Have A Battle Of Wits With An Unarmed Person
You! Out Of The Gene Pool!
I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To
Where Are We Going And Why Am I In This Handbasket?
It's Been Lovely But I Have To Scream Now
I Haven't Lost My Mind, It's Backed Up On Disk Somewhere
If You Can Read This, Please Flip Me Back Over [Seen Upside Down, On A Jeep]
Ax Me About Ebonics
Caution - Driver Legally Blonde!
Don't Be Sexist - Broads Hate That
Heart Attacks... God's Revenge For Eating His Animal Friends
Honk If You've Never Seen An Uzi Fired From A Car Window
How Many Roads Must A Man Travel Down Before He Admits He Is Lost?


Rachel Mon Sep 27 22:46:42 PDT 1999

Allein - I sent you an e-mail earlier today, but it came back to me saying it could not be delivered. I have sent it off again and it should make it through this time.

Gary - I'm fine, I was just feeling frustrated. I won't go back into all that again. I think I said quite enough.

Take care all

Gary S Mon Sep 27 22:44:17 PDT 1999


The Old Man seems to echo questions that occured to me when I read your post. You say that you have a number of large writing projects running concurrently, yet it would seem that the one involving your personal tragedy needs your exclusive focus as you say. If you plan to involve another writer, T.O.M. is quite right that it should be someone to whom the material is available. I would be interested to hear what progress you make with the project.


Gary S Mon Sep 27 22:07:12 PDT 1999

Hello everyone,

The board is abuzz with the stirrings of the autumnal spirit. How about that word, abuzz? How about the autmnal spirit? How about Hayden and Philip for whom the season is not the autumn but the spring? How remarkable it is to be in a room where the seasons are diametrically opposite. Would that be circumferentially opposite rather than diametrically? Does anyone give a damn?

I am sorry that the passing of MZB has left you with such a feeling of loss. I was not familiar with her work, but I feel that way often about the passing of those whose work has touched me.

The chocolate, the cars, and the funnies, and whatever nonsense occurs on this board is the very expression of the freedoms for which people sometimes give their lives. We don't honor the struggles of the oppressed any better with frustration and unrequited passion than we do with unrepressed humor and fellowship. If to live well is the best revenge, it is also safe to say that to laugh well is the best the defiance.

Dear Rachel,
I can't recall having seen you so dis-spirited. I hope I am reading more exasperation in your post than actually exists. I am reminded of how much patience is needed to be a mother when I read the notes you maternal members post, particulalrly those of Americo.

To all,
On another matter, my seal count has been cancelled. It seems the seals will have to be patient, or if they can't they must count themselves. I believe this was tried once. If I remember it correctly, the seals proved to be as motivated toward taking their own census as writers have shown to be when working on a collaboration. Does anyone suppose that collaborative writing projects have greater than normal pitfalls? Do five writers mean five times the factor of writer's block, ennui, dis-inspiration, interruptions, disruptions, time restraint, etc.?

Yes, Hayden, the lampshade looks very nice.



Dan Mon Sep 27 21:44:26 PDT 1999

Hi all,

Yep, it's me again. Just wondering if anyone has any idea on where I can find reference material on topics for my work. I browsed the reference section here but could not find what I need. Mainly I'm looking for sailing vessles, their build and how they word and the art of blacksmithing. They will be used to flesh out my world. I also need info on all manner of trivial things from personal hygene to cooking. Granted my own world has it's special place in the techological scheme of things, but knowing how it went on OUR world helps. I'm sure I can find a lot on the trivial things from the reference sight here, but any idea or websights for the others would be helpfull. Thanks.

-Philip: Thanks for the welcome!

-The Old man: Same to you, I realy feel welcomed and encouraged here.

Thanks again.


The Old Man Mon Sep 27 20:49:10 PDT 1999

Ladies and gentlemen,
Much has happened in the past few days, not the least of which is the heartbreaking story that Tim has told us. There is much to be done in the world, and Tim, you seem to understand the power of the pen to change first attitudes and then laws. However, such a story can only be told by oone who can be in the places where the tradgedy happened. I would suggest looking for a local writer, perhaps a local writer's group or even a local newspaper reporter. The latter would probably net you a passionate partner in your persuit.

It is a lovely thing to rise in the morning with the flavor of a newly-formed character on the tips of your fingers, to spend the lazy moments before sleep takes us contemplating the nuances of an old character or showering to the voices in your head telling you to hurry to your typewriter while the thought is fresh.
You are, indeed a person in persuit of his art. The art dictates itself, we must follow.


Allein Mon Sep 27 20:10:22 PDT 1999

Philip - I guess the idea has been used several times before. Yes, I do have side plots - a boy who is being abused by his uncle, the anorexic/depressed king who is always looking for new ways to kill himself, the princess who is betrothed to a prince but in love with a commoner - yes, there are several side plots. :)

Mon Sep 27 19:20:51 PDT 1999

Hi all,

I just felt I needed to say something. In reading over past posts and some of the most recent ones, mainly Americo's last one, I get a strong sence of friendship and family among those who regulary frequent the notebook. I know I'm new here but I hope that in the future I can someday become part of your family. I know that already I have drawn insperation from you all, and it's funny cause I can't quiet pinpoint what inspired me...maybe it's just the unique group of fmailar souls that have gathered here, maybe it's beacause for the first time I see there are other people out there who are going through the same thing in life...a burning desire to not make money or fame, just to produce their art for themselves and others to enjoy.

I don't know if I'm realy any good at writing. I spell worse then a drunk man at times and I think I've always felt held back becuase I DO have a talent in my art...and I feel like I'd be selfish to think I could have two talents. My world is so important to me, any of you who spend your spare moments lost in your creation know what I mean. Times in the car, lieing in bed, the shower, walking, in the middle of talking to's always there in the background, and so are the people my imagination has given birth to and those who have yet to be concived. I've wanted to get back to that irrational, passionate, crazed love for my world that I had years ago, and I think I might have found a thread that will lead me back. As long as I don't tug to hard and break it or unravel the whole tapestry. I sincerly hope that with the insperation you all give without even knowing it, and maybe a little help, I can, no WE can all reach our dreams and see our own worlds and peoples reach the finnal conclusions we all want to write for them.

Thanks, sorry to ramble so. :)


Philip Mclaren Mon Sep 27 19:19:09 PDT 1999

HELLO EVERYONE: it will take me some time to get back into the pages
here and find out what you are all writing and the gossip and the newest
taboos. Until then I will try to be a regular lurker, leaping in where I

It's late at night here right now - about 12:30. Everything is so quiet,
everyone is asleep in our house. No wonder I used to like to to write at
this hour, sans enfants.

JACK: sorry to hear about your deep felt loss.

DANIEL: welcome ... a fresh, bright addition.

RHODA: nice trip - Las Vegas is surreal.

TIM: writing is a wonderful cathartic experience and will help you I'm
sure. But I believe the work (the writing) has to come from you. I
certainly wouldn't be brave enough to take it on. What happened sounds
absolutely horrific! Concentration and focus will come with daily
routine crafting of words. Give yourself a target of say 500 words to
begin with - everyday.

ALLIEN: your story about an alien prince and princess in love sounds a
bit derivative. I trust you're taking side paths in your plot lines that
will make it really different. Do you plan to market this work? Or is it
a personal piece ... just for fun?

SKS: your routine sounds familiar. A page a day (500 words) is on
target. Is your military type space opera novel published? Good luck
with the four short stories.

RACHEL: your writing time is great - four hours a day (like my own). We
can expect something of substance soon I gather. What will it be?

MY LATE NIGHT READING: Yesterday I picked up my wife's Penguin Book of
Interviews (700 pages) in which are interviews with famous and infamous
people from the past 150 or so years. Some of those interviewed are:
Karl Marx, Theodore Roosevelt, R.L. Stevenson, Mark Twain, Thomas
Edison, Rudyard Kipling, Émile Zola, Oscar Wilde, Guglielmo Marconi,
Eugene O'Neill, Greta Garbo, Sigmund Freud, Adolf Hitler, Benito
Mussolini, Joseph Stalin, Gertrude Stein, F. Scott Fitzgerald, Pablo
Picasso, Mahatma Gandhi, Dylan Thomas, Samuel Beckett, Brendan Behan,
Alfred Hitchcock, Ernest Hemingway, May West and John Lennon ... to name
about one third. Most interviews run about five to ten pages each ...
just fascinating reading. Beats the Letterman Show any night.

Back soon - PHILIP.

Jon (just a cat) Mon Sep 27 18:57:50 PDT 1999

Shadows, shadows... Let me sleep for heaven's sake. I never understood why I was kicked off from that project. I wrote the best text in the round robin. Inspired by the great Goethe! But Americo is not my friend. He only thinks of words, words. That man has no heart. Good night.

Americo Mon Sep 27 18:51:19 PDT 1999

Holy blazes! I have been filing my posts and guess how much I have written on our beloved notebook since the 26th January 99 (this date should become a bank holiday): over 90,000 words! This is the size of a novel!

Dan: welcome to the notebook. And good evening when you stumble upon it. (Mind your nose, we need somebody here to breathe for us).
"Shadows in a Dream" is the first draft of the greatest novel the world has ever seen having the Internet as a background. In other words, the best Internet novel ever. At least that is what I would like it to become. For the moment it is just a pile of paper. Jack, our webmaster, has hidden it from human eyes. Why? Because we want to publish it when it will be finished and polished and scented with Channel 5 — and secrecy is the soul of business. It is in a safe place. Capisce? A hug to you. No, you cannot participate in it. This ruthless editor in chief has locked its door. But perhaps in a future project... (Actually "The Son of Shadows" is not a bad idea...)

BTW: I downloaded the only round robin left on the Workboook : "As Darkness Descends". I promise not to take part in it (grins — Rach, your word), but it is fair to say that I was impressed with the good writing over there. And happy to see that Goodweed is still very much among us. His latest contribution to ADD dates from the 17th September. We are living in a world where a bit of publicity helps. And since I am quite good at that (as I proved in my blurb to "S" dedicated to Dan) I just wanted to help. Now do not tell me that ADD does not need my help because I would call you ungrateful (at least...)

Allein : yes, that is what I meant. Thank you.

Katarina: I understand you perfectly. One of the sentences written here some days ago which made me feel like crying was Philip's : " I am too pissed off on many fronts" (to comment on Timor). And, however, when I saw the news today and was informed about what was going on in Tchetchenia, I could not stand it and switched off the telly. "Oh, my God, not again!" I said. There are times when we cannot comment on anything. We are so tired of seeing how this little blue planet is sometimes hell. In those moments we'd perhaps silence. Yes, the state of the world is really painful. And sorrow is a most tiring thing. However, we must not stop protesting.

Rachel: how can you write 100 words a minute? Or was it per second? I like to caress my keyboard and make love to it. Slowly, tenderly, softly. Gezz, when I think of you I become romantic. When I think of Alein I smile. When I think of Rhoda I become... I think I become intrigued. I would like to dance with Rhoda. There is a big heart under that red hair. A big big heart. And here we are: the magnificent four. We were seven some hours ago. Who knows if we will be seven again in the future? It's a pretty figure, seven.
Let us have some chocolate now.

And long live Timor Loro Sae.

Dan Mon Sep 27 17:53:29 PDT 1999

Thanks, sound like it's a great idea. To bad I showed up so late, I hope things work out. Thanks for the info.

Rachel Mon Sep 27 17:04:15 PDT 1999

Hey Dan

Shadows in a Dream is a colloberative writing project, a "flat robin" not quite a round robin, but the same sort of idea. It was a project that Americo brought to this forum. At first we had a slew of excited people who wanted to participate, but when the reality of deadlines became an issue people began to drop like flies, including Americo's two co-ediotros who didn't even see fit to respond to his repeated questions as to what had happened to them. So on the project went. Some people made the deadlines and other did not and from there Americo asked me if I would be a co-editor and I accepted. I do not intend to leave him standing on his own on this one. I will be in this all the way. I will see this turn into a book and I will find a publisher or I will die trying (grim laughter). Anyway, now we are down to four co-authors, we started with 20 something so you can see where I am feeling a little let down. I know its just life, but still I don't have to like it.
The story is about the cybernetic mind. It is about people on a notebook, this notebook and their characters getting together. There were to be five main activities, it really didn't seem like so much. There was Jacks address, a kareoke session, a tea, a ball and a farewell, sounds easy enough, but nope people just couldn't quite seem to get it done. Then there was the fact that it needed to be 6000 words. If you read my last post you will see what I think of that. I sort of figured that 4 or more months should have been more than long enough to do what takes me under a day.
Ah well, that is more or less the story of Shadows and what it is.
Take care you
Have fun on the site

Take care all

Dan Mon Sep 27 16:36:00 PDT 1999

This might be a dumb question, but what is this "Shadows in a Dream" everyone is talking about? Just wondering since it seems several people find it important, thanks.

- Allein, thanks for the email, I know your limited so get in touch with me when you can, I'm on most nights. (And I check my mail everyday ;)

Rachel Mon Sep 27 15:32:12 PDT 1999

Hey Allein - I will drop you an e-mail sometime tonight.

Allein Mon Sep 27 15:14:35 PDT 1999

Rachel - please e-mail me. :)

Allein Mon Sep 27 15:12:18 PDT 1999

Americo - I am all up for the project (is that what you meant by a reply). I'm trying my hardest to get the mask scene done, but I have such limited computer time (1 hr. a day on and offline) plus homework like you wouldn't believe. I've written some in a journal at school but now it's a matter of typing it up.

Dan - Welcome. I know, I already e-mailed you saying hi and hello and all that. :) I'll respond to your second e-mail ASAP but as I've just explained, I have lots of homework.
I have to go now and (you guessed it) do homework (how fun!).

Katarina Mon Sep 27 13:59:57 PDT 1999


I can't technically speak for everyone, but YES, we do CARE about what happens in Timor. Maybe writing about other things is a defense mechanism. Ashamedly, I must admit that I don't always want to read the headlines because they are so bad sometimes, but nonetheless we are aware and care.


Rachel Mon Sep 27 13:18:01 PDT 1999

My post below should have stated that it was going out to Americo and all

Rachel Mon Sep 27 13:16:12 PDT 1999

Hi all

I am just here on the notebook writing as I have to you via e-mail to tell all that I also am living in shock an and horror every day when I see the things that are being allowed to take place in Timor. And all in the name of what? Hell if I know. All I can see is a people who want their freedom, a country that told them they could vote for it and then when the people voted and the ballots were counted and the word came down that independence it would be, well then they were crushed, and nobody seemed to be able to do a thing to stop it. This I don't understand. How could the world turn their back? I don't know. I am sickened by what I have seen and read and can only imagine the horrors that are not being reported, the things we are not seeing. Oh and yes I know I probably have some spelling errors in here, but I just don't give a flying *(&#@@. If anyone wants to take it up with me feel free to write me a caustic e-mail, I will be fine with that. Gezz, all I can say is I sure hope that nothing ever goes wrong in my country, as it would seem that the world no longer gives a crap about what is happening to other people, just so long as it isn't happening on my soil I don't care. That would appear to be the new and improved attitude for the coming millenium. Well, cheers to us all!
I most certainly will be sticking by shadows. I for one do not understand what the big deal about writing 6000 words was. Just the other day I sat down at my computer to work up an edit on my first text and by the time I was done it 5600 words! That didn't even take me a full afternoon. That was in a house full of hustle and bustle, children and chores. I did so much and still got the writing in. I will of course admit that I type upwards of 100 wpm if I am on a roll, but still even if I did not. I think that I could have turned out the same amount of work.
Forgive me my frustration, and my harsh words but I am just tired of sitting back and saying nothing. I have felt such a crushing sense of dissapointment as person after person has not been able to meet the deadlines. I honestly had believed that we would make a group of this. Well, I suppose we still are a group, just a much smaller one that I had anticipated.
Yes, yes I know. The school, the job, the wife, the husband, the children, the dog, the cat, the band practice, the music lessons, the soccer, hockey, homework! The exams, the diner that needs to be made, the friends, the headache, the cold, the flu. Yes, yes I have all of these things myself.
Take care all

Americo Mon Sep 27 12:17:30 PDT 1999

Hello everybody!

Beautiful day for a change. The United Nations forces are doing a competent (though too slow, helas) job in Timor Loro Sae; the murderers will be punished; The US responsibles pilfered information about Xanana Gusmão to the journalists and the public, without much protest of that wonderful "land of the free and the brave"; Indonesian solidiers are still burning the little that is left of Timor to the indifference and perhaps joy of the Nazis and those who shrug their shoulders towards human suffering and mysery; some of the beautiful writers in this forum are of the opinion that it should be dedicated to chocolate/cars/martial arts and other fascinating topics that might be of interest to their shining minds rather than speaking of human problems, etc, etc. Splendid notebook!

On the internal front, Jack has wiped off "Shadows in a Dream" from the workbook but still deserves and will be given honorable mention somewhere in the novel (I will write the epitaph...sorry, the acknowledgement), the old sci-fiction and fantasy brigade is coming back with all its extraordinary genius and fascinating conversation; and we are all alive and kicking forever.

Well, enough of the newsreel.


Rachel, Rhoda, Allein and I — we have been left with a limited number of pages after 21 of the 25 collaborators have abandoned or kicked off from the "Shadows" project. According to the rules we could use the texts of all the co-authors but we will not. We will make the book only with our prose. It is enough that they will become our characters... (I love this little bit). Are we willing to defend it and take it to its glorious conclusion so help us God?

Here is my answer: YES!!!

This is the time for you to compromise yourselves as well. If I do not get an answer from any of you — here or by e-mail — in three days' time (if later — up to a week, no more —please explain the motive of the delay) consider yourselves relieved from this hard but rewarding task. No more might-have-beens in our bosom!

Long live Timor LoroSae!"

Rosemary Mon Sep 27 11:27:00 PDT 1999

Hi all,
Kat, the day I posted the cool weather report was our cool day. The early morning was about 57degrees and mid day only got to about 88degrees. But that was the only day. We are back to about 70 at night and mid 90's in the daytime. It'll slack off about two weeks into October, right after the big trail ride that roasts all of us.

I've read a good bit of MZB's books and I think she encouraged and helped a lot of new authors with her publications. She will be sorely missed and it's a real shame. I worry about Anne McCaffery sometimes. She is rather advanced in age and I have noticed she is colaberating with new young authors a lot the last few years. Her Pern series is one of the few things I have ever been willing to read more than once.

Don't forget (unless you missed it. It was way back and you were out of town.) I offered horse expertiese (not spelling, obviously) if you were the one that requested it.


Dan Mon Sep 27 10:00:48 PDT 1999

Hi all.

I'd just like to thank everyone who has responded to my post, and I look forward to shareing and getting to know everyone. This is my SECOND day in a row writing, I beleive that is my personal best in over at least a year. Well I'm gonna get back to it, but I check the sight frequently and am on ICQ for anyone who's curious. Have a good day!

ICQ# 6496036

Rachel Mon Sep 27 08:59:57 PDT 1999

Hi all

Kat - My sister lives near Victoria - Victoria is a lovely place to visit. Yup, I have been to seaside, know where it is and love it (smiles). Glad to hear that you and the kiddies had a nice weekend. Two of my children went on writing rampages yesterday. My daughter was in a bit of a twist because I didn't finish illustrating her story for her, but hey, what's a mum to do when her children fall asleep with their writing clutched in their little hands. My son's sarcastic humor had my sister in fits of laughter. He is quite the little guy, his latest story is very good.

Gary - Thanks for the hugs! Here are a bunch right back at yah (big smile and hugs).

Dan - Welcome :)

Take care all

Katarina Mon Sep 27 08:08:06 PDT 1999

Hi Everyone!

Had a wonderful week-end, as the leaves are starting to change here in Ohio and the air is cool, but the sun shines so brilliantly. Took my kiddies to a Harvest Fest at the local Botanical Gardens where they had dancing, music, food, and literature from several different countries. I try very hard to expose my children to all types of cultures and things literary and creative. My 4-year old told me he liked the women in the pretty clothes who were dancing (Polish) and maybe one day would marry one of them! Ah, from the mouths of babes....He also very much enjoyed doing a crayon rubbing from a linoleum tile of an Egyptian scenerio. It was very educational and fun at the same time. I think that is the best way for children to really learn.

I have been inspired by you all here lately and have been working on some poetry. Maybe someday I will share when I am feeling brave.

Rosemary - how are things in Texas? I hope you are enjoying the cool weather, as I am. Our summers have gotten intolerable these last few years.

Xavier - how are you feeling?

Rachel - British Columbia, hmmm? My older sister lives in Portland, Oregon and visits Victoria all the time. She raves about it! My favorite spot in the country is a little town on the Pacific coast, about 60 miles from Portland, called Seaside. Ever hear of it?

Rhoda - regarding westerns....I think there is still a big audience out there. My husband loves westerns and is a big John Wayne fan. My father, who is from Texas, loves the western also.



Jack Beslanwitch Mon Sep 27 00:36:45 PDT 1999

It is my sad duty to report that Marion Zimmer Bradley suffered a major heart attack on Tuesday, September 21 and died Saturday, September 25, 1999. Funeral arrangements are pending and will be posted at the above web site when final. Memorial donations may be sent to her church:
Saint Mark's Episcopal Church, 2300 Bancroft Way, Berkeley, CA 94704.

Whether or not you were a fan of her or not, I include the following for those that are. She will be missed. I hope that others will take up the torch and pen additional Darkover novels in her memory. I am also tempted to make the effort of buying a plane ticket to attend the funeral if possible. Take care all.

Dan Mon Sep 27 00:26:39 PDT 1999

Thank you Gariess!!

Gariess Mon Sep 27 00:02:53 PDT 1999


Welcome to the forum. So, you live on the gulf coast in Florida, you say? It's one of my favorite places. I have spent many good times on the gulf from Tarpon Springs to Marco Island.

What kind of art do you do? I do photography, so I could be an artist you could share experiences with. I have many freinds here on Cape Cod in the art world and have had exhibits in a few galleries. Actually, my daughter is the most recognized artist in my family, she has exhibited at Boston MFA. I never pass up a chance to mention that, I have found over two hundred ways to work it into a conversation. Take for example #233, "Hey, you left your lights on!"
"Oh, thank you, my daughter has exhibited at Boston MFA." Well, I'm sure you get the idea. Feel free to email me, if you want to talk about your writing project. I expect you will find this a good place to learn things about writing. Stick around.

Later, everyone. Hugs for Rachel and Allein.


gariess Sun Sep 26 23:24:15 PDT 1999

Hi folks,

I have been reading the posts but I can't seem to find the energy to make an earnest reply. The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak, or maybe it's the opposite. No, that doesn't make sense. Maybe everything is weak, but then, what's willing? Have you ever felt this way? I think I spent too much time in that Porsche. Hayden, do you have any aspirin, man?

Tomorrow I have to see my doctor and the next day I have to count seals on Monomoy island. Or do I have to see my seal tomorrow and then count doctors on Monomoy island? That can't be right. There's no golf course on Monomoy. Don't you hate it when it gets like this? Maybe my seal will write me an excuse to get of counting doctors.


Dan Sun Sep 26 22:59:56 PDT 1999

Hi all,

Well, to be honest this is the first time I've ever posted to a writers board, so be gentle. (And please don't laugh at any bad spelling!) I'm a fantasy writer, unpublished and have been plugging away at a massive project for well over five years. For the last two, unfortunatly, I've been in the worst block. A recent loss in my family has drawn me out to begin writing and work on my novel again. (acutally today is the first time I've done this much work on it in years) As for times of day I liek to write...well I have a 3pm to 3pm job, so late at night, or in the early morning depending on how you look at it. I'm on the first of three days off and am atempting to just write through them, getting my mind off the real world. Well I've always felt that not having fellow artists (I'm also a artist in the conventinal sence) to share with have hindered me greatly. I live in Florida on the gulf coast (Weee storm!) and would LOVE to hear from any fellow artists! Email me personaly if you like. Thanks for listening to me!

Rachel Sun Sep 26 22:15:19 PDT 1999

Hi all

Rhoda - I did get lots of chocolate (yummmmmmmmyyyyyy) I just ate the last of it this evening and now I feel a little sick (grins). I'm glad you had a nice trip.
Take care you

Bye all

Allein Sun Sep 26 21:47:49 PDT 1999

Tim - I have never done any non-fiction work either (well, I have for school, but not for publication). But, I would check out the library and the Internet for research.


Rhoda Sun Sep 26 21:41:52 PDT 1999

Hello everyone,

A lot has been posted since I left for Las Vegas last Friday. I was impressed with the Strip. It was like nothing I ever expected. We stayed two nights in New York, New York. We stayed up into the wee hours of the night, went to see Star Trek the Experience, Race for Atlantis, Madame Toussand's and other attractions. Not once did I play a slot machine, but I was tempted.


Bless your heart. I am sorry to hear you have been hurt. I am glad that you are back.


I have never written non-fiction, but there are some very helpful books on how to write a proposal and outline for one. I think an outline is an absolute must for what you are trying to do. I admire your courage in writing about it. I will gather my material together and see if I can give you the title of any books that will help.


Welcome to the Notebook. I enjoyed your post.


Belated Happy Birthday. Hope you enjoyed it, and I hope you got lots and lots of chocolates.

Well, I have never been so tired. For two days I walked at least four miles. I close my eyes and can still see the bright lights of Las Vegas. What an experience. I think I would describe it as almost surreal.

Happy Writing!


Tim Lamb Sun Sep 26 14:45:50 PDT 1999

To any and all writers out there:
I am a new writer. I have never published a novel or anything that large, but I am working on several large projects. The problem I am having is focus. I need to deal with one specific project first so that I might be able to focus. Here's the deal. On July, 19 1998 my eight year old daughter was abducted, raped, and murdered by a local child molester. The child molester is now serving three life terms for his crimes. However, the circumstances surrounding the case are at best really skrewed-up. I am currently a Private Investigator and I am still investigating the case. I would like to write the story of what really occured, regardless of how bad that small town wants me to shut up. What I need is help from another writer. I know how to investigate and research, but I have never attempted to write anything this large. It needs to be done right so that people will understand that children are not as safe as they want to pretend them to be. Not counting of course just how skrewed-up the criminal justice system is. If anyone has any helpful suggestions, or would like to work with me on this project please email me as soon as possible. Thank you all. Tim

Jack Beslanwitch Sun Sep 26 14:32:14 PDT 1999

Given that the time limit on Shadow has passed and I am a little embarrassed to say that Australia and a lack of my desktop and all the data on that desktop made me irresponsibly behind. That and forgetting about the deadline in the first. Mea culpa.

Still, it reminded me about the Round Robin area of the Workbook. I have deleted reference to Shadow, since most of the final editing and work on that should be handled via email. Also, given the sad state of affairs on my Round Robin, I have pulled it. All of this said, if anybody has any additional Round Robins to suggest please send me text to use. May be Americo could come up with Son of Shadow. At any rate, I just wanted to thank and applaud Americo for starting a very lively interactive writing project that did much to excite the creative juices of many of us. Hope such can be repeated many times over here. Take care.

Eddie French Sun Sep 26 13:31:00 PDT 1999

Hi Steve,
Nice to see you posting lately.

Allein Sun Sep 26 10:36:25 PDT 1999

Philip - I am writing a story about an alien prince and princess who fall in love - I think you get the idea. If you want to know more about it, there's info on my webpage. Right now, I'm just trying to find time to write that masquarade scene for Shadows. I write whenever I can. School keeps me quite busy and during the school year, my computer time is limited to an hour a day - on or offline. Mostly, I write in journals with hope of typing my work up onto the computer.

S.K.S. Perry Sun Sep 26 08:52:35 PDT 1999

Hey all,

Philip, I write whenever I can find the spare time, which is usually when I'm at work. :-) I also get a few hours occasionally at night when my wife is working or otherwise occupied. I'm trying desperately to make sure I write at least a page a day, but it doesn't always happend.

I'm basically a Science Fiction and Fantasy writer. I've written one novel, a military type space opera, and have completed the first chapter to its sequel. I'm also a good ways into an urban fanstasy novel right now that seems very promising if what people have been telling me is correct. I've got four short stories currently making the rounds of publishers.

Be Well, Live Well.

Derek Sun Sep 26 08:37:48 PDT 1999

New e-zine calling for submissions. The Think Tank, a new literary e-zine is calling for submissions of high quality short stories, poems, essays, and artwork.
Visit us at or e-mail us at

thank you.

Jon (the cat) Sun Sep 26 06:33:25 PDT 1999

Americo is too pissed off with the world and trying to conciliate his ludic sense with the waste of time which Internet has become to him. He would like to find serious writers willing to work and publish, people with a sense of engagement and with real talent. What has he found here in eight months of passionate collaboration (completed today)?

That is the question he has been asking to himself. While he does not find an answer to this agonizing question, do not expect many posts from him.
Just a note on the remaining co-authors of "S". The original list of the wonderful seven (see workbook) has been confined to four: Rachel, Rhoda, Allein (partly and if...) and Americo himself. And the question is if it is worthwile to work further on the project when Jack himself — the webmaster— has not sent him his complete collaboration (the deadline for this was yesterday midnight as announced three times in previous posts here). Where are we going to publish the book? And what can be expected from just e-mail intercourse? Americo is a busy man and hates dilettanti.

See the meaning of the word dilettanti first before you get offended with me, but you can become offended, no problem. In a world where genocide is met with just a shrug of so-called "writers'" shoulders, I laugh at YOUR human feelings.

Incidentally, I tried to read a book by MZB's: "The Inheritor". No comments. But I sent her family my best wishes of recovery for the lady. Cat's feelings, I suppose.

In the meantime long live Timor Lorosae.

Rachel Sun Sep 26 05:03:39 PDT 1999

Hi Philip - I write between 9 - 3, this is the time when my children are off at school. I usually take a break between 11- 1, that is when I do the house stuff (grins and make a face). Then back to writing. I also tend to find an hour or two in the evening, but this is nothing regular, it is sort of as and when it comes up.
Take care you

Martin Sun Sep 26 03:06:42 PDT 1999


I know San Antonio. I have seen the Alamo, dropped dead on the place where Davy Crockett drew his last breath and Jim Bowie threw his last knife and walked the Riverwalk. I was there in September and the weather did not feel that hot as you described it. Well of course it was back in ‘91 and I was coming straight from the Arizona desert. Actually I think it would be nice to live in such a historical place.


Great many thanks to you. It worked out perfectly.


philip Sun Sep 26 02:26:21 PDT 1999


It's good be back here on Jack's pages - especially as he has just visited Australia and been our house guest. I guess that's why I am here now.

I used to visit this site regularly for about three years or more, but I became busy and took on a "regular" job for a whole shit load of money. Up until that time I had been writing full-time for seven years - I'm writing my sixth novel currently. Anyway ... I'm here now and willing to get involved in the machinations of those who want to become published. Numerous well know writers have helped me in the past and I'll really try to help you if I can. I know you can help me.

What are you writing? .... SKDS ... Allien... GaryS ... Katarina ... Rosemary ... John ... Arik ... Rachel ... Rosemary ... Bob ... Avatar ... my old mate Rhoda ... and Americo ... Please email me privately if you choose.

We all know the everyday effort has to be put in ... when do you make time? Mine is morning ... 8:00 to 2:00.

I have to drop my China inspiration. I'm not impressed by what I see has been published to date. First person past tense might be my preference if I proceeded with my work on this.

I have a master plan - I might write a book in each of my favourite countries in my latter middle age. These books will of course be set in those countries.

Back soon - PHILIP

Jack Beslanwitch Sat Sep 25 19:14:24 PDT 1999


Parrot is fine and looks like the computer system will be in my hands on Monday. First reports are that it screams. I will look forward to playing with it.

Jack Beslanwitch Sat Sep 25 19:09:43 PDT 1999

     On MZB, the science fiction fans in the audience might recognize her Darkover series and others will be aware of Mists of Avalon, her account of the Arthurian legend told from the perspective of Morgana La Fey with Morgan as a sympathetic character in her decidedly Pagan rendering. Of all her books, perhaps my favorite is the Catch Trap. This is a main stream that chronicles the lives of a gay trapeze artist in the forties and fifties. It is a brutally honest and sympathetic treatment that I found engrossing. You might also know Marion Zimmer Bradley from her magazine Fantasy which actually carries her name.

      Her brother was Paul Edwin Zimmer who wrote some books himself and died several years ago of a heart attack at an eastern science fiction convention. He and othes started an artistic commune in Berkeley in which Diana Paxson and others lived. It was known as Greyhaven and there was even an anthology of stories from writers who lived in the home. I believe Marion actually owned the home. Diana Paxson was one of the co-founders of the Society of Creative Anacronisms (SCA) and went on to write a whole host of books that grow out of her foundations in midievel history and myths and legends.

I would not even dream of attempting a complete bibliography, but her writing credentials were long. Hope this explains my sadness at her illness and hope that she find the best path for her as was asked by Diana Paxson.

Rachel Sat Sep 25 18:04:44 PDT 1999

Hi all

Allein - Hey! Give me that! (I wrestle the present away from you) Ah, ha, ha! No! Hey! Ouch that hurt! I just wanted to shake it, smell it, rip all the paper off of it and see what it is!!!!! Uh, er, I mean, honest I just wanted to look at that pretty paper (grins).

Rosemary - Thanks (smiles) Hey, I would send you some of our rain if I could. I live in British Columbia and we get lots of rain, rain and then more rain! Okay, we get a little sun, but I am not kidding when I say a little.

Take care all

Allein Sat Sep 25 16:18:58 PDT 1999

Rachel - I've sent you an e-mail. I also found you a present and wrapped it in pretty silver paper. :)

Time for funnies:

A boy was walking home one day,
enraged by a licking he had taken from the school bully.
As he crossed the yard, a chicken came out in front of him.
He kicked the Chicken and his mother saw him and said, "I saw that! You cannot have any chicken for a month."
Later on in the barn - still mad- he kicked the pig he walked up to. His mother saw him again saying, "I saw that, young man. You can not have any pork for two months."
The boy's father was just getting off his tractor when a cat walked by.
His father kicked the cat out of the way.
The boy saw his mother heading in that direction and spoke out,
"Ma you want me to tell him or should I."

Rosemary Sat Sep 25 16:03:20 PDT 1999

Hi everyone,

Hope you have a happy, happy birthday. I've gotten to the stage that has me hoping everyone will forget mine.

I live in San Antonio, Tx. It's about 150 miles from the Gulf Coast and for the last couple of years we catch ourselves selfishly (adverb, bad bad) hoping for a hurricaine to cool us down and drop a little moisture on this simi-parched land. I keep thinking we ought to move somewhere more hospitible, but you'd be amazed at the things wrong with other places.

So sorry about the broken bones, it can be a real drag or, it can be a chance to get in a lot of pleasure reading. Hope you're not stove up too long.


Rachel Sat Sep 25 09:43:12 PDT 1999

Hi all

Kat - Thanks for the birthday wishes (smiles). I just got another call from my mum this morning at some ungodly early hour. Thought I might die from shock of such an early call, but it was nice to talk to her. She was not able to get through to me yesterday, she left a singing messages (my family are all big on the singing) I got three different singing messages on my phone yesterday. Anyway it was nice to hear from her in person, and its nice to get birthday wishes from you! 35? Hum, I just turned 31 I think that 35 sounds nice.

Take care all

Katarina Sat Sep 25 09:11:15 PDT 1999

Hi, guys:

Sorry I have been away for a while. Work has been very busy lately! I finally got around to reading the archived posts that occurred after I posted my thoughts on being ignored. I didn't, honestly, mean to create havoc here. I thank everyone for responding to me. Now, I know I am alive and this isn't just a dream!

Gary, I really liked your suggestion about contributors throwing out ideas and others here responding with their thoughts (i.e., "How do you feel about the change of the seasons?") I think that is a very stimulating, creative exercise for all who participate here!

Rachel - Happy belated birthday! (I have decided that I am going to be eternally 35 from now on....that would make me born in...hmmm...oh, yeah, 1964!)

Xavier - Sorry to hear about your accident! My God, two broken limbs. I think God is watching out for you though. It could have been much worse.

Gary - Lamb chops over literary dessert? Shame on you!



Rachel Sat Sep 25 08:53:51 PDT 1999

Hi all

Gary - Why does everyone always want to corrupt me (grins and laughter)! Also on MZB, that is what I have seen people call her. I can remember when I was still fairly new to this site there was a big talk about MZB and her rules and I was freaked right out. I wondered what and who was this MZB! So, don't feel bad for not knowing who she is (hugs).

SKS - Hum, I think I will go and track down some more smoke salmon this afternoon (yum, yum, yummy)!

Allein - How's the writing going? Drop me a line and let me know.

Take care all

Martin Sat Sep 25 01:56:09 PDT 1999


Not knowing who is Marion Zimmer Bradley does not hurt. You just missed a lot of soap operas and blah meals.

I certainly will miss great George C. Scott. He was one of this actors who never hit the Hollywood parties but was a great guy. like Gene Hackman.

I hope this will not end with a trauma. Take care.


Rachel Fri Sep 24 22:24:42 PDT 1999

Jack - I will direct my energy and good thoughts towards Marion Zimmer Bradley.

Gary S Fri Sep 24 21:57:58 PDT 1999

Just an added note to pay homage to the late George C. Scott. I enjoyed his performances me for many years. He was a great actor, he shall be missed.

Gary S

Gary S Fri Sep 24 21:50:12 PDT 1999

I'm probably going to reveal myself as a total SF&F moron, but I don't know who Marion Zimmer Bradley is. I wish Marion well in any case.

Jack, are they giving you the "sick parrot" run-around? I used to get that from agents.

Next time you hit a stone wall, try to be on the other side of the car. better yet, try to be in a car doesn't hit stone walls. Eleven days is a lot of soap operas and blah meals.

Welcome. I don't see where you need to be doubtful about you writing skills. You seem to put sentences together pretty well as far as I can see. Good to have you in the room. Don't mind Hayden; we've all become rather fond of him, actually. He doesn't bite... well, all right there was that one time but it wasn't infectious... well, all right but it wasn't fatal. What's that you say, chap? Oh, my. Why didn't some one tell me?

LOL. Your wit is showing; it must have been great fun corrupting Rachel, wasn't it?

Hayden, I am leaving the Porsche in your drive. I am going back to my Explorer. No offense, mate but I don't think I'm a Porsche sort of guy. My old chevy truck was about the closest match for my style. Well worn and reliable. I miss it. At least the Explorer comes with a compass. Of course if I had one in the Outback, I would have followed it the wrong way, after a life long habit of going west when I am lost. Around here if you go west for 30 minutes or less you will bump into the U.S. mainland.

Later, all,


Jack Beslanwitch Fri Sep 24 20:58:07 PDT 1999

There is now a website where those so inclined to send your best wishes to her Marion Zimmer Bradley's family.

Jack Beslanwitch Fri Sep 24 20:27:55 PDT 1999

For the science fiction and fantasy lovers out there, this just came in via several different sources:

'According to a different mailing list I'm on, Marion Zimmer Bradley has
had a massive heart attack, and is currently at Alta Bates Hospital in
Berkeley. She is last reported as being unconscious.

Diana Paxson requested that "energy be sent to her higher self to be used
as the need be." To translate into more conventional language, if you're
going to pray for her, pray she finds the strength to do what she needs
to do, one way or the other.

Brenda Daverin'

Jack Beslanwitch Jack Beslanwitch Fri Sep 24 18:53:04 PDT 1999

Xavier: Very sorry to hear of your accident and I will keep you in my prayers for a speedy recuperation. Take care.

Martin: At least in part, if you are using Internet Explorer click on View, Encoding, More and you should see Cyrillic as one of the choices. Actually, you will get a whole range of Cyrillic options. Also, you might check MSDN Online and do a search on Cyrillic as well.

Sigh, still waiting for my main desk top to find its way back to me. Apparrently it is done, but not available for me to take possession. Don't ask. The story involves a sick parrot and other comedy of errors too improbable to fathom.

Allein Fri Sep 24 15:21:05 PDT 1999

Xavier - Ouch! You've had a pretty rough time. I'm glad you're okay and hope you're up to 100% real soon. :) (((BIG HUGS))) - hope that didn't hurt too much.

Rachel - Glad you liked the card. :) You'll get a real one when you come to visit - only two weeks and I found out that's a 4 day weekend, so I'll have even more time to clean my room.

Bob - Everyone is welcome here. :) I hope you stick around. I'm glad you liked the funnies and the poem. Actually, Quachik is a boy. If you want to read some of my other poetry and stories you can check out my webpage - the link is up above.

Well, bye all,

Rachel Fri Sep 24 14:21:39 PDT 1999

Hi all

Hey Philip - Welcome back
Bob - Welcome
Gary and SKS - Thanks guys!
Allein - That was such a cute card, you are too sweet (big smile)
Americo - Have a nice weekend
Xavier - Yikes! I'm glad that you are alright. Gezz, I had wondered what had happened to you.

Take care all

PS - Hi Rosemary (big smiles)

Xavier Fri Sep 24 13:46:08 PDT 1999

Hello everyone:

Sorry I haven't been around lately, but I had a rather unpleasant accident. i was in a car wreck, and spent 11 days in the hospital. I have since been home, where I have no internet access. I was kind of hurt, a broken right arm and broken right leg, severe neck strain and some other cuts and bruses. I'm doing better now, but still in casts. My friend lost control of his car, and we smashed into a rock wall at about 60. He was not hurt very badly ( the car hit on my side).

In any case, I will probably withdraw from Shadows, as I simply can not get regular computer access. I am now at my fathers house, but it is tough to get out. I really enjoyed this project, but I need to be realistic. I will e-mail Americo as well.

well, thats all for now. Hope all is well with my favorite writers.



Martin Fri Sep 24 12:19:50 PDT 1999


There was an interesting article on China in the previous editon of the Newsweek magazine.

Third person but in the present.


Does anyone know how I teach my computer the Cyrillic alphabet? So he can read web pages from Russia and that I can answer in Russian.


Uuuuh. South Texas what a vast country. Where in South Texas do you live?


Arik Http:// Fri Sep 24 12:07:04 PDT 1999

Hi all. how are you?

Bob Fri Sep 24 09:43:08 PDT 1999

I got a kick out Allein's data burst about Debris around Uranus. Wouldn't the news be more fun if more humor was included. I'm reminded of a Minister recently kicked out of our church because he used too much humor and was accused of frequenting joke books instead of preparing a meaty sermon.

I came onto the web looking for wisdom about getting published. Feel the naieve soul speaking in that statement.
From what I read, it is apparent to me that I'm in a different league. You all seem so polished with your skill with words. Is that what I need to learn?

I'm one of those who believes I'm OK just the way I am. Will I have to change to be acceptable in thine eyes?

I see beauty, wisdom and magnificence all around while I'm here reading. Why is that? (I am asking too many questions.)

What will happen as a result of this typing I'm so insecure about? Do they have speel check in this chat format?

Allein, I loved your A'rexia poem. It took me into the heart and mind of her pain as she wished to end her fat existence. You are a wonderful writer. (compliments will get me everything) Almost!

S.K.S. Perry Fri Sep 24 06:14:15 PDT 1999

Hey all,

Rachel, H A P P Y B I R T H D A Y !!!!!
Be thankful you can't hear me singing.

Gary, Yes, it's true. I corrupted poor Rachel and led her to the Dark Side. She refuses to eat vegetables now unless she can hunt and kill them first. (I personally witnessed her stalking celery.)

Be Well, Live Well.

Gary S Fri Sep 24 00:52:33 PDT 1999

I can scarcely believe how many posts I have missed reading in the last two days. I have been very busy on some photographing projects and I am getting a taste of what it is like to have too little time.

I hope you are still enjoying cool weather.

I am not sure what you found out but I recall 'Empire of The Sun' being a rather substantial novel to have come from a screenplay. I put my money on it being the reverse, or novel first, then screenplay. I'm partial to stories about the making of films. Here in the very far reaches of the eastern seaboard we don't see much film making. Atually, it is our insular mentality on this cape. If we "cross the bridge" and drive an hour or so to Boston, they do a fair bit of filming these days.

Happy birthday. Happy birthday. (One more) HAPPY BIRTHDAY.

I was in that Welch village once but I thought it was spelled with six g's and eleven l's. I wanted to send a post card to someone there, but there was no room for the address.

I don't think the western is dead. "The Unforgiven" was quite a big success, and one more recent, "Purgatory" was less noteworthy but it seemed to do well. In the fifties and early sixties we were bombarded by TV horse opera and I think the overkill of those years set the genre back, but the western as a basic drama form won't die.

I heard that since Rachel has given up the vegetarian life style even the bears are reluctant to wander too close to her territory. You might want to watch those chocolates too.

The tanker has arrived and I am on the way back. I picked up some hitch-hikers and they are attending to the beer. It seems this is not the Outback after all, just a very big piece of land that is to become a new shopping center. I drove down the service road just as the weekend was ending. That's why I didn't see any people, just those large birds in the distance. We must talk about those birds one day. I suppose it could be the halucinations somebody mentioned.


Jack Beslanwitch Thu Sep 23 22:16:50 PDT 1999

Well, finally slept a little over 12 hours and have gotten over the worst aspects of jet lag. Or at least my brain cells are not something close to the consistency of warm out of date baby food. The archive I culled at San Francisco is now back up on the Archive page, all 385 k of it.

I am making progress on learning how to play a didjiridoo. I may subject you to a picture at some point or worse a link to a sound file. The one aspect I am having trouble with is circular breathing. But I have hopes of conquoring that as well.

On East Timor, one comment and one only, I was horrified to find that there was not one mention of it in the Seattle daily paper, the Post Intelligencer (did not check the Times). I also caught a noticable lack of coverage on network news and local news. It was only on BBC news and the PBS news hour that there was note and extended note of it. The interview with the militia leader indicating they were going to send back 1000 Australians in body bags was particularly chilling and angering. Oh, well, enough political stuff and probably mostly out of place.

My major woe is that my upgrade on my computer is still pending. This is hoping that all will be well. Major hassle is that I have run out of IRQs and am scrambling on which devices I will be able to include in my machine. Grumble. Supposed to get it tomorrow - Dual Pentium 450s, an adaptec 8945 firewire card that will allow me to stream Digital Video onto a harddrive, edit it and then stream it back onto video tape, a 22 gig Daystar IDE, a 9 gig Cheetah sczzy and Windows 2000 (RC1) to keep it all running. Oh, and an extra fan to hopefully keep the two 450s something below frying egg temperature. We will see whether this is techie hubris or if it all comes together. Take care.

Rachel Thu Sep 23 20:33:17 PDT 1999

Thanks Allein :D

Allein Thu Sep 23 20:09:59 PDT 1999

Rachel - an early HAPPY BIRTHDAY for you!! I can't do all the fancy bold writing that people do 'cause I don't know how, but I wish you a very happy birthday.

SKS - I will call off the sqrlmunks. :)

Here's some more of my poetry.

This is one that's actually from a story I wrote about Quachik and is one of "his" poems - writing is not his strong point. *grin*

Thoughts on Anorexia

I could fly like an eagle,
Dance like a feather,
Until my life came crashing down,
Here in a hospital bed,
Lying weak and sick,
They say I’m thin,
I’m certain I’m not,
What did I do to deserve this?
I believe,
I’ll never achieve,
The goal of thinness,
That I dream,
They bring in my meals,
I don’t want to eat,
I hate it, I love it,
Food, gives life,
Also, makes people fat,
I’ll smell it, see it,
But taste it? Never!
It is an enemy.
Here, I cry,
Alone in the dark,
Please don’t hold me,
You don’t care,
No one help me,
You don’t understand,
I feel a pain in my wrist,
Where I made my suicide cut,
I cry myself to sleep,
Hoping never to wake up.

Here are just some willy-nilly poems:

Ode to a Squirrelmunk

Fluffy and soft,
Cuddly and cute,
Little squirrelmunk,
Eating nuts,
Romp and play,
In your guilded cage,
Pampered squirrelmunk,
My spoiled wee beastie,
I let you free,
But please,
Do not sleep on my bed.

No name poem

Feel the razor,
Cutting my flesh,
Ruby drops of blood,
Staining the floor,
I believe I will stop shaving manually.

Ode to a poem

I poem is something,
I wish to not write,
I get the urge,
I try to fight,
I cannot help it,
The urge will not go,
Oh no! On the paper!
A poem I wrote!


S.K.S. Perry Thu Sep 23 19:58:09 PDT 1999

Hey all,

Rachel, sure I'll tag along. I've got my red cape and hood all, wait. That's for wolves. How about a couple of bowls of lukewarm porridge? I hear bears love porridge as long as it's cooked juuussst right.

Allein, I promise, if you ever show up in my neck of the woods, I'll share my chocolate with you. Until then, please call off the mad sqrlmonks. I have enough trouble keeping track of my nuts as it is.

Be Well, Live Well.

Rachel Thu Sep 23 19:49:28 PDT 1999

Ameico - Thank you for the birthday wishes.
Take care you

Americo Thu Sep 23 19:17:36 PDT 1999

Sorry, I have just tried the URL in my post and got the note: File not found. I was never keen on the TLS anyway. Sorry again for the false path.

Americo Thu Sep 23 19:11:30 PDT 1999


Past midnight here. 24th September. Jon left a note on my desk. Today's your birthday and I want to be the first to wish you a happy new year in your wonderful life.

This place has been quite interesting so far. It must become useful as well.

We need to find a publisher for "Shadows" and that's what I am inviting ALL to try. Who knows if, in the process, you also find a publisher for you?

Browsing old TLS's (Times Literary Supplement), I found an article about publication on demand and other new forms of publication. See June 18/99. I put the URL above in the hope that you can help find ways of publishing "Shadows". Other ideas or offers accepted.

Howard, my experience tellls me that you are the only soul here willing to answer to appeals of this kind. Get out from your den, man.

As for the book composition. "Shadows" was clearly programmed as a basically mainstream project. There are two round robins in this site for fantasy and science-fiction writers. Those of you who feel more at ease in these genres, please transfer your additions to those round robins. There is a great deal of talent there.

Long live Timor Lorosae!

Allein Thu Sep 23 18:39:01 PDT 1999

I'm not any worse, but not any better either.

SKS - You ate chocolates and didn't share with me or Rachel!! I must be forced to send a rampant sqrlmunk after you, unless you hand over those chocolates!!

Rachel Thu Sep 23 16:17:19 PDT 1999

Steve! You brat!!!! Eating Godiva Chocolate without me (I make a very, very sad face). You do know that Allein is going to wonder about your bear comments don't you? Hum, I think I need some more smoke salmon (grins). Yup, I'll get me some salmon and a bucket full of berries and go for a walk on the forest trails. I'm sure it will not be a problem (grins and laughter). Yah wanna tag along?
Take care youl

S.K.S. Perry Thu Sep 23 15:59:13 PDT 1999

Hey all,

Anyone remember me? I've been lurking lately, but I haven't had much time to post.

Rachel, guess what I'm eating right now? That's right, Godiva chocolates--strawberry cheescake chocolates to be precise. Na Na Na Na Na. :-)

Allein, If you go to meet Rachel, bring lots of bear repellent, and remember, you don't have to outrun the bear, you only have to outrun Rachel.

Be Well, Live Well.

Rosemary Thu Sep 23 15:20:21 PDT 1999

Hello everyone,

I live in south Texas and we've just had our first cool day in about four months and it's "WONDERFUL"

Rhoda, I'm not an expert but we have horses and I used to ride a lot. I have a friend who writes historical novels and I think I have helped her. I did suggest that the hero probably shouldn't put his stallion in a corral full of horses.

Good luck and e-mail me or whatever any time.

Avatar Thu Sep 23 15:02:54 PDT 1999

Um, *blush* I hate to break it to you, but I might not be able to get ALL of it in in time. I've already sent my first part to your neighbor and Rachel, but I will need a bit of time to complete it(curses the non-availability of internet). *wince* don't hurt me...(backs away from terrifying claws)
Am I going to die?


Rachel Thu Sep 23 14:23:55 PDT 1999

Allein - I just got over that nasty little bug, hope you feel better soon. I am looking forward to our visit. It should be fun (smiles)
Take care you!

Allein Thu Sep 23 13:44:22 PDT 1999

Jon - okay, I will work on that this weekend :) - I have a project due tomorrow plus all day tomorrow will be school so, I won't be able to work on it until Sat. and even that's debatable because I've just come down with the flu that everyone else at school has. I might skip school tomorrow, but if I do, it means I'm deathly ill and not feeling up to writing. I'm not feeling too bad right now, but, knowing how fast a virus can spread (I was exposed to it 3rd period and by 6th (about 2 hours later) I felt bad) I might be miserable by tonight.

Okay, here's more funnies incase I don't feel like posting them tomorrow.

Why A Man Can't Win

If you put a woman on a pedestal and
try to protect her from the rat race,
you are a male chauvinist.
If you stay home and do the housework,
you are a pansy

If you work too hard,
there is never any time for her..
If you don't work enough,
you are a good for nothing bum.

If she has a boring repetitive job with low pay,
this is exploitation.
If you have a boring repetitive job with low pay,
you should get off your rear
and find something better.

If you get a promotion ahead of her,
that is favoritism.
If she gets job ahead of you,
it's equal opportunity.

If you mention how nice she looks,
it's sexual harassment.
If you keep quiet, it's male indifference.

If you cry, you are a wimp.
If you don't, you are an insensitive bastard.

If you make a decision without consulting her,
you are a chauvinist.
If she makes a decision without consulting you,
she's liberated woman.

If you ask her to do something
she doesn't enjoy, that's domination.
If she asks you, it's a favor.

If you appreciate the female form
and frilly underwear, you are a pervert.
If you don't, you are a fag.

If you like a woman to shave her legs
and keep in shape, you are a sexist.
If you don't, you are unromantic.

If you try to keep yourself in shape, you are vain.
If you don't, you are a slob.

If you buy her flowers, you are after something.
If you don't, you are not thoughtful.

If you are proud of your achievements,
you are up yourself.
If you don't, you are not ambitious.

If she has a headache, she is tired.
If you have a headache, you don't love her anymore.

If you want it too often, you are oversexed.
If you don't, there must be someone else.

Love much,

Jon (the cat) Thu Sep 23 09:50:36 PDT 1999

I hate when someone interrupts my siesta, but since this was Allein... Here is an answer:

Hey, Allein: you still need to write your masquerade scene (at least). Do not forget!

The neighbour is still at sea. Some say he is preaching to the fish (like St Anthony, you know the legend for sure), but I start worrying. It is the first time he misses lunch!

I did not mind very much. I can eat any number of my friend's lunches... Anyway, I hope he does not miss dinner. That would be tragic. I cannot put on too much weight...

Allein Thu Sep 23 06:58:08 PDT 1999

Time for more useless info and funnies! (though, if you want to see some thing real funny, go to the biography page and look at my pic - boy is that funny!)

On an island in northern Wales there's a village called
(Just pronounce it as it's spelled.)

Two morons were working on a house.
The one who was nailing down siding would reach into his nail pouch, pull out a nail and either toss it over his shoulder or nail it in.
The other nut, figuring this was worth looking into, asked,
"Why are you throwing those nails away?"
The first explained, "If I pull a nail out of my pouch and
it's pointed TOWARD me, I throw it away 'cause it's defective. If it's pointed toward the HOUSE, then I nail it in!"
The second got completely upset and yelled, "You MORON!!! The nails pointed toward you aren't defective!
They're for the OTHER side of the house!!"

I locked my keys in the car and had to break the windshield toget my wife out.
-- Red Skelton

Allein Thu Sep 23 06:49:48 PDT 1999

Jon - I hope I've gotten all my stuff in. I put in the edited version of all the work I've done so far. I know Rachel's birthday is tomorrow. :) She's getting a special present from me when she comes down to visit. It'll be late, but I want to see the look on her face when she opens it. :)

Jon Thu Sep 23 03:08:07 PDT 1999

Woops : "he needs IT" (see below : even I can make grammar mistakes from time to time...)

JON (the cat) Thu Sep 23 03:06:23 PDT 1999

Jack : although extremely disappointed with the co-authors who have not sent him the final draft of their complete collaboration for "Shadows in a Dream" (they have until the end of THIS week, no more, to do what was asked from them), my neighbor asked me to ask you to please archive the notebook from 15 August to 18/19 September. He needs them to go on working on the "S" project.

JON (the cat) Thu Sep 23 03:00:12 PDT 1999

Good morning, everybody!

My neighbor has just gonna fishing, as he always does when he gets too pissed off with the world.

I have been packing and filing (he is thinking of going on a very long trip and wants me to join him).

I have been packing and I found something fascinating. RACHEL's BIRTHDAY WILL BE TOMORROW, the 24th (25th for the Aussies).

My neighbor is thinking of sending some people here packing as well. But he decided just to go fishing. I do not know if he will manage to kill all the fish until midnight. In case he does not, here is my happy birthday to Rachel in the name of all the family.

PS. It appears that there is a John here (with an h). Couldn't he be John the II or something, so that people would not confound this cat with that human?

Allein Wed Sep 22 22:04:57 PDT 1999

Yep! More funnies!

Overheard in a club this weekendGreat female comebacks to bad pickup lines:

Man: "Haven't I seen you someplace before?"
Woman: "Yeah, that's why I don't go there anymore."

Man: "Is this seat empty?"
Woman: "Yeah, and this one will be too if you sit down."

Man: "So, wanna go back to my place?"
Woman: "Well, I don't know. Will two people fit under a rock?"

Man: "So, what do you do for a living?"
Woman: "I'm a female impersonator."

Man: "Hey, come on, we're both here at this bar for the same reason."
Woman: "Yeah! Let's pick up some chicks!"

Man: "I know how to please a woman."
Woman: "Then please leave me alone."

Man: "I want to give myself to you."
Woman: "Sorry, I don't accept cheap gifts."

Man: "I would go to the end of the world for you."
Woman: "Yes, but would you stay there?"

Rhoda Wed Sep 22 21:25:53 PDT 1999


I have been trying to e-mail you, but something is wrong with my mailbox, so I can't send anything nor can I receive anything. My ISP has been making changes. Hopefully they are just working on it and it will be fixed by tomorrow.


Glad you decided to stick around.


I am enjoying seeing you post again. I missed reading your thoughts.


I am glad you decided to come back.

As for me, I have company so I haven't been able to do a lot of writing. Does anyone here write Westerns? If so I want to hear from you. Dealing with guns and horses seems really easy on John Wayne movies, but I now realize how little I know.

I read a book where an agent claimed that the western is on its way out. It is evidently a dying genre. Is this true? While there certainly not as many movies and television shows set in the old American West, there still seem to be many of them in the bookstores.

Well I must be running along.

Happy Writing!


Allein Wed Sep 22 18:39:23 PDT 1999

Rosemary - Ha, ha, you know, it's funny - I DO have a paper due on Friday - a poem analysis for creative writing. Of course, I'm only in high school, not college, but I'm sure some of those rules could apply to me too. :)

Mark Wed Sep 22 16:52:34 PDT 1999

Evening all,
Just logged on, thought I'd just show my face.
Lot's going on here tonight I might stick around for a while.

Rosemary Wed Sep 22 16:52:15 PDT 1999

Hello Everyone,

Gariess: You're right, I'm not new to the Notebook. I posted regularly a couple of years ago, then I moved and didn't get a new Internet Server for a few months. Finally I got back on-line but most of the regulars were gone and the new ones were busy. I've mostly just dropped in now and then to see what's going on since then.

I am not being critical, I absolutely love Allein's "funnies" but from her last post, I wondered if she has a paper due.

Allein Wed Sep 22 15:26:28 PDT 1999


How to Write a College Paper

1. Sit in a straight, comfortable chair in a well lighted place with plenty of freshly sharpened pencils.

2. Read over the assignment carefully, to make certain you
understand it.

3. Walk down to the vending machines and buy some coffee to help you concentrate.

4. Stop off at the third floor, on the way back and visit with your friend from class. If your friend hasn't started the paper yet either, you can both walk to McDonalds and buy a hamburger to help you concentrate. If your friend shows you his paper, typed, double-spaced,and bound in one of those irritating see-thru plastic folders,drop him.

5. When you get back to your room, sit in a straight, comfortable chair in a clean, well lighted place with plenty of freshly sharpened pencils.

6. Read over the assignment again to make absolutely certain you understand it.

7. You know, you haven't written to that kid you met at camp since fourth grade. You'd better write that letter now and get it our of the way so you can concentrate.

8. Go look at your teeth in the bathroom mirror.

9. Listen to one side of your favorite CD and that's it, I mean it, as soon as it's over you are going to start that paper.

10. Listen to the other side.

11. Rearrange all of your CDs into alphabetical order.

12. Phone your friend on the third floor and ask if he's started writing yet. Exchange derogatory remarks about your teacher, the course, the university, the world at large.

13. Sit in a straight, comfortable chair in a clean, well lighted place with plenty of freshly sharpened pencils.

14. Read over the assignment again; roll the words across your tongue; savor its special flavor.

15. Check the newspaper listings to make sure you aren't missing something truly worthwhile on TV. NOTE: When you have a paper due in less than 12 hours, anything on TV from Masterpiece Theater to Sgt. Preston of the Yukon is truly worthwhile, with these exceptions: a) Pro Bowler's Tour b) any movie starring Don Ameche.

16. Catch the last hour of Soul Brother of Kung Fu on channel 26.

17. Phone your friend on the third floor to see if he was watching. Discuss the finer points of the plot.

18. Go look at your tongue in the bathroom mirror.

19. Look through your roommate's book of pictures from home. Ask who everyone is.

20. Sit down and do some serious thinking about your plans for the future.

21. Open your door and check to see if there are any mysterious trench-coated strangers lurking in the hall.

22. Sit in a straight, comfortable chair in a clean, well lighted place with plenty of freshly sharpened pencils.

23. Read over the assignment one more time, just for the hell of it.

24. Scoot your chair across the room to the window and watch the sunrise.

25. Lie face down on the floor and moan.


25. Two words: whoopie cushion

24. Wear green lipstick and pinch everyone and tell them it's for "not honoring St. Patty". If they correct you to tell you it's not St. Patrick's day, whisper "Don't tell that to the leprechaun!" and slither away.

23. Call your boss "Sport" and "Slugger" for your entire last week.

22. Constantly eat hamburger. On your last day, "accidentally" leave hamburger meat on/in/near your desk.

21. Walk around quietly singing "Nobody loves me, everybody hates me, guess I'll go eat worms"

20. Play dead.

19. Sign all your emails "Disgruntled,"

18. Don't wear deodorant. If people act like you smell (because you do), tell them it's your new cologne "mordre" (French for "bite me").

17. Burn incense and if you're told it's against office policy to have something burning inside, say in an evil voice as you can muster, "Fine. YOU tell Buddha that!"

16. Send out very random one word emails to the whole staff like "banana" or "pancreas" or "transvestite". Nothing else. Just the one word. Do this about 3 times a day for a week, and if people tell you to stop, tell them it must be a bug in your system.

17. If you have a "kitchen" in your office, write "die" on the counter in blood. Just leave it there. Wear a prominent Band-Aid and look at everyone with a glare.

16. Come to work in slippers.

15. Wear white pants and thong underwear, even if you are a guy.

14. If you're lucky enough to have a board meeting your last week, squirm like you have to pee, but tell people it's those "pesky parasites"

13. . . .drink beer.

12. . . .wear a Burger King crown and sit with your eyes closed the entire time. Even when you're talking, don't open your eyes, but make facial expressions nonetheless.

11. . . .consistently hum one monotone note quietly but keep acting like you are really interested in the meeting. Take notes, nod, look around. If someone asks what the noise is, say "What noise?" and act just as curious as everyone else.

10. Tell your co-workers you now prefer to be called "Posh Spice" because it makes you feel worthwhile and sexy.

9. If you've been "let go", growl quietly every time you see your boss. Keep normal facial expressions and body movement.

8. Tell people you are engaged, and when they start congratulating you, say in a defensive tone with your hand on your forehead, "Stop pressuring me! I'll get married when I get married!".

7. Tell everyone that next week, you'll be living the "high life" as an astronaut.

6. Go to a costume shop and get a real looking fake wound. Plaster it to your face and tell everyone it was from "that ferret I just can't get rid of".

5. Place a teddy bear next to your computer on your desk. Frequently talk to it and kiss it.

4. Give a forwarding address in Katmandu.

3. One day, have a "flashback" and come to work dressed in 80's attire. Tell your office mates you really never thought the 80's died, they were just taking an extended leave.

2. If you're ever in the coffee room alone, and someone else comes in, ignore their presence and make loud cappuccino noises while you prepare your drink.

1. Stay.

philip Wed Sep 22 14:28:13 PDT 1999


GARY: thanks for the Shanghai lead. I remember the film and how the people spoke about the making of it in Shanghai (that's another story). I wonder if that book was based on the screenplay. I'll go to Amazon and have a look right now. Other than that, I haven't come across any that are set in Shanghai but will pass them on when I do.

HAYDEN: I'm pleased your going to get your hands on Ligtning Mine. More later on that.

I won't comment on Timor I get too pissed off on too many fronts.

Back soon - PHILIP

John Wed Sep 22 10:57:37 PDT 1999


I asked God to take away my pain.
God said, No
It is not for me to take away, but or you to give up.

I asked God to make my handicapped child whole.
God said, No.
Her spirit is whole, her body only temporary.

I asked God to grant me patience.
God said, No.
Patience is a by-product of tribulations; it isn't granted, it is earned.

I asked God to give me happiness.
God said, No.
I give you blessings. Happiness is up to you.

I asked God to spare me pain.
God said, No.
Suffering draws you apart from worldly cares and brings you closer to me.

I asked God to make my spirit grow.
God said, No.
You must grow on your own, but I will prune you to make you fruitful.

I asked God for all things that I might enjoy life.
God said, No.
I will give you life so that you can enjoy all things.

I asked God to help me LOVE others as much as He loves me
God said ....Aha!, you finally have the idea.

Americo Wed Sep 22 06:28:59 PDT 1999

Gary: here in Portugal we are very grateful to the UN International Force for having listened at last to our 24-year appeal for peace and independence in Timor Lorosae. The Australians are doing a good job and we acknowledge their effort to lead the International Force. We have been helping the cause of peace and independence in the most beautiful way I have ever seen, next to the 25th April 1974 revolution. No day goes by without a demonstration of some kind.

In order not to delay the urgent need to help the Timorese, our Government decided to comply with the Indonesians' demands that Portugal should not send troops to Timor IN THIS FIRST PHASE. (There will be two more phases). But the army and the navy are ready and waiting just for the green light from the UN. I do not think it will be needed. In the meantime Portuguese doctors and other people are already there to provide humanitarian assistance. Many more Portuguese will go to help reconstruct that country.

Here we only think about Timor Lorosae. We are living with a radio set in our hands and all the TV stations dedicate many hours to inform us of what is going on there. We are also in direct contact with the people in the mountains by means of cellular/satelite phones, etc. We talk and hear their cries every day, almost every moment. We are exactly on the other side of the planet in relation to them but we love them. Ruy Cinnaty, a great Portuguese poet and also a great friend of mine, went insane for some time when the Indonesians invaded East Timor in 1975, at a moment when Portugal was in shambles, in the middle of a revolution and unable to help. He recovered two or three years after his terrible depression, which took him to the streets to offer anyone poems he wrote about Timor. We talked for many hours about what a wonderful people the Timorese are. He taught me to love them very dearly.

Incidentally, the militias are basically Indonesian military men in disguise, perhaps with some true Timorese they frightened and forced to kill their brethren. The crux of the matter is now very clear: the former president of Indonesia, dictator Suharto, illegally possesses almost half of the East Timor territory. His faithful gunmen/military men possess almost the rest. They will not easily let go of their coffee plantations and the oil which is also in the territory ready to be explored.

However, as I said some weeks ago, this is no Vietnam. When all the Indonesian army withdraws from the territory, there will be no shooting or perhaps just sporadic incidents. What is difficult is to make sure that the Indonesian troops REALLY go away. The UN International Force will hardly have any problem to solve the situation.

I hope this is the beginning of a new world policy towards brutality and terror. No country, government, institution or group of people can be allowed to do any thing whatsoever against human rights. A World United Force should have the right to intervene whenever and wherever human lives and human rights are abused.

I believe that the notion of country does not make any sense before a much higher value: humanity, humanitarianism. That is why I tend to look with suspicion towards any manifestation of xenophobia or jingoism. Each of us should put in question one's own patriotism. If it means contempt for other peoples or a stupid sense of superiority based on earthly values it is wrong. If it is like the love we have for our father and mother AND for the fathers and mothers of the others it is right.

Thank you very much indeed for having asked.

Hayden Tue Sep 21 22:43:41 PDT 1999


Don't look up, good buddy. Just turn up the stereo and hope the battery lasts. I've sent out a tanker and it should be there soon, though it'll be full of beer rather than petrol. Help yourself. The second tanker is due in about a week...or so...depending on sales tax, import tax, Porsche tax etc. But I'm saving frantically.


I've ordered Lightning Mine from Dymocks, Belconnen and am looking forward to getting it. Should be here in about less than two weeks. It might be your third book, but the first one I've been able to get. Shaking with excitement :-)

All others, it's nice to return to the notebook now and then and see what real writers are doing :-)

Hayden (peddaling madly to get to Gariess with a water bottle before the hallucinations get too bad)

Gariess Tue Sep 21 21:56:00 PDT 1999


Great headlines, those. After reading things like "Iraqi Head Seeks Arms," I had to look twice at Rhoda's greeting to Philip: "It's good to see your post again." I have one of those in my front yard but no one has ever expressed any sentiment toward it, whatever.


Welcome home, friend. The Australia site is great. Excellent commentary and the pictures (even though they may be digital) are fine work. You have a way with the lens, my man. I would be happy to return from a trip with such good stuff.


My favorite work set in Shanghai is "Empire of The Sun." I don't recall the author right now, a British chap. They also made a very impressive film from the story. I'd like to know any material you can suggest as well. I also find the setting exotic. Although I haven't been to Shanghai, I spent a few years in other places in the East.


I am sorry about the loss your friend is suffering. I am sure you have been a comfort to him, perhaps even more than you may realize, now. I have lost all of my family to untimely deaths but for one, and my friends never meant more to me than at these times.

To Katarina and Rosemary,

I'm really happy to see you both here. I still am sure that I remember Rosemary from an earlier time. I get things wrong at times but it seemed someone noted Rosemary as a new-comer. Katarina, I did see a copy of the new Harris book in the supermarket, and I was short on cash. It was Hmm, Groceries or the book. The book... or the groceries. Let's see, put back the lamb chops and the... Well, I was hungry. I'll get the book next time.

Martin and Rachel,

I'll be answering my email soon. I get behind in that, probably because I spend too much time on Ebay and in the Notebook (The Notebook is much less costly.) My cats protest all the time I spend at the PC.

Folks, that's something to remember, Your time in the Notebook is the best value for your money. In fact, it's the best value for NO money that you can get, so stay around. The summer is over for some of us and the spring is starting for others. Maybe we can speak a bit about how the changing seasons makes us feel.


How about those Aussies? If you recall, I speculated that we (USA) might have a turn at holding Australia's coat. It seems we are to do that, more or less. Whatever works. We shall see.

To all Notebook friends,

It's great to see so many of you. Now that Jack, our good shepherd, is back to keep things in order for us we can look forward to a great new chapter in a manner of speaking. Good writing, everybody.

I know this is a long post but there are so many folks to speak to. A good omen for the Notebook, I should say.


I'm still sitting here in the Porsche waiting for fuel and water. I say, while I have your attention, old thing, you don't have buzzards in the Outback by any chance, do you? I have grave doubts about those big birds in the distance.


Allein Tue Sep 21 17:36:30 PDT 1999

Yep, more funnies! :)

Top Ten Reasons Eve Was Created

10. God was worried that Adam would frequently become lost
in the garden because he would not ask for directions.

9. God knew that one day Adam would require someone
to locate and hand him the remote.

8. God knew Adam would never go out and buy himself a new fig leaf when his wore out and would therefore need Eve to buy one for him.

7. God knew Adam would never be able to make a doctor's, dentist, or haircut appointment for himself.

6. God knew Adam would never remember which night to put
the garbage on the curb.

5. God knew if the world was to be populated, men would never be able to handle the pain and discomfort of childbearing.

4. As the Keeper of the Garden, Adam would never remember where he left his tools.

3. Apparently, Adam needed someone to blame his troubles on when God caught him hiding in the garden.

2. As the Bible says, It is not good for man to be alone!

And the #1 reason why God created Eve...

1. When God finished the creation of Adam, He stepped back,
scratched his head, and said, "I can do better than that!"

philip Tue Sep 21 15:51:51 PDT 1999

HELLO EVERYONE - my old writer friends and new visitors:

Sorry for long absences, I will try to get here a little more often.

What I've been concerned with lately is China. In my job I get to go to Shanghai every month for about a week. It's a fascinating place! I have fantasies about living there and writing. Maybe a full length novel. I've investigated the cost - $1,600 (US) for a year, room and board. You have to look about - I spend this in less than a week on my visits. I find it very exotic. Beckoning. Mmmm .......

My third book, Lightning Mine, is released and is selling well. I'm writing my fifth book presently, my publisher is a book and a half behind me.

But back to China. Does anyone know of any good novels by good authors - thrillers or any fiction - that are set in Shanghai?

A quick poll: do you prefer to read novels that are written in the first or third person?

Back soon - PHILIP

Martin Tue Sep 21 12:24:48 PDT 1999


There are good times
There are bad times
They come and go
leading nowhere to go

but forward...

My deepest sympathy


Rachel Tue Sep 21 07:28:01 PDT 1999

Hi all

Sqrl - Hi you - I have sent you a second e-mail. I was not sure how to send the file so you could open it. What I did was toss the text into the body of an e-mail. Let me know what you think. I'll be waiting for your reply.
Take care you

Arik - Are you still out there? If you are, how is the love thing going (smiles).

Take care all

Allein Mon Sep 20 20:46:50 PDT 1999

YES!! It's time for more funnies!

This could really happen .....
President Bill Clinton was visiting an elementary school today and when he visited a class in the middle of a discussion related to words and their meanings.
The teacher asked the President if he would like to lead the class in the discussion of the word, "Tragedy."
So our illustrious leader asks the class for an example of a "tragedy."
One little boy stands up and offers, "If my best friend,
who lives next door, was playing in the street and a car came along and ran over him, that would be a tragedy."
"No," says Clinton, "that would be an accident."
A little girl raises her hand. "If a school bus carrying 50 children drove off a cliff, killing everyone involved, that would be a tragedy."
"I'm afraid not," explains Mr. President. "That's what we would call GREAT LOSS."
The room goes silent. No other children volunteer.
President Clinton searches the room. "Isn't there someone here who can give me an example of a tragedy?"
Finally, way in the back of the room, a small boy raises his hand.
In a quiet voice he says, "If Air Force One, carrying
Mr. & Mrs. Clinton, was struck by a missile and blown up to smithereens, that would be a tragedy.
"Fantastic," exclaims Clinton, "that's right. And can you tell me WHY that would be a tragedy?"
"Well," says the boy, "because it wouldn't be an accident,
and it certainly would be no great loss."

Americo Mon Sep 20 17:33:02 PDT 1999

Eddie: a great hug to you on this sad occasion.

Rachel Mon Sep 20 16:48:37 PDT 1999

Eddie - I am saddened to hear about the loss of somebody close to you. It is good that you can be with your friend right now. I am sure that he appreciates this.
Take care you

Rhoda Mon Sep 20 16:45:04 PDT 1999


I don't know what to say. Ray is very fortunate to have a close friend at his side during this time. A friend in my bible study lost her teenage son two weeks ago in a car accident, and as someone from the outside looking in, I feel a tremendous sense of helplessness and hurt, because I want to ease the pain, but there is just no way to do it. My prayers go with Ray and his family.

Sqrl Mon Sep 20 16:43:42 PDT 1999

(I hate the idea of having to post like this, but I shall. I appologise before hand for the mixings of this post, for I know that I will not be able to check here again for a while.)

Rachel, Allein, and Rhoda,

HI! Sorry for not writing you gals. I've been busy with college crap and all. Plus . . . there's this guy at college ::grin::


I am truely sorry about your friends son. A few years ago I lost my bestfriend in a fire, a short time later, a guy that I had grown up with accidently shot and killed himself. So, I can empathise with you a great deal. If you wish to talk with someone, just e-mail me. (despite everything, I still check my e-mail on a regular basis)


Allein Mon Sep 20 16:18:34 PDT 1999

Eddie - I am so sorry to hear about your friend's son. I really can't think of anything to say. I've never had anyone close to me die before (there was that one kid in my class last year, but I wasn't really close to him). Anyway, my deepest sympathies to you and your friend. (((BIG HUGS)))
God Bless you all.

Eddie French Mon Sep 20 15:32:33 PDT 1999

Eddie French Mon Sep 20 15:30:20 PDT 1999

Hi all,
A sad day, I have spent most of the day with a dear friend who was informed by the police that his son had been killed just this morning while driving to work.
He left the house at 6am as usual. At 9am there was a knock on the door.....
What a horrible time. Some of you may remember Ray who posted here just once, about 9 months ago. (He is the father, not the victim)
It's time again for me to reflect upon my own mortality, as these times make one do so.
Sorry to bring such bad tidings to the notebook, but I know that we are all interested in what is happenning to each other. Even the bad things.

Rachel Mon Sep 20 14:08:57 PDT 1999

Hi all
Hey Rosemary, Katrina (big smiles)
Take care all

Katarina Mon Sep 20 12:21:28 PDT 1999

Jack: I had a chance this morning to look at the Austraila web page. The photos are breathtaking! Very nice. It sounds like your trip was enlightening. I have heard about the plight of the Aborigines, but do not have the full story.


ROSEMARY RCALIEN7@CS.COM Mon Sep 20 10:58:18 PDT 1999





Katarina Mon Sep 20 07:19:01 PDT 1999

Hi, everyone...

Why are Monday mornings so gruesome? And that is not a trick question...

Gary: Never answered you about "Hannibal"...yes, it is the sequel to "Silence of the Lambs". Harris is a good writer...very descriptive, especially about Italy.

Am reading another good one..."The Best Home Businesses for the 90's". My husband just started his own business and I am contemplating it too.

Allein - thanks for the new funnies!

Rachel - How are you? How are the kids?

I am trying to read up on the situation in Timor, so that I am more knowledgeable about what's going on...

Rhoda Mon Sep 20 06:42:20 PDT 1999

Jack and Fran,

Welcome back. What absolute fun you must have had. The web-page was stunning. I bet we missed you more than you missed us. You were simply too busy.


It is good to see your post again.


Where have you been? Don't stay away so long.


Allein Mon Sep 20 06:21:41 PDT 1999

Time for funnies!! :D

To survive, every bird must eat at least half its own weight in food each day...
...That'll make you think twice the next time someone says you eat like a bird.

Actual Headlines
Include Your Children when Baking Cookies
Something Went Wrong in Jet Crash, Expert Says
Police Begin Campaign to Run Down Jaywalkers
Safety Experts Say School Bus Passengers Should Be Belted
Drunk Gets Nine Months in Violin CaseSurvivor of Siamese Twins Joins Parents
Iraqi Head Seeks Arms
Is There a Ring of Debris around Uranus?
British Left Waffles on Falkland Islands
Eye Drops Off Shelf
Teacher Strikes Idle Kids
Clinton Wins on Budget, But More Lies Ahead
Enraged Cow Injures Farmer With Ax
Plane Too Close to Ground, Crash Probe Told
Miners Refuse to Work after Death
Juvenile Court to Try Shooting Defendant
Stolen Painting Found by Tree
Two Sisters Reunited After 18 Years in Checkout Counter
Killer Sentenced to Die for Second Time in 10 Years
War Dims Hope for Peace
If Strike Isn't Settled Quickly, It May Last a While
Cold Wave Linked to Temperatures
Deer Kill 17,000
Couple Slain; Police Suspect Homicide
Red Tape Holds Up New Bridges
Typhoon Rips Through Cemetery; Hundreds Dead
Man Struck By Lightning Faces Battery Charge
New Study of Obesity Looks for Larger Test Group
Astronaut Takes Blame for Gas in Spacecraft
Kids Make Nutritious Snacks
Ban On Soliciting Dead in Trotwood
Local High School Dropouts Cut in Half
New Vaccine May Contain Rabies
Hospitals are Sued by 7 Foot Doctors

A minister told his congregation, "Next week I plan to preach about the sin of lying. To help you understand my sermon, I want you all to read Mark 17."
The following Sunday, as he prepared to deliver his sermon,
the minister asked for a show of hands. He wanted to know how many had read Mark 17. Every hand went up. The minister smiled and said, "Mark has only 16 chapters. I will now proceed with my sermon on the sin of lying."

philip Mon Sep 20 05:18:54 PDT 1999

Sorry about the double posting Jack.


philip Mon Sep 20 05:14:49 PDT 1999

Hello Everyone:

Well, I can tell you that Jack and Fran survived the Sydney onslaught, the outback desert experience, the Great Barrier Reef underwater religious revelation and were returned to the good ole USA in one piece and good spirits.
Mind you, I'm not taking any responsibility for what they got up to in Melbourne.
And he'll have to tell you all what I mean by that. I really wasn't there.
We enjoyed having Jack and Fran as our house guests - they bunked in and became considerate visitors in our small Newport Beach house.
Lots of wine and Victorian Bitter beer was consumed and discussions about the universe. But we had to admit that, every night, we did solve the problems of humankind - and we did it by midnight because we were up by 6:30 am and off on our beachside, sunrise constitutional.
Fran and Jack ... great house guests and bright, intelligent people. We'd recommend them to anyone.

philip Mon Sep 20 05:13:58 PDT 1999

Hello Everyone:

Well, I can tell you that Jack and Fran survived the Sydney onslaught, the outback desert experience, the Great Barrier Reef underwater religious revelation and were returned to the good ole USA in one piece and good spirits.
Mind you, I'm not taking any responsibility for what they got up to in Melbourne.
And he'll have to tell you all what I mean by that. I really wasn't there.
We enjoyed having Jack and Fran as our house guests - they bunked in and became considerate visitors in our small Newport Beach house.
Lots of wine and Victorian Bitter beer was consumed and discussions about the universe. But we had to admit that, every night, we did solve the problems of humankind - and we did it by midnight because we were up by 6:30 am and off on our beachside, sunrise constitutional.
Fran and Jack ... great house guests and bright, intelligent people. We'd recommend them to anyone.

Hayden Mon Sep 20 01:30:30 PDT 1999

Welcome back Jack, and I was very disappointed that I missed you at the Con. As I posted earlier, I harassed just about every American fro Sat and Sun, but still failed to catch up with you. Britomart and I had a few moments together and she described you with such a glowing description that I was certain she must have met a reincarnated Elvis. :-)

How did you go with Philip?

hello to all others. And Gariess, we have to have a serious discussion on the merits of unleaded petrol in a high performance vehicle. (Sounds like a philosophy of life, doesn't it?)


Allein Sun Sep 19 18:20:57 PDT 1999

Rachel - Please e-mail me. I miss you. :(

Sqrl - ditto. :(


Rachel Sun Sep 19 18:14:39 PDT 1999

Eddie - Hi you

Sqrl - Well, hello you!

Eddie French Sun Sep 19 17:56:38 PDT 1999

Welcome home Jack.
I enjoyed reading about your trip.

Sqrl Sun Sep 19 17:51:17 PDT 1999


:-) I drop out of sight for a few and what happens?! Jack goes and archives the site! oh well! just wanted to stop in and say hi! :-)

luv yas

Americo Sun Sep 19 15:15:03 PDT 1999

Jack, me again.

I had not seen the second URL. It works. Beautiful pictures. You need to lose some weight. Four miles' walking a day, no less.

Americo Sun Sep 19 15:01:22 PDT 1999

The URL you mention on the Notebook must have some spelling problem. There is a message there asking people to inform you if that occurs, and this is what I am doing. I would very much like to know the feelings of the Australians about the East Timor tragedy but I could not get to the site you mention and gor that note instead.

Americo Sun Sep 19 14:54:36 PDT 1999

Jack: welcome back and give us news from Australia. I do not intend to post much until I finish the edit of "Shadows". This is still going to take a long time.

We have to think of strategies for my sending you the edited texts while keeping them reserved to the eyes of the co-authors only. Perhaps a slate with a password only given to the co-authors? This is because no publisher will accept the manuscript if it available in the Internet.

Well, you are probably tired from the long voyage and with the usual jet lag. Get some rest and we will talk later about the "Shadows" topic.

Greetings to Fran.

Rachel Sun Sep 19 09:56:19 PDT 1999

Jack - Welcome back!!!!!!!!!!
Take care you
Rachel Sun Sep 19 09:28:36 PDT 1999

Correction on the URL, try this one instead.

Jack Beslanwitch Sun Sep 19 09:23:52 PDT 1999

OK: I am sitting in San Francisco Airport and was finally able to ftp and grab a copy of the Notebook, all 380 some k, and replace it with this blank slate. I will archive the previous version sometime later today, but not on the floor of the airport via my ricochet modem. Do not know what has been going on on the Notebook for the last little while, but hopefully this will make it easy for people to get in.

Also, if you would like to see some of my thoughts on Uluru otherwise known as Ayer's Rock take a look at the link above.

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